More examples of children being brainwashed into a religion built on lies. Is it any surprise that so many of them learn to lie so well. Never mind the ones that are delusional for the rest of their lives. Those are just more crimes against humanity committed by religion.
*facepalm* I’m an atheist, too, but I don’t despise religion; I only despise those occurrences in which it is used for selfish purposes, or when someone tries to shove it down my throat. You are being extremely arrogant, and you are acting like the kind of atheist that religious people try to paint us all like. It’s really annoying, having to prove that I am considerate of benevolent faith…unlike you, evidently.
Anyone who’s reading this and who thinks he represents all atheists’ views…please don’t. There are tolerant people of all religions (or non-religions), if you look hard enough. 🙂
You, Julia, are the kind of accommodationist person that allows religion the freedom from questioning and criticism that permits it to perform it’s evils.
Tell me one thing I said that is not true. Provide independently verifiable evidence.
You’re not an atheists, you’re just too lazy intellectually to take sides and are choosing the path of least resistance.
If you think I do not represent the majority of atheist views, read some Richard Dawkins, Hitchins, or anyone else with the intellectual honesty to speak the truth. Try going to some atheist web sites. A quick search will give you more than you can have time to read.
I think I do not represent your views and I am proud of that. But you are arrogant to say you represent most atheists. Please don’t project your own failings on others.
Ok, so i’m going to preface this with the fact that I am most likely never going to come back to this site (found it on stumble) so i won’t be able to respond to all of your wonderful replies.
-However-
Who cares what others think? Who cares what others choose to believe? Mr. James, does it truly matter to you what others believe? You say that religion has committed evils, however, millions of crimes are committed each year, for reasons besides religion, by religious folk, and atheists alike.
Yes, religion should be questioned and scrutinized. that is the only way we can learn for ourselves, and the basis of science IS questioning everything.
You also state that Bill and Julia are intellectually lazy atheists, implying that you believe yourself to be an intellectual. As such, i am going to go ahead and assume that you are a bit of a scientist yourself. If so, then you know that along with questioning everything, you must also enter each test and scrutiny with an open mind. Aristotle once said that it is the mark of a great mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. Without an open mind and a quizzical brain, how can we learn anything else? Instead of looking at this with hate, look at it as a possibility.
No matter who you are, you must admit that religion, whilst it brings great evil, also provides a model for humans to follow in bettering ourselves and our species. Besides, others views are not failings, they are simply what they are called, their views.
Let others think what they will, and you think what you will.
And Julia,
Instead of saying that he does not represent your views specifically, let him have his views. He believes what he wishes, and that’s that. Instead of saying how your view’s differ, show. Don’t say that he is arrogant or selfish, but write what you believe or the qualities you wish to embody.
To both of you,
Now, chances are, both of you will disagree with what i said, and that is perfectly okay. I prefer that you do, if you read it enough to disagree with it then that means that you are thinking about what i typed. Entertain the things i typed, however scrutinize them before you choose to accept them or to dismiss them.
Differing views are the basis of mankind and of all intelligence.
As I see so often, you only read what you want to think, not what is there. I never said I care what others think or believe. I only care when they try to force their beliefs upon me. Theists always do that by trying to pass their delusions into laws for everyone.
Anyone can have any view they want. I could not care less. But when they insist I share those beliefs and demand they be the law of the l;and and taught in the schools, then they affect me. If someone wants to rub blue mud in their navel while chanting nonsense syllables, it doesn’t matter to me until the insist I do the same.
If they do not believe in gay marriage, divorce, contraception, consuming alcohol, or anything else, What does that matter to me? Nothing until they demand I “respect” their religion and practice the same things and refrain from pointing out they are silly, delusional, and counter-productive.
Religion provides a model for humans to better themselves? How? By genocide, murder, rape, and destroying entire civilizations including plants and animals?
I never said I represented the views of anyone else. I did say the writings of Dawkins, Hitchins, and others indicate that a lot of people do think as I do.
I do a lot of reading and visiting sites on the internet. I see that many, if not most, atheists think more like I do than those who do not.
I personally do not care what anyone thinks or says. All I care is that they do not inflict those views arbitrarily. If someone can produce independently verifiable evidence and through facts and logic sway others to their position, more power to them. But if they demand compliance without proof, then they are dictatorial and should be resisted.
I am sure many will disagree with the following. To date no one has been able to dispute that even one word is not true. I wonder why that is? If someone offered me positive proof of something I would have to change my thinking, no matter how much I disagreed with it originally. That’s called science. When new facts are discovered, science happily adjusts its thinking and knowledge is advance. For example, it was once believed that blood did not circulate but was consumed by the stomach. Better tools (microscopes) revealed capillaries and the circulation of blood. Medical science changed when proof was presented. I would change too if proof were presented. I’m not holding my breath, though.
Most of the problems of the world are, and always have been, caused by religion. For example, Northern Ireland, the Middle East, 9/11, and family planning clinic bombing in the USA. Then there were the crusades, the inquisition, witch burnings, and the dark ages. Get the idea?
Humanity will never truly be free until the black yoke of religion is lifted by the clear light of truth and rational thinking.
Would you quit with the atheist bit? We get it you don’t believe in god. But do you really have to be an ass about something little kids did. It was funny and cute. You’re allowed to believe what you want and i have no problem with that. But your a grown man. Act like it.
Whether or not God, Jesus, or even Big Foot exists may never truly be known, but James Smith João Pessoa, Brazil here is absolute proof that trolls are real!
Way to go James!
You can troll this comment all you want dude, I just stumbled upon these cute little kids’ silly notes and tried to see some sweet comments about them but instead got trollapalooza here.
Man, if you don’t like it then don’t read it, hit the Stumble button on the top left hand of your screen. Sounds like you’re the only one trying to push your agenda on anyone. No body seems to care, in fact, they’re just trying to get you to stfu. Now I’m so annoyed at your ignorance that I’m participating-gah! The troll wins!
And dude, you keep saying you don’t care, but if you really really didn’t care you wouldn’t keep the argument going. You can spout your “knowledge” all day but you still make yourself look like an idiot.
This reply is supposed to be directed to James, but for some reason the reply button isn’t on his comment, anyways.
Religion itself isn’t responsible for the things you blame it for, that was orchestrated by cruel people who used other peoples belief in religion as a tool to motivate them into such brutal acts. Things like this have been done in other situations. An excellent example of this is the Holocaust, yes, I realize that was a persecution of the Jews but it wasn’t based on their religion. It was a persecution of the Jewish race as a people rather than a religious group. Denying good aspects of religion is as much pulling the wool over your own eyes as blindly accepting it is. I myself am an Agnostic, (say I’m lazy in my thoughts I dare you). Further more, quoting authors as sources is a fairly questionable action, I can point you to many books written in all seriousness that claim the earth is flat or the center of the universe and other such ridiculous ideas. This does not make them fact. In fact, I believe you and yours as much a problem for humanity as those with intense religious fervor. YOUR NOT HELPING! I quite like this paragraph though, “If they do not believe in gay marriage, divorce, contraception, consuming alcohol, or anything else, What does that matter to me? Nothing until they demand I “respect” their religion and practice the same things and refrain from pointing out they are silly, delusional, and counter-productive.” They demand you refrain from pointing out how silly, delusional and counter-productive it is? Awwh, poor you. Not allowed to voice your opinion about people who you think shouldn’t be allowed to voice their opinions. THAT is dictatorial my friend.
As for Tolerance, I approve of your message but I don’t really approve of your view. This goes for James as well. Technically speaking Atheism is a non-scientific approach, in science we have many theories but most never go past that. String theory is a great example, it’s the scientifically accepted idea but without proof it remains a theory rather than fact. The existence of God is much the same. without scientific proof of the existence of a supreme being an intellectual would disregard it, but without proof that their is no supreme being a true intellectual would, in fact, be forced to accept both possibilities. Science is about finding truth, in the way our universe works, it does this by accepting every view until proof is provided.
Like Tolerance I highly doubt I will ever see this page again as I too enjoy stumble.
“but without proof that their is no supreme being a true intellectual would, in fact, be forced to accept both possibilities. ”
There is no such thing as proof of nonexistence. That doesn’t make any sense!
By your own logic, you are forced to admit to the possibility that dragons, fairies, wizards and my magical elf friend, Marvin, whom I just made up, exists. It’s okay though, without proof of nonexistence you’re forced to admit that his existence is possible. Seems, as a true intellectual, you’re forced to admit the possibility of a lot of wrong things. A true intellectual, such as yourself, has to admit that it’s possible your philosophy of “possibility until proof” is flawed.
Do you understand that, in your eyes, calling something “fiction” is unscientific?
Also, your argument isn’t exactly a new one, though you haven’t taken it quite as far as logic would dictate. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_in_a_vat for the full implications of your argument.
I agree with you completely. I just stumbled upon this website and find some man bashing the faith of others just because of a few notes from children. First he goes off on how he doesn’t want people’s faith being jammed down his throat, meanwhile nobody is doing so. It’s honestly idiotic. Oh and Jamess, I hope you understand that whoever read your comments and paid attention to your drivel for 5 seconds of their time will forget about you even faster. You are forcing your radical athiest values down OUR throats. You are merely a jugemental man with too much time on your hands. Do you really know us enough to assume that we are people that you should attack? I happen to agree with some of your values, why can’t you just be civil? You’ll probably respond to this with as much hate as you have to everyone else. I guess some people just cant admit when they’re wrong.
Thank you; I’m still formulating my own opinions and debating skills, and while I am certain that I believe differently than James here, I will try to use “I” instead of “we” in my debates.
I am an Atheist and I respect everyone’s views, but, in retrospect of things, isn’t Atheism technically a religion too?
“Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and moral values.” Wikipedia on religion.
GOD, in my view is an acronym standing for Group.Of.Disciples.
a group of people who believe a common thing. For example, people who are Christians follow the text in the Bible, Jewish believe in the writings of the Tanakh, Muslims in the Qur’an,etc. Atheists have moral values based on science, which Means Atheism is a “Religion”. Now, you might not agree to this which is fine because, like I said, “I respect everyone’s views”, but I am just giving you a different standpoint upon the situation.
Why can’t people just hold their beliefs and allow others to believe what they want? I can understand if someone is trying to force a belief down your throat or belittle others for their beliefs, as James is doing, but other than that where is the love? No matter what you believe happens after you die, we should all try to get along while we are alive. And James, it is you who acts arrogant, dismissive, and an all-around jerk.
DUDE! JAMES! Mad kudos! Seriously, you keeping this trolling up for so long and no ones figured out that you are legitimately trolling 😛 That was great, made my day.
Other people! Don’t feed the troll with your tolerance, it’s what he wants. Ignore him, and he will get confused and go away.
I have a really hard time taking anything you’re saying seriously because you can’t spell or use proper punctuation.
Exhibit A: “It’s” – I think you meant the possessive form, “its.”
Exhibit B: “you’re not an atheists” True, it’s impossible for one person to be multiple of anything, even atheists.
It is so embarrassing when idiots try to speak on behalf of atheists. No wonder believers don’t take us seriously.
I have a really hard time taking anything you say seriously because you evade the central issues and focus on trivialities such as typos. That is a typical theist tactic, though. When you have no answers or logical replies, deny, delay, and distract. If all of that fails, pretend the issue was never raised and declare “Victory through the power of “…”. (insert name of deity here)
YOu claim to be an atheist? You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.
In my entire life, every time I have been cheated, taken advantage of, or otherwise treated badly, it has been by a “good christian”. Yes, I know that all christians are not like that. I personally know some and count them as friends. We have simply agreed to disagree and value each other for qualities of honesty, courtesy, and kindness. But if you were consistently abused by red-headed people, even though you knew some were good folks, wouldn’t you be a bit wary of red heads?
@James I find it rather amusing then you said this:
“YOu claim to be an atheist? You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.”
Becuase religion really has little to do with the fact if a person is an all around jerk, narrow minded, arrogant, dismissive ect.
YOU chose yourself how you treat others and there are many different influences in your life that will cause you to act as such.
For example, you noted how any time you were “done wrong” was in fact by a christian- which gives you a pretty negative response towards religion itself because that is what you’ve linked these situations with.
when you sit there and group a specific religion to be “arrogant, dissmissive of others, and an all around general jerk” you probally shouldn’t turn around and act the same.
yes, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and practices ect. you say this, yet contridict yourself.
i didnt bother reading through this whole conversation, because i can see that anything that is to be said, you have some long remark to shoot back-in my eyes “pushing your beliefs” ontop of all others.
this is meant to be a cute little snipit into the minds of children and how cute they can be. this shouldnt have to turn into a religious battle.
yes i say to each his own, im not anything that anything you have said is wrong. im simply saying everyone is going to have a different opinion and there comes a point where theres not much point in continueing to push that one side is more right then the other.
Emily, you would do well to follow your own advice. YOu give no proof, you just parrot a statement that sounds cute to you without bothering to think if it is applicable. But that’s what theists do. Parrot what they’ve been told and never engage in logical thought.
Also typical of theists, you try to get any dissenters to just shut up. You don’t want to hear it so you want to suppress it. Take your own advice and just remain silent before you look worse than you do now.
I agree, James should have left after his first comment. Actually, he should not have left a comment at all. These are little notes kids are writing to God. Nobody is forcing anything on you as you stated above
“As I see so often, you only read what you want to think, not what is there. I never said I care what others think or believe. I only care when they try to force their beliefs upon me. Theists always do that by trying to pass their delusions into laws for everyone.”
Relax dude. The only reason anyone wants you to shut up is because nobody cares about your argument on this particular site. There was no need for your initial rant and certainly no need for you to continue calling people parrots and what not.
Now, I think those are really funny kids notes. Especially the one from Larry!
this is so cute weather or not you people hate religeon or not. i am not very old and i am not sure to believe in god or not. but no matter what this is just cute
You dug yourself into quite a hole, buddy. I would recommend this, in the nicest way possible: Just stop talking.I personally don’t find this evil or wrong, it’s just little kids,their funny letters,and their different ways of thinking(or at least how i interpret it).
However, I am very impressed with how much you have written in these comments. A lot of words,is all I can say about that. And maybe you shouldn’t rant about the evils of religion on the internet.Try finding people who will agree with you and rant to them or else all you will get is an endless debate. Let’s face it, just because you say these things,people will probably not change their minds, and vice versa(they certainly have not changed your mind).
Yep, another “just shut up” person pretending “It’s for your own good”.
Maybe you shouldn’t tell other people what to do. Are you now the internet Nazi with power over everyone? I doubt that.
If you were had read and understood what I have posted, you would have noticed I have said that “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.”
The only one I have hope of reaching are those who already have started to question what they have been told. “True believers” will never question anything. Religion has always been sheltered from criticism. That is stopping. Maybe someday religions will be required to be responsible for paying their own taxes, be truly qualified to counsel others, required to have teaching credentials to work with children, and all of the other things everyone else must do but religions get a free ride.
I couldn’t care less about the endless argument. It’s amusing to see how they are all the same thing. Accusations without proof. Attempts to distract from their failures to address the issues by introducing trivial topics such as typos.
Yes, I have pointed out those kind of mistakes in others, but it has been a minor thing “en passant”. I don’t pretend it is the most important issue there.
Seriously, what would be the point of “preaching to the choir”? Only posting where people will agree with you doesn’t make any sense. I do sometimes post a short message of encouragement to people on atheists site. Especially to someone that is just “coming out” as an atheist and is having a difficult time with people. It’s important for them to know that they are not alone.
I had no such support and went through years of discrimination and alienation, even from my own parents. I think of Damon in Louisiana who received even worse for reminding his high school that faculty-led prayer was illegal. He is fortunate to not be physically assaulted. I’ve been there myself. Theists do persecute people for non-belief. Then they try to play the persecution card themselves if anyone dares disagree with them. I’ve seen it on here.
Am I hard-nosed and sometimes obnoxious? Yes, I am. Accommodation does not work with religion. To them accommodation and surrender are the same thing. I will never surrender and I will never back down. Everyone can take that to the bank.
Dude, I’m a 14 year old. Don’t be so mean. I was just suggesting. I know very well that I can’t control people. I WAS SUGGESTING. I didn’t mean to offend you, I WAS SUGGESTING. and of course I didn’t read everything you said in the other comments. I could read a novel in that time.
And I am truly sorry you had a tough time with your parents and with other people. That’s not right for them to do that.I know, even if I did something really bad, my parents would support me, and it’s not right that your parents didn’t support you .
I know people can be annoying and mean and rude, but they can also be pleasant, kind, and polite. And fine, I get it, spread the word, but maybe this web page of little children’s letters to god isn’t the best place.
and you know what? I’m selfish, it’s not “just for your own good”, I don’t like how you’re being mean to people and insulting them and implying that they are stupid and brainwashed.That’s not right.
I’m really sorry you’ve been hurt,badly, but that gives no excuse to whine on the internet, like, well, a 14 year old teenage girl. I love God, but I know better than to try to tell that to people on the internet( great i just did.). Not being face-to-face with the people gives us such stubborness! And we cannot persecute you on the internet, unless we decide to find out where you live and go after you, but only whackjobs would do that.
There are mentally ill(or overzealous) people everywhere, whether they be muslim, christian, or atheisist, and they will do whatever is possible to prove their beliefs and punish those who don’t. Just because you have met people who persecute you for your beliefs doesn’t mean that everyone will. I have friends, best friends, from all walks of life, but i wouldn’t have them if I acted like this to them, if I implyed that they were stupid and brainwashed. They are kind good people and that’s all that matters.Once again, have a nice day.
I know you’re probably going to defend yourself again, because I admit I did say some things I probably shouldn’t but I just couldn’t stand how you were treating them. I wish you wouldn’t be so quick to judge. I know I’m making this personal, but you made this personal too. I hope someday that you’ll be happy. Maybe you should talk to someone about the anger you have. It helps me. I don’t think I’m going to comment again.
You do well with your words at your age and you show patience that many here have not, even though the words may offend you just as much. Keep that quality, it will serve you well.
Nobody will ever want to hear that they are brainwashed. The terrorists who bombed the WTC would not have wanted to hear that nor would they have believed it. Yet it is obvious that they are brainwashed, and it is further obvious that the results were disastrous.
You must understand, if his posting of his opinion on this website is offensive, then he can claim the very same of you. From his standpoint, your refutation of what he believes should be just as offensive as his refutation of your beliefs is to you.
Another thing, do you think your parents would support you if you told them you were atheist? It would be an interesting experiment to try out. I was unpleasantly surprised by parents reaction.
James, aren’t you doing exactly what you criticize religion for? Firstly, you are shoving atheism down people’s throats in the way that you comment and respond. Clearly this website has religious themes, if that bothers you then why visit it. Also, the humor is deeply rooted in the innocence of children. What they have written isn’t a sign of brain washing, it is a sign of a lack of knowledge. As adults they will inevitably get to a point where they will question their views and either follow your belief system or they will seriously consider their faith and return to it without the blind faith they had before (hopefully they will stop to think at least). Secondly, you portray a blind hatred for religion and historically that is what has led to the evil acts that religion has carried out. I agree with you that religious morals (like about gay marriage and abortion) should not be enforced by the law and should be an individuals right to choose, however aren’t there certain morals that we should all follow (i.e., do not kill). The problem with trying to separate a religious moral perspective from the law entirely is that for ages people have utilized religion as a guide for what is right and wrong.
I completely agree that people should not try to shove religion down other peoples throats. Sometimes us theist believe that we are sharing something wonderful (to us) with the world. I agree that sometimes that is most definitely not the case. But perhaps you have been met with so much hostility because you express hostility in your rhetoric? May be you should take a step back and evaluate whether or not you are doing exactly what you dislike about religion. People shouldn’t attack your opinion, but maybe you shouldn’t be so quick to judge either.
Wow take a chill pill. If you havn’t got a chill pill, take a chill strip. Stick it under your tounge, it dissolves: Chilled. I think someone is habouring issues of repressed anger. Have to tried yoga?
I see someone that is so arrogant they think they can tell anyone else how to behave, what to say, think, and do.
I have said repeatedly, what someone chooses to believe makes no difference to me. Only when they try to force those beliefs on my by making them the force of law, is it a problem. In no case have I ever advocated making atheism the law.
When anyone objects to someone else pointing out the fallacies in their beliefs, what they are really doing is suppressing free speech so they can continue to advance their beliefs above common sense.
Am I angry? Yes, I am angry that children are permitted to die of curable diseases so their parents can “pray for them”. I am angry when religions do not pay their share of axes and that their followers are permitted to be excused from taxes they give to those religions. That increases the burden on the rest of us.
I am angry when religions force their views into law and restrict the legitimate activities of others because they don’t agree with them.
I am angry when people are discriminated against because of the beliefs, lack of beliefs, sexual orientation, or skin color.
I am angry when, to promote their religion, lies are told, truth denied, and rational thought forbidden.
I am angry when family planning clinics are bombed and doctors murdered because some religious zealot thinks “God told him to do it.”
It it’s wrong to be angry over those things, I’d like a rational explanation of why that is.
@james
If you could have any theist say what you want them to say with out going against what they believe what would it be. Because a lot of what your doing is bashing other people’s statements and intelligence and it seems to me that if you said “I agree” with this or that people would agree with what you have to say more often. From a neutral standpoint you do seem to come off as a little…. Maybe a lot radical and if people see you become less radical they will be more likely to agree with you. I see it all the time as a debater in high school. I write this with the intention of helping your public reception so please don’t bash me. As a catholic we are called to LOVE others and thats what I’m trying to do. Don’t take it the wrong way as I could see myself doing if I was in your shoes. Last thing, please answer the first question I’m very curious
I am a 16 year old girl, I am a christian. and James I do not think it is wrong to be angry over things. I am a person who can be somewhat obnoxious myself, and i am a person who can get quite angry over things, trivial or not. Not to long ago, I was a child myself (I’m still one sometimes 🙂 ) blatantly accepting the religion my parents had. I have been challenged over the years with abuse problems from peers (but who hasn’t) It wasn’t until I had suicide thoughts that I realized I had issues…I knew it was wrong for my religion to do so. now, I get my strength from God. i do not have proof of anything, unless you take the fact that I know in my heart that what I think my religion is, I believe that to be true, with all my heart :). I am sorry you have had a bad past, and glad you have friends now who accept you. I don’t think it matters if you think differently than others who share you religion or no religion, or if you think differently than people who do not share their religion with you. If you can look past the religion you believe to be objectionable or look past the fact that some people have tried to force their religion on you, you might find that there are some people who can accept you for who you are and not for the religion you pose to have (this is not really directed at you James, and I am not trying to offend anyone, it’s just that I have an opinion on this topic that I would like heard…I’m not trying to force this on anyone, you can read it if you want) Sorry to offend anyone! :/
Sorry same girl here, but I would just like to say to James specifically, I understand that you have said you do not care what other people believe in, only when they try to force it on you…maybe if you tried to understand-understand not accept- their religion, they will graciously extend the same to you!
James, I’m tired of seeing you on websites Stumbleupon brings me to. If I have to read one more comment about your hateful take on life, I’m spamming everything you type. Why don’t you get a job, maybe a friend who’s willing to put up with you even if you have to go so far as to pay them, and please go away. That is all.
Tell us all, who is it that’s making you read them?
You don’t know a damn thing about me. Nor do you know anything about my outlook on life.
You admit you are going to be a spammer. Are you proud of that? Do you think that will win you friends?
I don’t need a job, I am successfully retired form several careers. I have more friends that you will ever have.
I’ll tell you what. Let me fly you here.
Let’s see how brave you are when you have skin in the game? You are a coward and an admitted spammer. To admit being a spammer on the internet is either an act of great courage, even hiding behind a fake name, or incredible stupidity. I already know you have no courage except to tell people to shut up when hiding behind you keyboard. So come on, confront me, asshole. I will love it.
Your post proves that, if you are really an atheists, that ignorant, senseless replies are not the exclusive property of theists.
Yes, you are an asshole.
Like the rest of the people with moronic replies, you ignore the issues and do not even try to disprove one word I have posted. That’s the evidence that you are a fool, an idiot, and an asshole.
You receive no respect because you have earned none. You have earned contempt and derision. You have plenty of that from me and any other thinking person.
“He doesn’t represent OUR views…”? I was not aware that you had been authorized to speak for anyone else, much less whomever “our views” might be. And I was called arrogant for expressing only my views. I see I have much to learn about being arrogant.
Today James ignored the valuable lesson of minding his own fucking business. You don’t believe in religion, meaning none of this actually matters to you so why even care what other people believe. Either they made a wrong decision or they didn’t. But what do you care. And maybe some less than appropriate actions have taken place due to religion. Again what do you care? So let them be happy and get off your high horse. Now see this is where youre going to point out my hypocrisy in that Im yelling at you. See thing is i am religious and feel as though something does happen, so other peoples lives, the ones annoying do matter to me because i believe something will eventually happen to them. Aint the religious excuse grand????
@Stumblin When were you appointed to be a Web Nazi to tell everyone else what to do? Take your own advice and mind your own business.
If you didn’t have a huge comprehension deficit, you would have noted that I have said many times, what others believe is not important to me. It’s when they try to pass those belief into law and restrict my freedom of speech thought, and action that it matters. Unfortunately that’s exactly what religion, all religions do. It’s what I see here and everywhere.
Yes, the religious excuse is grand. It saves you from having to think. That’s clearly way too much trouble for you. Or perhaps it’s simply outside your capabilities?
Admitting you’re religious is the confessing that you have never had an independent thought about it in your life. I don’t care about that. Just keep your beliefs out of the voting booth and on here, STFU. That’s what you’re telling me. When you do that, you give the right to others to do it to you. Even better, is it OK if I vote separation of church and state into the law? Oh wait, the founding fathers already did that. Maybe you haven’t heard of the Constitution? I recommend it as reading material.
I also recommend reading the bible. Read dispassionately, it is the best antidote to christianity available. It’s far better for that than even Dawkins or Hitchins.
First off I’d like to apologize for being such a cocky, overgeneralizing, fifth-grade drama queen for the past few weeks. It all started off when I tried to confuse the innocence of a child with dramatic terms like ‘evil Christian theist arrogant brainwashing blah blah blah I’m a whinny bitch’. Then I went on to pretend a majority of atheists are as big of douchebags as I am by citing authors who do NOT share the same attitude. I try to say religion is all about genocide and hate even though those things are more human nature and I, the atheist, am the only one spreading animosity on this site that was meant to be a jovial list.
So again, I apologize for being a fallacious and ignorant person riddled with self-loathing and contempt and immaturity. I will probably go pretend I’m the better man and hate you all. and play with my tiny weiner.
To the cowardly asshole that posted under my name. You hide behind a fake, stolen ID to say things that only show what an ignorant jerk you are.
Do you really think your stupid comments fooled anyone but yourself? If you do, you are even more stupid than you sound.
You are the only person on here that I would love to meet face-to-face. You would either apologize or have a life-changing experience. You are the only coward here that has actually made me angry.
BTW, you semi-literate imbecile. Learn how to make paragraphs. You’re making theists look bad. I know plenty that are intelligent, well-educated, and are not afraid to use their own names. You will never fit any of those categories, will you?
James no one was pushing religion down your throat. You found this website and decided to comment. This whole discussion is pointless and in the end everyone will still disagree.
Who cares: You are not correct. I have religion forced at me all the time and people on here have tried it, too. Just read the ones that say, “I’ll pray for you” or “I hope you find Jesus” or “Read the Bible”.
Agreed, it is pointless to try to reason with people that have rejected reason, truth, and rational thinking in favor of a delusional belief in a non-existent deity. That doesn’t mean anyone has to surrender their right of free speech or to not respond when people address you.
Religion is pushed upon people every day and in many ways. Religious people make every attempt to stifle dissenting statements as they have done on here. Whenever an atheist group puts up a billboard or a sign on the side of a bust with something relatively innocuous such as “Good without God? Millions are” they do everything possible to force those statements to be removed. If an atheist group tried the same thing with their proselytizing, imagine the outrage.
Keep in mind that not one person has proven anything I have posted is not true. They have just been outraged that I said it. That should tell anyone a lot about what is really happening.
James…I’m just going say it this way. You seem like the type of person that needs a lot attention so you act like a grade A douche bag and you think that you are the best thing since sliced bread. You may have a high IQ (that’s just a guess) but act like you have the personality of a mix between a cast member of Jersey shore and a used condom. You take something that’s supposed to be funny then try shoving your views down others peoples throats(that’s actually kinda funny, yet sad, because you bitch and complain when “the evil christans” speak there minds) like anyones gives a flying fuck who you are or what crap you want to spew from your dirty asshole you call a mouth. Btw! Guess what!?!? I won’t be returning to this website to read what ever half assed rebuttal you might come up with. So enjoy responding to no one 😀
James… I was not saying that you do not get religion get pushed down your throat in general, but you choose to read this site and you choose to react. I completely agree that “Christians” would throw a fit if an atheist billboard were put up, but being a christian I can say that I do not agree with all the so called “Christian” advertisements. The main point is that you just agreed that this discussion is pointless so why respond to every one who disagrees with you. You absolutely have freedom of speech, one of the many virtues of our country, another is freedom of religion or lack there of, meaning I should not prosecute you for your beliefs nor should you prosecute me for mine.
How can you say that she can’t speak for theists beliefs when you have been arrogantly making blanket generalizations about the behaviors and tendencies of an entire group of people; most likely due to a few bad experiences with trying to be converted, which happens to plenty of people! You were saying that someone was “acting like a Theist.” That kind of ignorance is disgusting–placing those who believe in G-d at a lower place then you and assuming that they are all redneck, ignorant, uneducated buffoons just because they’ve given themselves over to the whole “G-d” thing.
Do you realize that by so fiercely arguing your atheism and putting others down for holding different beliefs or for being “lazy atheists,” you are doing exactly what you claim to despise about religion–trying to force yours down people’s throats, claiming your belief is “the truth” when the fact remains that nobody can possibly know the truth until death comes, at which point they will no longer be able to communicate that truth with the living world (according to my beliefs, which do not include communication with the dead)? Some religions claim it is the believer’s duty to try to convert others, which is where things get uncomfortable, as I believe we should realize the truth is unknowable, and we should therefore believe what we may but understand when others believe differently. And I am dumbfounded by the fact that you chose a website with children’s letters to start this argument. Children have many choices made for them by their parents, and they can choose to learn about other things when they are older, and neither they nor their parents should be criticized for following the trend of making religion a part of the family values. It’s like criticizing both the parents and children for what haircut the 5-year-old has or for the diet of the household. If a child finds it doesn’t suit them later on in life, it is their choice to learn about other theories or to come up with their own. I’m sure you had a similar choice in your lifetime, though if your parents did force atheism upon you, I don’t see how your argument works at all. Hating on religion, in my opinion, is as detrimental to a peaceful world as religions hating other religions is.
Well, I’m definitely not gonna come back here at any time and read any following comments, but I do want to get into the discussion a little.
It’s pretty ridiculous that James is such a dumb Troll that he’s spent what is clearly HOURS on this simple post meant to be humorous debating something that I bet very few of us even give a shit about. I, for one, stopped reading his comments pretty early on, not worth my time at all, I have better things to do than truly go through this worthless troll’s comments.
Believe what you want, and feel free to express those views, but I’m pretty certain damn near everyone who’s read these comments just thinks you’re a FUCKING TOOL. Call me immature or whatever you will, but seriously, you’re wasting your time fighting a battle nobody cares about.
James, we all have our beliefs, and are certainly entitled to them, but you’re just such a dick about yours that nobody’s going to take you seriously. If you want to make a point, try not being a douche, but that seems pretty hard for you. At least you made this page even more entertaining than the mildly funny letters for which it was made.
Again, I’ll never be back here, so feel free to waste your time responding, or don’t, but just know that I, in the very least (and probably a number of others here) just think you’re a GIANT DOUCHE.
🙂 Have a good one, troll.
why do people think this is written by children? these are old jokes that someone wrote down and took pictures of, I have gotten a few of these in chain mails so it is more of an adults way of fooling others into thinking that innocent kids are behind them
well if your atheist then why are you reading children s letters to god just so you can go around announcing that your atheist is that what atheism is all about going around and criticizing other peoples beliefs and belittling them then grow up and find a group were all they do is complain all day you’ll fit right in
“well if your atheist then why are you reading children s letters to god just so you can go around announcing that your atheist”
I was sent here from StumbleUpon, and I happened to notice James’s comment.
“is that what atheism is all about going around and criticizing other peoples beliefs and belittling them”
Nope; I just happen to have religious friends who choose to live by the good parts of faith, and are good people. I didn’t appreciate having my friends insulted and called “brainwashed”, and I decided to comment in emotional retaliation to that, out of loyalty to my friends.
“grow up and find a group were all they do is complain all day you’ll fit right in”
Think of all the ways in which that argument could be used. A person finds out a friend of theirs is suicidal? Oh, go slit your wrists in the corner, you crybaby. Women’s rights? Yeah, sure. Go complain about it somewhere else…the kitchen, perhaps. “Complaining” about intolerance (in this case, a person lashing out against an entire group of people with whom he has only has a certain kind of contact) tends to lead towards positive change. In my first example, a person speaking out against the intolerance of the “slit your wrists in the corner” remark, might save the suicidal person’s life. In my second example…well, women’s rights have sprouted entirely from a person “complaining” about injustice.
You cannot catagorize and sort people based on their beliefs, whether they are christian, muslim, atheist or anything else, everyone deserves to be respected and have the right to their opinions. These children are not being brainwashed into believeing lies. That God is the truth to those Christians, and who are you to decide how other parents raise their children?
That’s ridiculous. You are applying the province of philosophy to science. But that is the normal tactic of theists, distract, deny, and distort. Then change the rules if they start to look bad. Religious morality is an oxymoron.
That is exactly what I am trying to apply thought to; if the only truth one knows is “what is” or science, than how can one appropriately apply those truths to how they should think or act without devolving? It seems that you derive some sort of belief system from somewhere other than pure science based on your comments.
I like your thoughts in your blog about the flat tax.
well it seems quite obvious, you attain your beliefs through the experience of life. This is from my point of view a much better way of attaining beliefs (I assume you mean morality) than the writings of 2000 year old desert nomads, which if you read all of the scripture seem to have allot more things we generally find unacceptable in todays world than the obvious good. such as its completely sexist throughout, condones stoning and tells you to live in fear however it also includes do not kill. Its clear it was used as a social control method, and todays social control method is law, so religion is effectively irrelevant. Perhaps we should think as a species, instead of such factions and humanity would be better off.
You are arrogant and offensive. What if a Satan-worshiper said to you, “I’ll sacrifice a couple of babies to Lord Satan for you”? How would you like that?
But being arrogant and offensive are two things christians are very good at doing. Remember, when you are like that, you give others the right to be the same to you. Oops, christians don’t believe that, either. After all, the golden rule is just a cute fable, isn’t it? What I find so disturbing is how christians so rarely behave like they claim to be. Thank you for providing yet another example of this for me. But really, I have enough of those already.
The difference being that christians believe in satan, yet you do not believe in god.
See, if you had kids, and you put pictures of them doing something funny on the internet, for a blog, because you are proud of them, and somebody posts “Isn’t it horrible that these kids are doing something funny, clearly they are being bought up wrong!”
would you be mad? would you consider them to be “Shoving their beliefs down your throat”
Now, if somebody were to say “Have a nice day”, is that offensive? Even if you don’t believe that their words will have any effect? because to an atheist, that is effectively the meaning behind “god bless”.
James, are you just trolling? I mean, seriously? Listen, I’m happy for you in the fact that you are so excited about defending your beliefs! Good for you! But, how in the world did this post get to this heated of a conversation?
Satanist, ahahaha! This may be my new favorite troll.
And Atheists? I want you to know, my God loves you. And don’t worry! You won’t burn in Hell. God would much rather say “Told you so you little shit! Get on in here!” and let you frolic in the fields of paradise for eternity!
Katie, you love being obnoxious and arrogant don’t you? Thanks for confirming what total jerks christians love to be. That’s why I hold people like you in derision and contempt.
You must enjoy looking like a total moron, you keep coming back for more. Does it give you a cheap thrill to look like the jerk you are?
Blessings of Thor upon you, Katie. Understand that although you do not believe in Thor, he believes in you and loves you so much! I pray that one day you will be led by his mighty hammer away from false gods and into his thunderous presence.
The best part of your arrogance is assuming that just because Katie wrote “god bless” she is a Christian. She could easily be a Jew or a Muslim. This comment just proves how arrogant some people can be behind the veil of a computer.
“But that is the normal tactic of theists, distract, deny, and distort. ”
just a note, that is EXACTLY what Dawkins does.
For anyone who actually knows their faith, upon reading Dawkins, you’d know that he has totally missed the point, and arguing against something that even Christians don’t believe in. lol. It’s like, we don’t believe that, what are you talking about?
A quick aside, I think you made a little typo in your ID. Shouldn’t it say “Bemused”?
Perhaps you can give some specific examples of Dawkins using “deny, delay, distract”?
What are you saying he argues against something christians don’t believe in? Again, please give examples. Maybe it’s god? christians don’t believe in god or jesus?
Maybe if you gave specific examples, you’d have some credibility. As it is, you are amusing while being confused.
Yes, as a matter of fact it can. Working together tends to make weak species stronger, if the build of that particular species isn’t tough enough to take on the world on its own. A school of fish working together can make a larger fish go away. Humans have taken that concept of pack survival and have taken it to the next level of “morality”.
For instance, sometime in history, a person (in whatever stage of evolution they happened to believe in; yes, I do go along with evolution, as it makes a lot more sense than the alternatives out there) must have realized that if anyone in the pack kills or steals from another member, they get cast out and are left to die on their own. Morality has sprung from the knowledge of this, and the nature of humans to stick together. Also, in the case of a family, it must have occurred to someone that a human baby is a very delicate thing, compared to other animal babies. I mean, colts just get out, get up, and walk. Babies…well, you get the deal. Therefore, for the good of the pack, it is not a good thing for either parent to desert their child, and the idea of parenting was born.
So, in case you decide to go with “tl;dr”: To answer your question, no.
It only rakes one religion to turn the world into a giant mess. I simply adore the way so many want to suppress free speech when it doesn’t say what the want to hear.
That’s why my tag line in emails is< "If freedom means anything at all, it is the liberty to tell others what they do not want to hear."
Theists consistently hate this idea. But hate and intolerance are the two cornerstones of most religions.
SO I bid this sad, sad site of delusional christians and their apologists adieu. I have made my point that, once again, theists are not nice people when they are challenged about their sick beliefs. I never expected anything else from people that will brainwash their own children and the children of everyone else into a demented, false set of beliefs with no verifiable evidence. It's no wonder children have to learn to lie. They have such great examples thrust upon them.
“That’s why my tag line in emails is< "If freedom means anything at all, it is the liberty to tell others what they do not want to hear."
huh…well freedom is nice. Freedom of speech is lovely. I like it, I'm an American. I use it on a daily basis to tell people to shove it, to explain the way I feel, to express the best I can, without worry, what I mean to say without being patronized.
You say "I have religion forced at me all the time…" well sir, you live Brazil; according to brazil.gov, Roman Catholics make up over 74% of the country. The percentage make perfect sense to anyone that's been to Brazil; in Brazil, there isn't much else to do. If you'd like to live somewhere where it's not being "forced at you" might I suggest Sweden; Sweden's population is made of 85% non-religious folk.
I met a kid once in high school. He was a vegetarian, a label reader, a "hipster" but above all else he was an atheist. He hated people of all religions. He claimed religion was brainwashing people in believing there was something there that wasn't. He talked daily about how stupid people were–believing in something they couldn't prove. As easy as it would be to beat the crap out of him, verbally and/or physically, I didn't.
You see I'm a Christian in the actual sense of thew meaning–to be Christ-like. And as much as I'd like to say I know exactly what it means to be Christ-like I don't. However I do know it means to understand. So try to understand I did.
I did my research to find out why he acted the way he did. Why he hated God so much. I spent the night at his house, expecting to see what could learn from his parents. As I spent the night I was greeted by his grandparents. I'm sure you see where I'm going and others will too.
You see, his parents died in a car accident when he was fourteen. A car accident he escaped with but minor busing and a broken rib. It was after this I started to look at him in a new light. He didn't hate the idea of God, he hated the idea of a God that would take his parents and leave him behind.
So, here I decided to do the same; I did my research. I know this is a little personal, but if you're going to post hatred on a site about children then attack others I think it's safe to say you find nothing sacred.
James–
I'm sorry about your wife. It wasn't your fault. You can keep thinking poisoned thoughts about how God didn't save her; how you prayed and prayed to cure her cancer but no treatment worked. How she died too early. You both saved and saved and saved to take your trip around the world only to have her get sick part of the way though and spend the rest of the money trying to save her.
I understand. You blame God. But James you have to understand, God loved her too. God does have a higher plan and you will see her again. If you want to spend your life being bitter go for it. But being bitter isn't what she would have wanted.
I know you'll probably come back to say I'm lying–trying to hide your pain, trying to get others to hate just like you do and I'm sorry for that. Just realize God does love you, even if you don't love him back.
You may not be a liar, but you are attempting to project what may be your own experience on me to justify your own delusions. Whether that experience is true or not, I can’t say. But it does sound suspiciously like similar stories I have been told before by theists.
What wife? I have never mentioned any wife on here.
Furthermore, I have been an atheist since I was 13, when I learned to think for myself. You should try it.
Blame god? Hate god? That is also ridiculous. How can you hate something that has never existed? Do environmentalists hate Paul Bunyan for cutting down all those trees? You theists always try the “Hate god” nonsense. No idea it too absurd for you reject, is it?
Is it any wonder I find theists silly, stubbornly ignorant, and regard all religion with derision and contempt? Theists put forth the most incredible, outrageous statements and expect everyone to accept them without proof as you accept your religion without proof. If you asked for proof, there would be no religion.
Belief without proof is called “faith”. To quote Mark Twain, “Faith is believing what you know ain’t true.”
I will admit that I have what must be a character flaw. I have never dealt well with stupidity at any time. When I encounter willful stupidity such as is required for religion, I find that especially unacceptable. A person cannot help it if he was born with less than normal intelligence. But to deliberately discard intelligence in favor of ignorance is to disdain the gifts you claim your god has given you.
Look at all of the replies here that have accused me of different things without even offering and example, far less proof. Look at the people that have chastised me for being rude and obnoxious and have not given me credit for my replies that have been kind and gentle. How many do you think have bothered to learn any more about me by reading my blog or looking at the videos I have made for myself and others. Is that the actions of christian tolerance, kindness, and understanding?
What I have seen here is vicious lies and accusations. How many have said I have not spoken the truth about anything but gave no examples nor any proof of that? If I have been difficult, it is simply a reflection of how others act on here. That’s how I am, a reflection of those around me. Perhaps these “good christians” should examine their own behavior. But they will not do that any more than they will bother to learn more about me. Either one might wreck their cherished beliefs.
One of the Universal truths I have on my blog is, “Man’s most cherished possessions are his illusions. He will surrender his property, family, even his life before his illusions.” Nothing I have read on here has altered that concept. Nor have a read anything that improves my opinion of theists.
You don’t really offer any “proof” either. You just call the opposing party stupid and belittle their ideas. “You may not be a liar, but you are attempting to project what may be your own experience on me to justify your own delusions.” ” I have never dealt well with stupidity at any time. When I encounter willful stupidity such as is required for religion, I find that especially unacceptable.” And saying definitively that G-d does not exist is not logically possible. There are very few things that can be considered facts. The existence of a deity is probably at the top of the list. There are plenty theists and atheists all over the world who question their beliefs of G-d and of everything else. I know I have, and I’ve met plenty of people who do. How can you say that you are so sure of yourself and that you know the absolute, impossible to combat truth when almost everyone else in the world has uncertainties?
“It only rakes one religion to turn the world into a giant mess.”
False. If there were only one religion, there would be a lot fewer wars over which one was the true one. (;
That said, how can you accuse Theists of brainwashing their children by teaching them what they believe? Will you not teach your own children what you believe? Or will you bite your tongue every time they have a question that your view-point provides an answer to and just let them stumble upon some type of understanding of the world eventually? I highly doubt the latter would be the case. Biting one’s tongue has never been one of mankind’s most dominant traits.
In the future, I suggest you look at your own attitude before accusing others of being
arrogant jerks. None of your comments have come off as anything less, which is sad, because perhaps in your normal social life you are absolutely lovely and get on with just about everybody. Too bad all any of us can see is the guy who overreacts to a website and then sits back name-calling and generalizing a group of people he claims does the same to him (I feel like my mom said something about two wrongs…). With great fervor, I might add.
Keep in mind that there is no proving the things in life that cause the big questions, or at least none has come up. There is certainly some very nice evidence, but no smoking guns, as it were. We’re all canaries in a coal mine on these subjects, I’m afraid.
Only one religion is what all theists wish to do. Their problem is, none can produce any evidence that their religion is any more real than the others.
So you admit there have been wars over which religion is “the one true one”? At least we agree on that.
I don’t accuse theists of subjecting their children to brainwashing. I am saying directly that it’s what they do.
For my own children, I would rarely answer any questions directly but encourage them to find their own answers. Admittedly, I often answered, “I don’t know” so they would have to discover things for themselves. But as far as imposing my atheism on them, if they asked “Dad, why don’t you go to a church?” I would answer honestly. “Because I do not accept those beliefs as being true.” If they asked”Why not?” as children do, then it would be “Learn all you can about it, then you tell me.”
Children love to learn and discover things for themselves if they are encouraged to do so and it’s not made a chore.
It wasn’t a matter of biting my tongue, it was a matter of encouraging the development of young minds. Did they sometimes go down the wrong trail and discover they’d been wrong? Sure, often. That was part of the lesson. That they can be wrong and anyone can be wrong. The best part of education is learning where your mistakes are and correcting them.
Again, you assume far too much. I do not accuse, I state the obvious. Just as you are being arrogant in you assumptions.
Yes, there is proving the big questions. Many have been answered and others will be. Will everything eventually be known? That’s possible, but unlikely. What is known is that there is not one atom of evidence for any god at all. It’s unfortunate that some people refuse to admit this. But, as I said elsewhere on here. “Man’s most precious possessions are his illusions. A person will surrender their property, family, and even their life before their illusions.” Good luck with yours.
I apologize if my question came off in an assumptive manner, I meant to do nothing of the sort. I was simply raising an eyebrow, if you take the meaning.
Of course I admit there have been wars fought over religion. But there are wars fought over all kinds of things. I’m quite certain there are plenty of people who have killed other persons for motives that have nothing to do whatsoever with religion. Anything can be twisted into something bad.
Also, there are several theists perfectly capable of raising their children without “brainwashing” them as you say. My parents raised me in much the same manner as you state you’ve raised your own. If I asked a question, my mother answered with “I believe…” My brother and I were taken to church because that is where my parents were on Sundays, and it was cheaper (hard to beat free) than a daycare or a babysitter on a Sunday morning. As soon as we became old enough to stay at home, we were more than welcome to. No brow-beating, no pushing. We even attended *gasp* public school. I am personally still asking myself the big questions. I’m not being lazy when I say I’m unsure what I believe as of yet, I am admitting to still being young and still learning.
I hope I never stop learning, quite frankly.
That said, thank you for wishing me well with my illusions. I also hope I never lose those, as sometimes on a particularly awful or even simply dull day, it’s nice to have somewhere quiet to slip away to.
And you’re right. There is no “proof”. But I haven’t been shown a lot of proof from
other sides either. Note I said I haven’t been shown any, please. I don’t want to be accused of ignoring things again.
I’m not sure if this reply is worth the time, since you seem to have made up your mind that what I’m saying is “Repent, heathen!” But I’m really not. But please, the broad-sweeping generalizations are unnecessary. I am sorry for the people you have met who have tried to shove things down your throat. I guess I was trying to get out a “They’re not all bad” message and wasn’t very clear about it and didn’t do a very good job. I hope my example in this post will serve me better.
If you’d like to share any proof with me, I’d be more than happy to see it. Most people just tell me that it exists and don’t go any further. I’ve no problem saying I’m left a bit ignorant. Any links or suggestions of valuable reads would be welcomed (:
Is it so bad to believe in something when your growing up? Instead of complaining just be thankful that children get a chance to believe in something and learn. Not every child gets a chance to learn about religion or faith. If you consider trying to give children a chance to learn about their own faith, then maybe you need to re learn what what the term “brain washing” really means. These letters to God have nothing involving “brain washing”.
Children learn about their own faith? What faith? DO you mean the one imposed upon them by their parents and others? Children are born innocent and without delusions.
If you were born somewhere else, you might be a Muslim, Shintoist, Jew, Hindu, or anything. Your faith is no more than an accident of birth and your own unwillingness to face the truth.
Those letters DO reflect the brainwashing (it’s one word) they have already received in their lives. Face fact, I know you are not willing to about your religion, but, “Beliefs, no matter how sincerely held, do not alter facts.” Like it or not, the truth is still the truth.
Don’t forget: atheism is also a belief passed down from parent to child. It is impossible to prove or disprove logically an entity that (if it exists) transcends the natural laws of the universe. An atheist will use logic to justify what they already believe, as will a theist.
Atheism is not a belief. It is a rational response to observed facts. Beliefs are opinions held without any supporting facts. Like your belief that you are intelligent.
My atheism was certainly not passed down from my parents. It was something I arrived at after reading the bible front to back several times and noticing all the contradictions, impossibilities, and outright lies.
As a result of my atheism, I endured years of threats, groundings, and abuse, verbal and even physical. Most of it from my parents, although they never abused me physically, mentally, it was barely endurable.
It isn’t what I “believe”. It’s what I know and is supported by all available evidence. Not much logic is required, just a willingness to accept verifiable facts.
The bible really has nothing to do with this. The bible cannot neither prove nor disprove god. The only god whose existence it concerns is the judeo-christian idea of one. Even if the bible cannot possibly be a book written by god given to israel on mount sinai, it is still possible that there exist a god. Whether or not one choses to believe in it is their own choice, because no logic in the whole world can definitively disprove the existence of a define being because, as i’ve said and you haven’t countered, you can’t use logic to prove or disprove an entity that is not trapped by it.
L, logic would be lost upon you. Your only interest is in being as obnoxious as possible. I’ll give you this, you’re very good at it.
I have asked for any proof of any god so many times and have been ignored or referred to the circular logic of a “holy book”.
You are right, the babble cannot possible be written by any god. Even a mediocre deity would do a better job than that collection of myths, lies, and impossibilities.
BTW, it should be “can neither prove or disprove god.” But why would it try to intentionally disprove the god it is supposed to promote? Oh well, I suppose that is only more of what passes for logic with you.
“Atheism is not a belief. It is a rational response to observed facts. Beliefs are opinions held without any supporting facts.”
If atheism is not a belief, what facts support/prove it?
The facts lead to agnosticism. Anything else is a belief, whether it is the belief that 0, 1, or many god(s) exist. There are no supporting facts for theism OR atheism.
“I have a really hard time taking anything you say seriously because you evade the central issues and focus on trivialities such as typos. That is a typical theist tactic, though. When you have no answers or logical replies, deny, delay, and distract. If all of that fails, pretend the issue was never raised and declare “Victory through the power of “…”. (insert name of deity here)”
What a hypocrite, calling someone out on something as “trivial” as typos?
Also, can you guess which comments he hasn’t responded to? 😉
He does the same thing on his blog. Ignores the ones that points out his flaws and the ones asking of him what he is asking of everyone else. Instead of “deny, delay, and distract.” It should be Attack, insult, and ignore.”
This really has been a fun read! I’ve found the comments far more entertaining then the original page. lol
Apparently brainwashed: Tell me one instance on my blog where I have ignored any comment where I have not responded. I have deleted a very few when there was nothing to which to respond. When there was nothing but attacks kike “Faggot”, “Asshole” and other one- or two- word insults, there is nothing to say.
“Attack, insult, and ignore. That’s exactly what you have done in your post. It must feel good doing that behind the safety of the internet. Almost as good as revealing yourself to be a total jerk?
Like so many others on here, you understand only what you want to understand.
What I criticized one person for was posting about nothing but typos. As I explained several times to him and others, is, when I mention typos at all, it is only in passing, not as the entire theme of the post. I have never denied that I make them myself. When you enter text quickly and do not always take the time to edit before clicking “Post Comment”, things will slip through.
Most often, I ignore typos and grammatical errors. If I commented on every error I saw, I would have no time for anything else. Similarly, if I carefully edited everything I posted, I would be devoting more time than I have for this.
While on the subject, it seems that mostly theists see and comprehend only what they wish to understand. I’d have to take a more detailed survey to state that as a certainty. Nonetheless, when I consider that, to believe in a deity, one must believe only what supports that view and to reject any facts or logic that does not, it seems to be a probable hypothesis that is the case. A strict examination of sufficient posts, here and elsewhere might promote that hypothesis to a theory.
That is also a demonstration of the difference in the difference between hypothesis and theory in the scientific method. Many theists do not understand this so they make statements like, “Evolution is just a theory.” no realizing they are revealing more about their ignorance than they are supporting a creationist view.
No Kate, I was not. Please take more care in reading and comprehending.
What I said was, to devote an entire post to only typos is nothing more than a way to avoid genuine issues when you have nothing intelligent to say.
I also said that, when I mention them, it is an aside, not the point of the entire post. That’s what I said in the very post you are criticizing. What part of it was too difficult for you to understand? All of it?
I believe I understood the whole thing, thank you.
My point is, you make the typo issue the first part of your statement, clearly making it a point to prove that whomever it was was ignorant to begin with, thus making your argument seem more valid.
Also, the initial comment about the typos was a girl simply pointing out that you seem ignorant and are representing Atheists in a bad light, which you also made another poster seem ignorant with your immediate attack on their typing.
By the way, I am curious of your evidence that supports the idea that God is not real. And I am interested in knowing if you think that telling children about Santa and the Tooth Fairy is also brainwashing. No, I do not want this to be a debate between the two of us, I am genuinely interested to hear your views on this, as I have honestly never asked an Atheist this before.
I say we stop replying to what James is saying. He is obviously deranged and this is just fun for his boring life. Save your thoughts for someone competent.
Save thoughts for someone competent? Like you? Then say something that is rational and not so obviously willfully ignorant.
You want to shut me up. That’s the usual theist response to anything they cannot answer, “Just shut up! I can’t hear you, La lala lalala!”
Accusing me of being “deranged” is really an intelligent, cogent argument. You have so much proof. Yet, neither you not anyone else has shown that even one word I have posted is not correct. All you can do is try to discredit me with transparent attempt like “deranged.” If you think that will fool anyone, then maybe the deranged label belongs on you.
Hey James I like how you are trying to use big words to seem intelligent, your not fooling anyone on this comment page I hope you see that. You are the only one on here who is attacking everyone else and the only one who acts that you know everything. I think your very well deserved of the “deranged” label I have given you so wear it proudly and accept it. Your way too easy to see through, get a new act.
Man, these theists seem to have a lot of “usual responses.” What have I learned about James? That his usual response is to claim that everything anyone does is some evil tactic.
I have to repeat the same things. Very few on here are capable of understanding the same concept when it is phrased differently. It only confuses them.
Where have I said anything was an “evil tactic”? I have said “usual tactic” if it is evil, perhaps you are seeing it even more clearly than I. Thank you for that.
Lack of vocabulary? I sense a lack of true intellectual development, educational experience, and a prevalence of ostentatious prevarication with you.
The difference is, use my real name and place of residence. Furthermore, if you, or anyone else wants to confront me personally, I’ll pay your way here. The we shall see how brave you are.
Like everyone here, when they think I am no longer watching becomes very brave and starts posting unproven lies about me and irrelevant statements that have nothing to do with the issues.
How typical of theists to be smug, self-congratulatory, and silly when they think they are safe from rebuttal.
I repeat, not one person has proven anything I have posted is wrong. No one has even given an example of things they claim are wrong, much less provided proof.
If you are a rational person, that indicates intellectual and ethical cowardice. That comes as no surprise.
SO many here think because they or someone says something it is true. Like “you have not told the truth about anything”. But no examples are given. But theists must accept statements as being true with no sup[porting evidence. That’s the basis of all religion. Then, they can be “supported” by the usual circular reasoning. How pathetic you all have shown yourselves to be.
Now I can walk away because I still have my integrity. That’s something few of you can claim. You know I’ve made you look like fools. I repeat. Not one person on here, I’m looking right at you Kaitlyn, has proven a single word I have posted has been wrong. You can claim you have, but that doesn’t make it true. What makes it true is specific examples with independently verifiable evidence. None of that has been forthcoming.
So adios, it’s been amusing, but I have more important things to do.
It does not matter whether or not you use your real name or place of residence. For one thing, internet security is a very fragile thing, and often times it is recommended that people use alias names when posting comments on sites such as this one. Maybe you didn’t notice, but I’ve made several posts on multiple comments you’ve made. Yet you chose to respond to the shortest one without addressing any of the points I have brought up.
“But theists must accept statements as being true with no sup[porting evidence. That’s the basis of all religion. Then, they can be “supported” by the usual circular reasoning.”
So do atheists. It is impossible for anyone to empirically disprove G-d, because his existence (if he does indeed exist) is one that transcends the natural laws (as i have stated before). As I have also stated, because of this, the decision whether or not to believe in G-d is an emotional one, not a logical one. There are plenty of valid reasons on both sides for the way people believe the way they do.
I’ve tried not to be rude, a courtesy that you clearly have not tried to honor (through statements such as ” You know I’ve made you look like fools. I repeat. ” and many others). As I’m fairly certain I’ve said on another post, it is very difficult to believe your claims that you are not trying to convince anyone of anything, or cause any anger when you patronize any and all responses that you get. The fact that this is the only response of mine you chose to respond to shows that you are a coward. I would appreciate if you would respond to all of my other, more coherent responses; otherwise I will continue thinking that I am right (a conclusion you probably won’t be able to handle.)
“It is impossible for anyone to empirically disprove G-d”
Empirically disprove doesn’t make any sense. There are an infinite number of things disproven, when something is proven true. The disproof is in the proof, as they say.
“because his existence (if he does indeed exist) is one that transcends the natural laws”
Right….How do you know this? Are you so sure that your interpretation of natural laws is perfect?
“As I have also stated, because of this, the decision whether or not to believe in G-d is an emotional one, not a logical one.”
The decision to believe is indeed emotional. Disbelief, however, involves logic and is the default. Babies are born “without belief in god” (atheism). If you don’t automatically believe everything you hear, then disbelief is your default.
Since when did we trust our emotions to give us truth? This why we have standards to weed out things like confirmation bias in our scientific studies.
There are more than 1 billion Muslim people in the world, all of them using their emotions and determining that their Allah is the one who exists. In your eyes, their emotions are leading them falsely, as are the emotions of the atheists and every other religion than your prescribed one. Suddenly, emotions don’t seem too reliable a tool.
“There are plenty of valid reasons on both sides for the way people believe the way they do.”
There are valid reasons for vague and unspecific theistic beliefs, such as agnostic theism, deism or just a simple belief that something other than the universe exists.
There are far more reasons against trying to describe or name what that “something” is.
Oh L, you poor put-upon person. YOu are distressed because I do not choose to reply to every one of your ramblings. I don’t even see all of them nor have tome to read them. I do have a life other than deciphering the convoluted maundering from your keyboard.
Tell you what, I’ll extend the offer of a free trip here to you. Then we’ll see who is the coward. Be sure to write out your statements in advance and practice them so you don’t become confused as you do on here.
Then you will have plenty of time to consider your mistakes after our “chat”.
Babies are born without belief in god(s) (agnosticism). This is neither the belief in the non-existence of god(s) (atheism), or the belief in the existence of god(s) (theism).
Agnosticism refers to the belief that knowledge about gods cannot be known. Do you think that really applies to babies?
One can be an agnostic theist (one who believes but admits that his belief cannot truly be known)
Similarly, one can be agnostic atheist (One who admits that you cannot be certain if a god does/doesn’t exist, but rates the probability of this god existing as extremely low)
Atheism is defined by the merriam-webster dictionary as:
a : a disbelief in the existence of deity
b : the doctrine that there is no deity
Now, why would these be listed as differing definitions, if they actually mean the same thing (which is what you claim)?
Disbelief encompasses more than one opinion. If you simply do not accept the claims of a religion because you find there is insufficient evidence, but would change your mind were evidence presented, then you are STILL an atheist.
Let me put it this way:
A christian given the statement “God exists” would rate the statement as true.
An atheist, however, when given the statement “God does not exist” is free to answer either True OR False.
They can claim that they know God doesn’t exist, or they can claim they don’t know, which necessitates a “False” answer. Not believing in God is NOT NOT NOT the same as believing in no God.
This is blatant ignorance. Anyone who thinks it is religion causing all of these conflicts obviously has no grasp on human nature. Since the dawn of time, humans have fought against each other for various reasons: blood feuds, territorial claims, and fight for food supply to name a few. Many of the wars blamed on “religion” are actually primarily caused by land feuds. I’ll admit, it’s true that there are some religious extremists that do twist religion selfishly and use it as an excuse for violence towards their enemies; but do you think that they’ll just go away if religion fades? People will always find a reason to hate each other. The violent tendencies of man are a genetic part imbibed in them as a part of the fight for survival and survival instinct.
What matters is that, while some have attacked you, unfairly at times, some have tried to ask you, kindly, if you would please not attack an entire religion because of some individuals, or smaller groups. If men with mustaches had offended you, would you besmirch and verbally assault any human being with facial hair? That isn’t fair to the rest of the religion.
No, not every Christian behaves as they are taught, and not all have researched their beliefs. But please don’t say that no one has, because you don’t know them; what they choose to believe is their choice, the same as it is yours. Perhaps they HAVE looked as WHY they believe as they do; read up on history or the Bible (not necessarily a faultless source, so don’t attack me), or researched other religions or a way of life without religion at all. The fact of the matter is, you have no right to attack an entire group of people simply because it is not your manner of thinking.
I admire that you asked your children to go and discover what they think; my parents did the same thing, and they are both theists. I was NEVER forced to go to church, pressured to do anything with religion, and always encouraged to ask any questions about things that I did not understand. Atheist homes are not the only homes in which questions are allowed; I was raised by a Roman Catholic and a Protestant, and I am free still to be whatever I choose.
I am sorry that some people on here aren’t more accepting of your views. I think that they are your own opinion, and you have as much right to voice it as you would like. I think that the people that got on here just to call you a “douche” acted without class or manners, and should think before they speak (or type). However, I also believe that you calling people “obnoxious jerks” and unintelligent, brainwashed, and other names makes you look just as foolish, no matter how legitimate your argument may be. I’m not hoping you’ll change your views; they are yours as much as your name, your body, your thoughts. I only hope that you can be more accepting, not necessarily that you accept their views, but hopefully that you can accept them as people with their own thoughts, whether they are yours or not. Just because you don’t agree with a group of people does not give you the right to besmirch them and make the entire concept of theists out to be villains or illogical tacticians. That isn’t fair to anyone.
for your previous offer of paying someone’s way down to Brazil, I would love to take you up on that offer 🙂 haha… kidding, sort of. Although I really would enjoy visiting Brazil sometime. I also think it would be interesting to talk to you in person.
It seems like you have really spent a lot of time and effort here on this website. I’m not saying that as an insult.
I’ll be honest, I was brought up in a Christian home. That’s not to say I haven’t had my share of doubts. I’m currently attempting to read through the Bible, you are right, it is very contradictory. But overall, I would say events in my life have confirmed my belief in God. Most of these events had nothing to do with attending Church or reading the Bible.
You are absolutely right that religion has led to many problems across the world. The thing is, believing in God really doesn’t have that much to do with organized religion. You can say I’m wrong, but, like you’re rational response to observed facts, i have observed certain truths which have led me to believe there is a God. These “observed facts” did not take place in a religious setting. Most of them were personal experiences.
You ask for examples, here is just one: I was hit by a car while biking. Call me a moron for not wearing a helmet but I wasn’t, anyway, I was hit by a car going around 50 MPH, the driver only stopped the car after I managed to smash her windshield with my body before I flew to the ground further down the road. By the grace of God, (or chance, you’re call) I landed within inches of pavement which I could have easily smashed my head on, breaking my neck. After dragging myself to the grass, the adrenaline rush masking the pain momentarily, 3 nurses and doctors rushed over. They just happened to be driving past right after the accident. Within minutes an ambulance arrived and I was sent to the hospital. To the astonishment of those at the hospital, I didn’t have any broken bones. There was not a single scratch on my face. All of this might not sound like much to you, but I believe that God, or angels or something was looking out for me that day. You can blame it on scientific probability if you would like, that’s fine by me.
Overall, I think there is one thing we can accomplish together. I’m assuming from most of your writings that you feel the world would benefit by ridding itself of religion. In a way, I agree. The problem with religion is the generalizations of it all. The problems we have seen, like the many horrible genocides, were the result of attempts to universalize a given belief system. If we can recognize the fact that each person perceives things differently, and accept the fact that this leads to variations in beliefs the world could be so different.
Kelly, thank you for your nice response. I appreciate a well-written, polite note.
About your accident, what a coincidence! On April 28th this year, I was also hit by a car. I was out for a walk and about to cross a street. I saw a car approaching with its left turn signal on and obviously slowing down quickly. I assumed (always a BAD idea) that it was going to turn. I stepped into the street and was struck in my left leg by the car and knocked to the street, hitting my head and back. I was stunned more than I realized at the time so, with some help, walked about a block back home. Do I think it was god that kept me from being hurt worse? Not at all. Nor do I see any evidence that your survival was due to supernatural intervention.
I have to think of this. At any time, there are about 27,000 children around the world dying of starvation and malnutrition. No god does anything about that. Isn’t it a bit arrogant to assume a deity would suspend the laws of physics specifically for you and yet allow all those children to die horrible deaths?
One of the things religion teaches is that yes, exactly that will happen if you believe the “right” faith and pray enough. God will also ensure victory for your sports team if you pray before the game, even though the other team is doing the same. Clearly, a sporting contest is more worthy of divine intervention than starving children.
Yes, your good fortune was the result of nothing more than being a bit lucky that time. I have personally known people in worse bike accidents that were not even scratched and hardly bruised.
I have a friend in Arizona that took a very slight tumble off his bike and would have been likely killed if not for his helmet. The helmet had some impressive cracks in it that would have been his skull had he not been wearing it. I do suspect that he was riding a bit faster than he admitted, but I don’t “know” that. What I do know of the laws of physics says it probably took more energy to shatter the helmet than a low-speed tumble could have provided.
There might have been flaws in the helmet, he might have hit in precisely the wrong position, there could have been a rock that he hit, or myriad other possibilities. Did god smash his helmet as an object lesson to him? Hardly likely. He was wearing the helmet and is an experienced bicyclist. He was working at a bike shop at the time, assembling and repairing racing bikes.
As I pointed out in my blog entry, “Flying Pharaohs” (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/08/04/84/) it’s easy to assign a supernatural explanation to anything we do not understand. That doesn’t make the supernatural true or even possible.
Thank you again for your post. It’s refreshing to read one that isn’t full of “You’re wrong”, “You have no proof”, or “you make typos, so you must be wrong.” The last is so laughable because that’s all they can think of? To me, that says more about their mental processes than I am sure they would like me to know. 😀
Yes, I will. But you will have to be prepared to back up your insults and stupidity with your skin. I am and I am not a misogynistic jerk that thinks women should be treated as second-class citizens, too weak and trembling to defend themselves.
I have taught martial arts to many women and I never permitted them to be treated any differently than any other student. They had to work just as hard and pass the same tests as anyone else. So why should the be regarded as something less than the men?
My position was I had students of different sizes, ages, and levels. When they left the dressing rooms and lined up for class, they were all students. Nothing less.
I don’t think I ever insulted you, nor displayed stupidity. I was simply asking if I could come visit you in Brazil! So would you like to start making plans for you to buy my plane ticket. I’m working two jobs and am trying to get ahead at my university since I am triple majoring and triple minoring so I’m in summer school until the end of the month. I hope we can work something out!
I respect your ideas and opinions. I do think that some things that people have posted on here were only to create controversy and just be jerks. We all need to respect each others opinions, though. I am not going to sit here and tell you that you are wrong or any other people that have commented…it isn’t my place to do so. What I will say is…some people are just out looking to pick a fight and have no respect for others. I admit that when people do have this motive I usually get offended and argue to no end. As I have seen on this website particularly, with most people as mentioned above it doesn’t get me anywhere, it only fuels my anger. I just wanted to post and say it is good to question what other people believe and for others to do the same to what I believe, but it must be done in a manner that is respectful in order to get anywhere, gain any knowledge, prove a point, etc.
Koliver: I agree about being respectful but unfortunately, there are far too many people on this site that regard respect and politeness as being weakness. If you read my posts carefully, you will notice that I generally respond to people in the same way that they treat me. Those, like you and Kaitlyn for example, that conduct themselves like civilized people receive polite replies. Those that do not get the back of my hand, metaphorically speaking. Yes, I have noted when people have been ignorant or stupid. If they don;t like that, smarten up.
As I have said before on here and elsewhere, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.”
Sadly, there are many theists, certainly not all, that react to any questioning or challenge to their beliefs with hostility and anger. When they do, I have no reservations about returning it.
At the start, I sated simple facts. There is no god and brainwashing children into believing a lie is abuse. It teaches them to stop questioning what they are told. That produces good little robots for the church and the government to control.
Elsewhere, I have stated that the purpose of religions is to allow one relatively small group of people to control the thoughts, speech and actions of a larger group. If we examine the history of religions, how they have been founded upon lies, promoted lies and exerted control over every aspect of believer’s lives, it becomes obvious.
One question, out of context I know. I noticed you always type KOliver. The capital “O” seems to be intentional. Is it? I personally have a problem with two initial capitals because of nerve damage in my left hand, the one I normally use on the shift key. As a result, it often doesn’t move fast enough and I type things like YOu by mistake. Curiously, someone here made an issue of that as if it were relevant. But, if they have no logical statements or facts that pertain to the issue, I supposed attempting distraction with irrelevancies is the best we can expect from them. 😉
Thanks again for your thoughtful, honest, courteous posts. It’s refreshing to see and enjoyable to reply to them.
To reply to some of the other things in your earlier post…
It is unfortunate that one belief or opinion can be distorted and tainted by individuals who don’t truly understand what they claim to believe. I think that is what causes so much tension and hatred between two opposing parties. I don’t want to attack any position that I have not taken the time to study and understand thoroughly. Just simply looking up a few things on the internet and flipping through a few books isn’t enough for me to tell someone that their views are not credible.
I was recently a student in a Reasoning and Critical Thinking class at the university I attend and I learned a great deal from my professor about arguments. I try to be mindful of what I learned and utilize that information whenever I am in a dispute. Many people don’t understand that they need to support their ideas with credible evidence and can’t just tell someone they disagree with opposing views on the grounds that the views are “stupid” or other faulty reasoning.
I love being ale to engage in thoughtful and intellectual debates that are not degrading to either party involved. Any other form of debate is usually unhelpful and doesn’t get anyone to the point they want to make.
Thanks for that reply. I appreciate it and understand why you do it. I suspected it was something you do deliberately because it is so consistent and it doesn’t appear anywhere else.
Good luck with your studies. Reasoning and critical thinking are important skills for anyone in any field. Well, maybe not theology but most other things, certainly.
lololololol it’s cute little letters to God from kids. we get it you’re an atheist. would you get this pissed over cute little letters to Santa from kids? it should all be the same to you right?
I think this is so cute to see what children have to say. But then I see all the ADULTS bantering back an forth about grammar, spelling, bad punctuation, anger meanness WOW. Sometimes I think people look for others to argue with to make themselves feel smarter and worthy of some unknown gift of winning the battle of wits! It’s sad and if you’re an atheist, what pray tell are you doing on this site….is it to spread your anger and negativity? This is a free country, free to choose free to speak free to be. BUT If your only purpose is to spread negative and unKIND feelings everywhere you go, well by all means Shut up and stay home. No one forces you to be here you CHOOSE to be here your INVITED to be here which is a KINDNESS!! Please try to spread that instead of harsh unkind words, you can be whatever you want to be and people may raise there children to believe what they want. When they grow up if they choose different well that’s there choice!
Try spreading Kindness and acceptance and maybe just maybe this world can be a better place for all our children no matter what they Believe!!JMO
Again, another net nazi telling me to “shut up” if I can’t say what she wants to hear.
No one forced you to read anything, nor did anyone but your own over-inflated ego force you to reply. You chose to here and you’re (not your) bot invited, it is an open and free site for anyone.
Children will rarely choose what they believe after they have been brainwashed from birth through adulthood. You’re proof of that.
Also remember that, when you assume the right to tell others what to do, you grant the same right to them. So don’t be surprised if someone tells you to shut up and go away.
I do spread kindness and nice words when others start the same with me. If you had read my posts to people like Kaitlyn and KOliver, you would see that.
It’s with smart-ass people like you that I will jump salty. With me, you reap what you sow.
Wow, another super-intelligent, highly-original reply. Did you think of that all by yourself or did someone help you with the spelling and typing?
Do you often make comments to people like that to their face? I think not or someone would have ripped your face off by now.
BTW, the next time you get help making comments, try to find someone that knows the difference between “your” and “you’re”. They person you used this time, is making you look like an under-acheiving fourth grade punk.
Oops, I clicked Post Comment too quickly. That should be “under-achieving”. It’s “i” before “e” except after “c” or when sounded as “a” as in Neighbor and Weigh.
Yeah, James, God or no God, we’re all in this together, and being an asshole through the anonymity of this little website’s comments is getting you and your cause for the decimation of religion NOWHERE, okay?
Hey man I would just like to say that I am a Christian, and I do not take offense to what you believe. It really isn’t that important and just because some does something under the name of so and so whether it be a deity or another person does not mean that they have the go ahead from that deity or person and I believe that religion has messed a lot of stuff up.(this is where my Christian comes out, just a heads up.) Jesus himself tried to show the religious teachers and Pharisees that what they were doing was wrong. I believe that there are many people that chose the religion of Christianity and take only that and only do the minimum as they see it, and then I believe that there are people who chose the faith Christ and help people. I see it in all areas and backgrounds of life whether someone chooses a religion or not, they have a choice, whether to be a jerk to others and whether to be kind and a neighbor to others. I do believe that there is a God and that Jesus came down and died for everyone’s sins not just mine or the “I am holy because I was raised in the church” but everyone’s but I also believe that we need to help others the bible says that true pure religion in the eyes of God is helping the orphans and widows. Obviously not all or many religions do that but it starts with the heart of the people. And so sir I apologize for any hurt that you have dealt by people of the “Christian faith” (whether I have the right to apologize for all “Christians” I do not care it is done) and I hope that you live a successful life. I also would like to point out the fact that I do think and that “religion” does not cloud my eyes as it does for so many others. I believe that religion is mostly traditions and are not really that great for the entire human race.
First I would like to remind you that I am not really anti-christian but anti-religion, all religions. So don’t take it personally.
Next, I do not have “beliefs”. That’s something theists have a problem understanding. Atheism is not a “belief” it is a world view based upon facts. Faith is a belief because it is based upon something with no supporting facts and many facts that dispute it.
I also agree that religion is traditions and many of them are not good and do not lead to good results.
Thank you for your comment about my life. I do have a successful life. I live in the best climate in the world, have social and financial security, and have had several fulfilling and rewarding careers as a technical writer, martial arts instructor, sailor, and business owner.
Now, I am mostly retired and enjoying excellent health and good friends.
Although no one can prove there is a god, you can not prove there is not. So both sides require lenience in their views to understand that there are many different possibilities to the world we live in and that we will likely never know the answer. The point is not to prove either side is right or wrong, but to live together in tolerance and respect.
“You cannot prove there is not”? That’s nothing more than another lie spread be theists. The absence of any evidence alone is proof for most except the most deluded.
SO I ask, do you believe in Zeus, Aphrodite, Loki, or any of the other gods? If not, why not? Prove they do not exist.
Where is your god? If one exists, why doesn’t he show himself? (or herself, sorry, Aphrodite) At least offer undeniable evidence such as actually doing something obvious and undeniable. It doesn’t happen, never has, never will. If you wish to discuss specific gods, I am ready to demonstrate similar non-existence of them, too. Are you willing to disprove any of the others?
Live together in tolerance and respect? Considering that most theists are the most intolerant and disrespectful people in the world, you’re preaching to the wrong choir.
What’s ironic is how religion demands respect when they have done nothing to earn it. As I said elsewhere, when respect is demanded, it is an admission that it isn’t deserved, only desired.
It’s interesting you assumed I have a god. I did not state that I am on either side only that I respect both for what they are because we can not really know the answer. There are going to be disrespectful and intolerant people regardless of whatever beliefs they may have. However, I feel that despite my own beliefs I must be tolerant and respectful of others because if I do not behave that way, how can I expect others to behave that way towards me? I say this in respect to all forms of gods including those you have listed above not only to a Christian god. I also respect those who do not believe any of these gods exist and to those who are still unsure which side they take. I also find it interesting that you insist on generalizing theists as the most intolerant and disrespectful people when you are not willing to give them any tolerance or respect. I don’t believe that the point is to respect and tolerate religion, but to respect and tolerate people. When people stop trying to prove that they are right and others are wrong and start giving basic respect to everyone including those who are different from themselves, then we will live in a much more peaceful world.
It’s interesting how everything is about you. I speak in general terms and use “you” in the generic sense but you leap to the conclusion that it must be only for yourself. Get over it, it is not.
I am not generalizing that theists are intolerant and disrespectful. I am stating it as a fact. I grew up in the USA in the 50s and have a lot of experience with christians. So I do know what I am talking about.
Tell me, how many atheists have told someone they are doomed to eternal punishment for not believing as they do? How many atheists have bombed medical clinics or murdered doctors because they perform abortions?
How many atheists have shunned, abused, or murdered people for their beliefs? When have atheists tried to pass laws to force everyone to engage in atheist practices?
I admit I have avoided doing business with companies that have the little fish in the adds or are overtly religious. That’s simple self-protection. I know that not every person that is a devout believer in some religion is a dishonest. But I have been cheated enough by “good god-fearing folks” enough that I am certainly extra cautious about them.
I totally agree with you about respect and tolerance. I wonder when the Christians, Muslims and Jews are going to start doing that? I’m not holding my breath.
I am 13 years old and was never introduced to God by my family. I never went to church as a child. My family are christians but not active ones. Yet, somehow, i still found a way to believe in and love God. I pray every night because God talks to me in little things every day. I’m not saying, you can’t believe what you want, go ahead, don’t listen to people who are yelling at you for believing what you do. However, i do disagree. I love God, i don’t fear him. He helps me in my daily life. I don’t want to shove my religion down your throat, but please don’t shove yours down ours.
First, I am sorry that you have fallen into the delusional lies of religion. Curiously, I was 13 when I came to the realization that all religion was fake and meant for nothing more than to allow one small group of people to control the thoughts, actions, and speech of a larger group. So maybe there is hope for you, yet.
God does not talk to you. That is another mental process called “talking to yourself”.
One more i. I do not have a religion. “Atheism is a religion” is one more lie spread by theists. Atheism is not a “belief” either. If atheism is a religion, then not playing baseball is a sport and not collecting seashells is a hobby. Get it?
No one has said that you personally are “shoving religion down my throat”. But that is what theists do in many ways. If you look around you with clear thinking and an open mind, you will see evidence of it every day. Laws pushing religious beliefs, public money used to promote religion, religion permitted special privileges such as no taxes, and freedom from criticism and questioning. The list could go on for a long time.
When have I shoved my knowledge (not beliefs) on anyone? Have I said you MUST become atheist or suffer an eternity of torture? Have I tried to pass any laws gibing atheists special privileges such as religion enjoys? If you think carefully about it and read what has actually been said, you will see that everything I have posted is the truth.
The evidence of that is no one has been able to show that it is not true. Many have complained, as you are doing. Many have told me to shut up because free speech and critical thinking are fatal to religion. But furnish independently verifiable proof that anything I have said is not true? Not one person has done that. Most simply dodge the question and pretend it was never asked. That’s much easier than thinking.
It doesn’t matter what sort of religion or non-religion you subscribe to. The person by the preposed name of James Smith is trolling. Just let it stop, he’ll enjoy being the smartest person here, and will continue on to troll other religious posts.
Gah, you’re just as bad as the freaking fundie trolls on the atheist sties.
Posting under the name of another is a certain sign of an asshole that needs to be banned from ever using a computer again. What a cowardly little worm you show yourself to be.
You say you don’t like it when Theists try to force their views upon you. I have seen none of that by anyone here except you.
You came to a website that had some cute little sayings by children and attacked the blog and it’s content with YOUR views and you’re doing it to the others here also. You are NOT allowing them the same freedom you claim to believe in which is to believe the way they want.
I’m a Christian and proud of it and I never force my views on anyone but I will be praying for you for both wisdom and tolerance as those are things you’re surely lacking.
He’s complaining because it’s EXTREMELY unlikely that those children came to the idea of God on their own and through their own mental reasoning. Their parents inflicted their views on the child. The child has neither the mental capacity nor the confidence to argue even if they do feel what they’re being told is wrong.
Indoctrination (in my eyes, and likely James’ based on his posts) is child abuse, pure and simple.
Religion is the dumbest thing and yes, brainwashing children IS child abuse. You may not like it, but facts are facts whether you or anyone likes them or not.
Child abuse? It is our job as parents to teach our children while they are young what is right and what it wrong. My views are that the christian way is right so i will teach my children that. It is then my child’s responsibility to test those views for him/her self when he is old enough to make an educated decision. Not teaching and educating my children is neglect and wrong.
Just as i am sure you will teach your children your views if you have not and by your reasoning not teaching them about God is child abuse..have you thought of that?
“It is then my child’s responsibility to test those views for him/her self when he is old enough to make an educated decision. ”
So you admit a child’s mind is not intellectually capable of questioning your views? Meaning that the child has no choice but to accept your view as fact or incur your disapproval?
You said it yourself, children aren’t capable of making the educated reasoning, so you could tell them ANYTHING and they would believe you.
Personally, I don’t think it’s a good idea to tell a child about a God who does not judge others based on the totality of their actions, but rather by what they profess to believe. I spent many nights as a child in tears grieving for family members and people who were “burning in hell” for simply not believing.
Mr Brent Beach, It seems that if we went by your views, everything we teach our children would be some form of “indoctrination.” Should we let them roam free, doing whatever their little hearts desire? You admit that a child is not intellectually capable of making an educated decision about what is right and wrong, and you think that they should be given no direction? What would civilization be like in 100 years?
First of all, I’d like to state that I don’t think it’s possible to raise a child without “giving direction” so I doubt I could be asserting that. Now, I’m not against presenting information to a child, quite the opposite. It’s when people snap at their child for questioning the existence of God, or scaring them with tales of burning agony in a lake of fire, gnashing of teeth and so forth that I call it child abuse.
It took me 18 years to realize that I didn’t need to be afraid of hell anymore. It took me 18 years to realize that a just god would not hold it against me that I did not believe in him. How I wish the idea had never been told to me.
How afraid I was, just a boy, picturing his mother burning in a lake of fire for not going to church on Sunday, picturing his sister’s burning flesh screaming for help while I resided up in heaven, because I had chosen the right path. I remember thinking: maybe better to be in hell with my family, than in heaven with God. Any god that would take one of my wonderful family member’s to hell for some finite crime or for something like not believing, is no god I wish to worship nor be with.
Wow, I don’t know what kind of terrible person told you things like that when yuo were a child but, I do agree, it was horrible to say anything like that to a child. My father is a pastor and always told us that heaven is a wonderful place where all the troubles of the world are forgotten. When someone died, we never assumed they were going to hell because of what they believed at the time of death. we simply prayed for them. You never know what a person believed when they were younger, and I was taught that salvation is an eternal thing, never to be lost by how you change your mind later in life.
I also noticed in an earlier post that you mentioned that you were taught that God judges people based on what they believe rather than how they lived their lives. But there is still a judgement day, where everyone answers for everything they have ever done, good or bad. Belief in Jesus Christ gets you a seat in heaven, that’s true, but even the ones that make it there have to answer for their actions. The sins may be payed for, but it doesn’t mean you are off the hook.
I swear that I am not trying to preach to you, I just want you to see that the horrible things that were told to you as a child does not apply to all Christian families, or any other religion for that matter. Children who are scared into believing in God things tend to grow up skeptical about religion in general, and hateful towards people who “walk the path of righteousness” I guess you could say. So I do agree with you, that children should never be snapped at or punished for questioning anything they are told, instead people should sit their children down and explain to them why they believe what they believe and never ever use it to scare them.
No one ever told me my mom was going to hell, it was my thought. They told me what it took to get into heaven, and my mother did not fit those criteria so I “knew” she was going to hell. I began examining every person I knew by these criteria to determine if they were going to hell. I cried for all of them, even the possibility was too much for me to handle.
I definitely don’t think that my experience and reaction is reflective of the majority, but I do believe that what I was told WAS reflective of what most people were told.
My parents (nor the pastor involved) had no way of knowing that I would react that way, as I’m sure they told it to me the same way they would’ve told anyone. However, I did react badly and I hope to keep my future child from suffering similarly.
If I were to teach my child about Christianity, I would omit the necessity of belief to get into heaven as I’ve never found that to be a just rule. People often are unable to choose what they believe. For example, people from the middle east suffer ENORMOUS social pressure to stay Muslim, and because there are so few dissenters, the fact that everyone around them believes reinforces the belief all the more! These people have no chance of accepting Jesus, and an all-loving god would not begrudge them because of their place of birth.
In my eyes, being a good person should be the only requirement for a seat in heaven.
Thank you for your reply! I’m happy to know that there are those who will be more careful in what they tell their children. I can tell that you really read what I wrote and thought about it too, which is honestly the most I could ask for. Thank you!
We may disagree on what to believe but I can tell you genuinely care, which is so valuable and so little seen; So, I’m satisfied!
I don’t mean to offend any Muslims when I say this, but I completely agree on that point. That is one culture where people are sucked in as children and I imagine there would be a lot of pressure from their family all the way up to the government to stay with it. I myself have no problem with Islam, but the way the Middle Eastern countries go about enforcing the faith is terrible. There is no choice, and without a choice how can their truely be any faith?
I’m glad we were able to have this discussion Brent B. It’s nice to be able to air your opinions without being judged or attacked for them. 🙂
Abuse? Parents “indoctrinating” their children is actually just parents passing on what they believe to be true moral values to their children. Religion is a big part of peoples’ lives, and it needs to be addressed in every household. When a parent tells a child anything, they usually believe it. This applies to religious and atheist households alike. That doesn’t mean that this will hold. There are plenty of children who were raised in religious households that become skeptical of the institution and of the beliefs, and subsequently renounce their faith and claim themselves to be atheists. There are also those who were raised in atheistic households who later discover “G-d” and can sometimes become devoutly religious. Asking a parent not to teach a child about G-d if they believe in him is like asking them not to teach children not to steal; it’s nearly impossible for a child to find their own set of morals and beliefs without being guided by their parents.
Tell me exactly how I have been “forcing my views” on anyone? Have I demanded that anyone do as I say? Have I insisted upon passing my views into law? For that matter have I said that anyone here has been forcing their views on me?
Wwat I have said is that theists do these things consistently and that brainwashing of children is child abuse. Yes it is. Theists don’t think it is because it is their sickness being forced on children. If I demanded that their children were thoroughly indoctrinated into worshiping Ra, Zeus, or Aphrodite, they would be demanding my head. But, being hypocrites is as ingrained in theists as is delusional belief in a god.
Yes, I have thought about what my children believe and I taught them to think for themselves and believe what the evidence and rational thinking led them to believe. I taught them to question everything, including what I told them. I hope that is at least part of the reason they are happy and well-adjusted today.
You teach children christianity? Have you thought about whether that is something true? If you actually read the bible, as I have, and thought about what you have been taught in an objective manner, you might reconsider your decisions ans beliefs. I personally don’t care what you believe as long as you are not one of those trying to vote your religion and force those beliefs upon me.
Dee, you’re a liar. Yo DO force your beliefs on others and you are doing it here. You are essentially telling me to shut up. That’s typical of christians. Free speech is only for them so they can jam the christian lie into everyone without others being permitted rebuttal or criticism of christian ravings. But then, “hypocrite” and “christian” are semantically equal.
Finally, those may be “cute children’s sayings” to some. But to rational people they are evidence of brainwashing and child abuse as much as if they were complaining of “bad touch”. I wouldn’t expect theists to understand that any more than they understand truth and rational thinking.
James….By your reasoning it’s child abuse to teach a child that their parents will always love them because as we all know some will disown their children. It’s child abuse to teach a child to dream because dreams don’t always come true and they get shattered. It’s child abuse to teach a child to hope because in this world there is no hope.
You call everyone here arrogant, ignorant and stupid when they disagree with you yet you are do nothing but repeat the same arguments over and over.
You are here not to force your beliefs on others but to stir up a heated discussion and debate and doing it poorly in my opinion and YES this is my opinion just as your spouting and rinse repeat tactics are yours.
That’s the nice thing about a free and open internet. Anyone can express their opinion. Even when it is as illogical, uninformed, and ignorant as yours.
If I repeat the arguments, it’s because people of limited intellects are unable to grasp the point on a single explanation.
I am NOT here to stir up anything but to simply express my opinion. I do respond to people when they reply. First of all, it would be rude to ignore people, no? Second, I reply in a similar manner to those addressing me. If they are polite and rational, so am I. If they are rude and arrogant, I have no problem stating that. What many mistake for insults are nothing more than statements of observed fact. If anyone doesn’t like the statements, change the facts that led to them.
Yes, it’s child abuse to brainwash children into mythical beliefs. You ignored my example of what if someone were indoctrinating them into something else. Ignoring statements you can’t or don’t want to answer is am easy way of convincing yourself you have made a point when you have done nothing at all.
@hungrytroll That’s exactly the type of intelligent, well-thought out, rational comment I expected. Just another internet moron thinking he’s clever but really being a half-wit.
I love the way so many avoid replying to my questions and direct statements except to say they don’t like them. No reason, that would require thinking and maybe even (gasp!) research for facts (omigawd, facts!)
That’s how people get to believe that “god did it” for everything. It’s far easier than thinking and trying to understand truths. I call that being an intellectual and ethical coward. I see it every day.
You people have become boring. YOu aren’t even original enough to think up decent insults, much less be entertaining with your nonsense. I’m outa here. All of you ego-challenged people that need the last word to feel like a real person, have at it. I’ve had enough amusement from the back peddling and weak excuses.
“statements of observed fact.” It is impossible for you to say that teaching children about G-d is brainwashing and call it fact. Facts are pieces of knowledge that cannot be disproved through logic (i.e. the sky is blue, the sun sets in the west, rises in the east.) The classification of something as “brainwashing” is completely subjective. The issue of brainwashing is an ethical one, and almost all ethics are subjective, even within a society. One example is assisted suicide: some believe that it is the patients’ choice what to do with their lives, some people say it is wrong to take someone in such an unnatural fashion. Call the debate logical all you want, but there are clearly visible emotional motives hidden under the arguments on both sides. If the human race was purely logical, then everyone would come to the same conclusions and there would be no strife. Alas, that’s not the case.
L, Brainwashing is an established fact and the techniques are well-know. Let’s examine some.
The same information is repeated many times.
The information is not permitted to be questioned.
It most be repeated by rote many times by the subject.
Peer pressure is applied to make the subject conform.
Do any of these sound familiar? It’s exactly how children are indoctrinated into religion. So brainwashing is a fact. You may not like it, but it’s still a fact.
True the human race isn’t logical. You demonstrate that well enough to satisfy me on that point.
James, just a quick question. Yes, brainwashing is real, but let’s review the facts.
The same information is repeated many times.
Is that like you saying that theists are typical, illogical, abusing children along the way?
The information is not permitted to be questioned.
When people present arguments, you simply state “a typical Christian dodge…” or whatever, and just feed it back into a negative state of mind.
It must be repeated by rote several times.
Most people on here have said the same thing over and over against your arguments…
WAIT! I’ve got it!
You’re trying to brainwash people into further believing in their religion!! Got it. Makes WAY more sense now!
I thought this was really cute and then unfortunately I started reading the comments. @ James, there are some things that you should just keep to yourself. You’re not making any friends here.
Keep to myself? In other words, I don’t like what you’re saying, so just shut up. You have no coherent replies, so proof that I am wrong, so it’s just shut up! How typical of those with no intellectual capacity to debate. Freedom of speech is only for those that agree with your delusions?
What makes you think I am interested in making friends with anyone on here? I have plenty of friends that are not delusional jerks that demand agreement or silence.
You have an opinion, that’s great. I never said that you were right nor wrong. I just think the way that you approached the subject and have basically called everyone who has tried to explain their point of view to you a moron. And sorry, what delusions? I just find it unfortunate that you have taken something that was meant to put a smile on someone’s face and I can’t speak for everyone else, but you definitely ruined it for me.
Who has tried to explain their point of view? Not one. What most have said is “Shut UP! We can’t reply logically with facts, so just shut up!”
The delusions, as I have very plainly indicated, OK, maybe not plainly enough for you, are religious beliefs. If people were espousing that kind of nonsense on any other subject but religion, they would be shut away where they could receive treatment. But religion has been sheltered from criticism for so long that most people accept any insanity as being reasonable.
I’m sorry if I ruined anything for you unless it is your belief in religion. Then I did you a favor.
Tell me. what evil person forced you to read any of it? Did they have a weapon? A gun, knife, club, or just use the threat of physical violence? No matter what method they used, you have legal recourse. If they made you sit in front of a computer to read when you wished to leave, that is technically kidnapping on most jurisdictions. YOu don’t have to accept that klnd of thing, have them arrested!
Everyone wants you to shut up because every one of your posts starts with an insult. No, you’re not getting your point across because everyone just finds you to be rude and ignorant.
Jessica, clearly, you only read what you want to read. Every one of my posts do not start with an insult. Try reading some again, not hoping to see something you don;t like. Also, what you view as insults are no more than simple statements of observed facts.
If I am rude and ignorant, what are those that tell me to shut up? Or those that say I am a piece of shit? How about the person that posted under my name? But maybe you have two standards here? One for me, and a far more generous one for those that you like. I have the same standard for everyone. Those that reply in a polite, rational manner get the same treatment from me. Perhaps you have heard of the concept “Do unto others…”?
I don’t expect theists to understand my point. As Dr. House said, “If you could reason with theists, there wouldn’t be any theists.” Or another thing I understand is that, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.” That doesn’t mean I will denied the right of freedom of speech. Nor does it mean you have to reply or even read my posts. All of that is your choice. It’s called “free will”. Maybe you have heard of that, too? I know it’s a slippery subject for many religions but it does exist and you are exercising it now.
Try thinking about it.
Please excuse any typos here. I have a dog on my lap because he is terrified of fireworks and people are setting firecrackers off here right now.
Sure, you have the right to say whatever you want. There is, however, something of an unwritten code about which things should be said when. When this unwritten laws are breached, the perpetrator has to face the consequences.
(If you claim to be ignorant to this, think about something for a second: if an overweight person asks you if they are fat, would you say yes? Or would you keep your mouth shut to avoid offending them? I think that is one of the dangers of the internet: people become too honest for their own good because of the lack of immediate retribution. An example of this is all the new suicides stemming from cyberbullying)
Hey James, if you’re still reading I’d just like to say…I love you. Let God fill your heart and maybe it will grow three sizes by Christmas. Or not. ‘Cause really, God can’t do that (maybe heart edema or something could). However, I do love you because you were able to prove that DFTT (Don’t Feed The Troll) is still not a universally accepted comment policy, something which I have been pondering for weeks.
You say you’re out of here, but please don’t leave. For the sake of internet comment sections everywhere, come back so we can contain your, er, “unique views” here and avoid contaminating other sites. For our children, the same children who wrote these letters to God, please come back 🙂
Teehee, apparently, you have a comprehension deficit. I’ll type slowly so you can understand. There is no god.
DO you mean the same innocent children that were born without their minds being contaminated with the lies and sickness of religion?
You don;t love me and you don’t love anyone else. YOu are far too arrogant in your own “faith”. All you wish to do is prevent disagreement and contain those who are able to prove their points when they disagree with you.
Why didn’t you listen to my advice dear? I told you not to contaminate other places…though to be fair you commented there earlier. And yeah, I am an arrogant bastard (guess that makes us a perfect pair), but not b/c of God/god. I’m arrogant because I know who and what I’m dealing with…a person hunched over their computer typing away negative remarks sites they stumbleupon hoping to get some angry replies. Not from me though, I’m fine just throwing any websites you comment in this here thread for a good laugh when I’m bored. 😉
I may owe you an apology. Apparently, I have said something that led you to think I care about what you think. If I did, I am sorry, I never meant to give you that impression. The thoughts of a total fool like you are never significant to me.
You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.
As always, you ignore the real issues because you have no rational reply. Instead you make pathetic attempts to distract from your own failings by introducing non-applicable items.
Doesn’t it bother you at all that you show up as a hopeless mental defective every time you post? Maybe not, you keep doing it.
You don’t need to apologize, just imagining the sound of your haggard whimpering as you beg mother for five more minutes on the computer to write to dear old Teehee is enough apology from me. But, *sigh*, fine I’ll play the game once:
“You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.”
Not true, I’d reveal myself to be a worthless moron no matter who you are! Honesty is the best policy.
“Instead you make pathetic attempts to distract from your own failings by introducing non-applicable items.”
Lol, you spelled pathetic wrong. It’s spelled j-a-m-e-s.
“…as a hopeless mental defective”
Well now, I like the sound of that. I will now and forever more be: Hopeless Mental Defective Man! (cue fanfare, but not too much or else cuts off the announcer saying my name. But it has to be just enough or…actually lets move on) You may address me as Mr. HMD Man. Sir. Yes that’s better, Mr. HMD Man Sir. I shall not wear a cape, since Edna from The Incredibles made it quite clear that is a baaad thing to do. But no tights either, because that’s frackking ridiculous. I mean, Superman was cool but I’d rather be light and airy down there when flying at supersonic speeds around the world, amiright?. What jobs shall I do? Maybe you can help me? I don’t have many superpowers, or really any talents (recall my awesome superhero name), but I’ve got a big heart. I will stand on the roofs of houses and scream down useless advice to the passerby. I will also ghost people and make farting noises behind them. Who am I? I’m the hero you don’t deserve, and definitely don’t need. I am…Mr. Hopeless Mental Defective Man. Sir. Gonna take a while to get used to that title 🙂
Before you told everyone “to stop reading for what isn’t there” or “looking at what isn’t there” or however you nonsensically wrote it. So, when one girl said you were rude and just insulted everyone and you denied it.. thought i’d just tally up your lovely comments for you here.
I may owe you an apology. Apparently, I have said something that led you to think I care about what you think.
Doesn’t it bother you at all that you show up as a hopeless mental defective every time you post?
You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.
You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.
Fuck it, too many in here. Just stop– everyone has a religion and passes it down to their own kids. Later in life when they’re older, they have the free will to continue to believe in what they’ve been taught or find a new religion or decide to believe in nothing. Either way, it doesn’t concern any of us posting on here.
I maintain my appreciation for little Larry’s letter.
I never said I didn’t insult people. I said I made simple statements of obvious facts. That these may be seen as insults are not my problem. Apparently, it is OK with you that people insult me, but you are such a two-faced jerk that you don’t like anything I do.
Everyone does not have a religion. There have always been people that have been rational thinkers. The founding fathers of the USA are some that come to mind. Despite the constant lie christians tell that the USA was “founded on christian principles by the the christian founding fathers,” it isn’t true. They can tell that lie all they want. It is still a lie.
Also, not everyone is able to overcome the brainwashing they had as children. If they could, religion would have died out long ago. But if, it makes you feel better to believe your nonsense, go ahead. Just stop voting it into laws and stop expecting taxpayer support. All religions should pay their share of taxes like any other business and stop freeloading on everyone else.
Again, just because some moron like you says something, that doesn’t make it true.
Yes, that is an insult, but it is also a fact. You are a moron and shouldn’t be permitted around rational people. There are institutions for mental defectives such as yourself.
Well that’s not very nice. I actually never insulted you sir and I am certainly not a moron. You don’t even know if I’m atheist or Christian or Jewish or anything else. No, not everyone has a religion you’re right. Everyone has something they believe in though, like you don’t believe in anything religious, that’s still believing something. That comment was really all it took for you to assume that I need to be in a mental hospital, huh? Like most of the other commenters on here? Geez, you’re a fiesty one aren’t ya.
Here’s another mistake you make: you assume that religious people are all completely irrational. But look at Einstein. He was probably one of the most influential physicists and mathematicians, yet he believed in G-d. Your statement “Everyone does not have a religion. There have always been people that have been rational thinkers.” is what i was referring to, in case you’re going to pull the “you’ve got no evidence” argument. Also, the founding fathers, though they may have not been christians, at least some of them are said to be deists. Here’s an example of a website describing Thomas Jefferson’s Deism: http://www.nobeliefs.com/jefferson.htm. He believed in a G-d, yet he was still very rational.
Here are also some einstein quotes, in case you’re interested. http://www.spaceandmotion.com/albert-einstein-god-religion-theology.htm
You do not. There is no jesus and never was. I have demonstrated that here several times and not one person has shown that I am wrong or denied that what I said was not true.
You don’t love me, you simply spout a lie because it sounds good in the fantasy world of your beliefs.
Do you love Satan? If you believe your religion, Satan is also one of your god’s creation and “the most beloved of the angels”. Then is he not as worthy of you love as any other creation? Just because he “fell from grace” is that a reason to not love him? If you apply that bit of hypocrisy, how can you love anything not of your faith?
The obvious answer, given the observed behavior of christians, is you do not. It is only another cover-up for your genuine feelings.
It is much easier to live with the delusions than the truth. It’s hard to admit to your real feelings, but a lot more honest.
One more thing, what you said is very offensive to me. But offending people has never worried theists.
How about if I were a devil worshiper and said I would “sacrifice a couple of babies to Lord Satan for you”? Would you be offended?
“Jesus loves you” and “I’ll pray for you” is equally offensive. If you want to do something for me, do something that works; send money. “One pair of hands working is more effective that a million clasped in prayer.”
I’m sorry it offended you, but I speak what I believe, just like you.
Also, I do love Lucifer. I believe Lucifer’s fallen grace is symbolic of people and the evil that does reside with us. No, I am not a Satanist, I just believe that even the most broken of creatures deserves to be loved.
You don’t have to believe in Jesus! That’s okay. If you live your life differently, believe differently, speak differently, that’s totally chill! And if you wanted to sacrifice babies, that’s your own doing. I’m not saying I would kill anything, so I don’t see how that is really a logical analogy, but sacrificing babies would probably lead to some legal trouble for you and I don’t think you’d care to much for that.
Oh and you can’t judge how I feel. Like you told several other posters, you don’t know me. :).
I know you don’t care if you offended me. After all, you have the only possible truth on your side, don’t you?
You give a lot of lip service to love, but I am certain you never gave loving Lucifer (Bringer of light) a thought until I mentioned it.
Like most theists, you seem to be incapable of understanding the difference between “beliefs” and facts. Beliefs are a viewpoint with no supporting evidence. Facts are items with independently verifiable evidence. Gravity is a fact. You can drop a rock on your foot and it will fall every time with the identical, predictable acceleration. Jesus is a belief. There is no supporting evidence. Not one contemporary account of a jesus character exists. The first mention of any jesus is in the gospel of Mark, written from 40 to 100 years later, depending upon which biblical scholar you believe.
The Romans never mention anyone like jesus. Someone that was supposed to have such influence, socially, politically, and religiously, performed miracles, and was tried and executed had not one word recorded about him. That’s rather strange when you think about how well they kept records of everything else of note. Look up Attis, Horus, and Mithra. Then you will see how the jesus myth was “borrowed” to be used to bolster a new religion with old fables.
I thought the site was about cute letters written to god from children that make you giggle why does someone have resort to bible bashing? =\ Its adorable and you are killing it =\
If I am killing religion and the child abuse of brainwashing children, then I am making the world a better place. Furthermore, I am doing it without hiding behind a fake ID.
Exactly what have you ever done that you can point to with pride?
“Making the world a better place.” you know damned well that no matter what you type on here, no one will leave this website with their opinions changed in the slightest. Starting arguments and infuriating honest, good people who are just looking for a laugh is hardly an improvement. And how the hell do you know what people have or have not done? You can’t judge a person’s achievements by comments they post! You say that you stick to logic, but you’re being as insulting as the next guy.
Yes, I am being insulting to you. But you have earned it, deserve t and I am not one to cheat you out of it.
If you wish to make the world a better place you can improve the average IQ of the human race and the general ethical standards of the world. Go jump off a cliff.
I see now, we have all earned it while you are completely immune to blame and have been completely rational all this time.
Insulting my IQ does nothing to help your point because it is not a point, it is just an immature jibe at my intellect, which i am comfortable with. I would retort with a similar insult, but it seems like everything you hear that does not line up exactly with your beliefs must be written by someone inferior, and therefore warrants none of your time.
I stopped reading this for a while, and realized how absolutely ridiculous this discussion is. Reply as you may, you can even tell yourself that you’ve won out with your amazing, god-like intellect and have put us sheeple in our place for all i care. I will be deleting any reply emails I get. Good riddance.
L, insulting your IQ is almost impossible to avoid. It IS the point. I am sure you are “comfortable” with it, you must hear it a lot.
I hear many things that do not line up with my thinking. Kaitlyn, for example. The difference is, I respect her as an honest, sincere person. even if I do not agree with her on many points, that doesn’t mean that she is inferior, it means we see things differently.
If you had been reading my post, you would have noticed I have other religious friends, not all christian, that I mentioned on different occasions.
If I never gain hear from someone as mean-spirited and ignorant as you, it will improve my life. There are others on here that I enjoy discussions with. You are not one of them. Please go away, far away.
oh quit it with the ‘not hiding behind a fake ID’ you’re still on the computer nimrod. you’re still behind the computer like everyone else posting on here, congratulations for putting your smiling face and name. who cares
Apparently, you are still seeing only what you want to see. No surprise there, at all. I did plainly state that anyone that wishes to stop hiding and confront me face-to-face, I’ll pay there way here. Then we shall see who is hiding and who is not.
I especially extend this offer to you. What’s your excuse now?
Come on down and talk to me like you do on here. I’ll still be smiling.
What else are you saying there was to see with that comment?? I never commented on your insane offers to fly someone to Brazil, just that you retort a lot with ‘you’re hiding behind a computer.’ Sure, I’ll come to Brazil then, would you like to discuss my trip? You look pleasant enough, I’d like to have a little chat about God and no God. I appreciate your special offer to me! Let me know when is good for you, in all seriousness. I have some vacation days I would like to use. I still maintain that I am not particularly offensive, so I’d probably still call you a nimrod in person sir. Which is fair since you called me a moron previously. 🙂 Let me know!
All you have to do is send me your information via my blog or Yahoo Messenger (slrman420) and I will buy you a ticket here.
You talk to me in person the way you do in here and you will have a “life changing experience”. Do not expect me to be so stupid as to send you a ticket that you can cash in and keep the money. It will be an electronic booking only refundable to me.
Again, you cannot comprehend accurately what you read. I didn’t call you a moron, I said you WERE a moron. That you cannot comprehend the difference demonstrates the accuracy of my statement.
Also, you are the one that made an issue of typos. Or did you conveniently forget that, too? I know I have pointed out such errors in others, but it was always in passing, not the entire point of my post. But you must not be able to understand that, either.
Were a moron, are a moron, whatever dude. You are still harping on things like that. I also never made an issue of typos myself, so not sure where you’re going with that one. You also previously said “what’s my excuse now?” implying I previously had an excuse, which I didn’t, so what were you referring to dear sir? So please don’t try and be nitpicky with me about tenses and whatnot. I also did not infer that typos were the point of your post, just that you made the point itself at one point. Geez, touchy aren’t we.
Regardless, what information do you need from me? I am fine posting it here. I have no desire to contact you privately and having you be rude on another platform, so let me know what info you need and book me that ticket! I do however, think you are stupid to make such an offer to a random stranger on the internet. I could be a crazy person. Or someone trying to get a free vacation and never come to meet you. Or as you said, cash in on a ticket. Can’t wait to see you in Brazil! I expect a return ticket as well, obviously.
PS I have seen you mention this “life changing experience” multiple times so far. What are you referring to mister? Please do explain so I know what I am getting myself into, thanks!
I will need your real name, address, telephone, passport number, and departure city. You will need a Brazilian Visa. That’s $100 for Americans. I cannot pay that for you, but I will reimburse you.
The ticket will be one way, but do not worry. Your return flight will be taken care of either by the airlines or the consulate, whichever is the current agreement regarding deportations. After your fine is paid you are not likely to be held any longer by Brazilian authorities. At least that has been the case before.
I am not concerned about you never coming, I can then get a refund on the ticket. YOu have no intention of coming anyway. The life-changing experience will be what happens after you talk to me in person the way you have on here. Your life will be different. Your thinking, walking, talking, and appearance will all change. YOu will not be the first.
If you were half as smart as you think you are, you’d find out who you’re messing with. I’ve given places where you can find out who and what I am, but most don’t want to know. Better to maintain your illusions than to expose yourself to the truth.
YOu also are the one that made a big deal out of typos. So your own posts show that you are a liar. If not, you are so far in your own delusions, you are unable to separate them from reality.
Yes yes, you’re a big health buff who knows martial arts. That is quite impressive, United Fighting Arts Federation? Nicely done sir. I’m not messing with you, simply engaging in some good old conversation. I still have not been all that disrespectful mister, especially considering some of the nastier comments on here directed towards you. So is that supposed to be a threat sir? And assuming I’d be deported hm? You are the strangest person sir. And yes, I’m assuming most people do not go researching people they are butting heads with on a public forum such as this.
Again, just for clarification good sir, I did not make any big deals out of typos you have made, although they were plenty for being somewhat of a journalist. I called you out once simply on criticizing someone else for them after berating another who previously corrected you. I am truly offended you have confused me with other posters :/ So no, I am not a liar and I am not delusional 🙂
Speaking of which, what delusions do you speak of sir? Again, we have not really argued anything over atheism or theism. I was expecting to fly out there to have some pleasant conversation over Brazil or your work for IBM.
@L To quote Louis Armstrong, “If you don’t know, can’t nobody tell you.” I’m sorry for your problem, but all you are doing is confirming what I said.
@ Stumbled Yes, you did make a big deal out of typos. YOu had two entire posts devoted to nothing else. That you think otherwise is a delusion of yours. That’s what I meant by that.
No, we will not have a pleasant conversation here or anywhere else. Your focus is upon making me look bad by pointing out typos and evading the issues. Why should anyone expect to have a pleasant conversation with someone who only want to do that?
When non-citizens here are arrested, deportation follows after they have paid any fines or other penalties. Many countries are like that.
No matter, we both know you never had any intention of coming anyway.
“entire posts” make it sound as if I wrote novels, however, they were not. So get over it. It’s cool, I’ve been sarcastic this entire time, if that little gem went over your head. My focus was never to make you look bad. It was to point out some hypocrisy on your end. I’m not avoiding any issues at hand, because I never got involved in that to begin with. And you’re assuming I’d be arrested, that itself is a little ignorant yourself sir. And fuck no I never had any intention of visiting you. I’d have to be as crazy as you are sir! You will probably respond with some retort you think is clever or right and call me a moron yet again, but I vote that you step out of your mom’s house for a breath of fresh air! Adios senor! I hope one day when you die, and you decompose in the ground and help a tree grow, they print the bible on your pages! 🙂 Thanks Dane cook for that routine.
@sutmbled No, “Entire posts” does not sound like a novel. It means exactly what it says. A post with no other subject but one. But to you, things mean what you want them to mean, don’t they?
I understand sarcasm much better than you. “Sarcasm is a natural reaction to stupidity.”
Exactly what hypocrisy were you pointing out? Or is that another accusation without proof? You will define anything as being what you want, no matter what the facts, so let’s hear your definition of anything I have said as being hypocritical.
Assuming you would be arrested is not ignorant of me. It is based upon experience with the one other person that actually showed up. You really know very little of me and what I am here. Maybe you saw the movie “Fast and Furious V”? Vin Diesel had a line in there to Dwayne Johnson. “You’re a long way from home. This is Brazil!” It’s my home and I know how it works here.
Yes, you would be arrested, charged with assault, jailed and fined. I knew from the start you never had any intention of visiting me. I recognize internet bullies and cowards when I see them.
YOu call me crazy but complain that I insult people? That’s really crazy, but no worse than I expected from you.
Leave my family out of this, you arrogant piece of shit! My parents are both deceased and you even mentioning them is insulting and rude.
When you die, there will be an increase in the average intelligence level of humanity and a bog lean in the decency level. Go hide now, little boy. Or as W.C. Fields said, “Go away kid, you bother me.”
Your argument is that of many of the 7 year olds at the camp at which i volunteer: they pretend to know something, and if another child asks them what it is they retort “if you don’t know, i’m not gonna tell you!!” upon further investigation, they are revealed to have no idea what they’re talking about. Congratulations, you are about as mature as a 7 year old.
Well look at you making assumptions! As I said before, I was all for some pleasantries in Brazil. You can’t base all future experiences based on one previous Sir Angry. So yes, you have to admit, it’s pretty baseless to assume and forewarn against being arrested. I congratulate you on your quality taste in movies, I myself have never indulged in the fine Fast and Furious series, but if someone of your caliber saw them, well they must be excellent! Dude, I’ve already spelled out for you some little hypocritical moments of yours in previous posts. I’m not rewriting any because you’re too lazy to go back and read.
I’m actually a girl. Yet another wrong assumption. Baha, I love this make the troll angry page! I heard moms jerk trolls off after they make them sandwhiches, must be a sweet deal over there in Brazil!!! Ciao bambino!
And if there were god, it made you an arrogant coward that hides behind a false ID to insult others and not bother to back up your claims with any evidence. But then, that’s what religion is about, isn’t it?
ROFLMAO. Jasmine talked big, but when I came through, she became strangely silent. I was expecting a visit or at least a phone call. But noooooooooooooooo. 😀
Or, like you, is so terrified there is no way you’ll come within a hundred miles of someone that is your superior mentally, physically, end ethically. Given those criteria include just about everyone, you must live in a cave somewhere.
This “crabby old man” would love to see you confront me in person. We both know what the condition of your pants would be afterwards. Even the TSA would decline to search you. LMAO
YOu have everything you need to respond, my Yahoo Messenger ID, my cell phone, my blog, what do you want? If you can’t figure anything out from all of that, you shouldn’t be traveling alone anyway.
Then there is the visa for Brazil. They have standards and if you can’t figure out what to do from all of that, I doubt they would allow you in the country anyway.
If no-one else takes that ticket, I will, there’s not much chance of my actually meeting up with you as there are so many gorgeous friendly people that your offer of intellectual conversation about the existence of a God and purpose of religion may seem a little boring…
Also, how much spare time do you have? You seem to be spending a lot of time writing here…why not go for a walk and appreciate things outside of what you and others believe. I manage to get by without it ever crossing my mind.
FYI, I do walk every day. It’s part of my daily exercise routine. I do more each day than you probably do in a week.
When you are doing 1,000 push ups every week as I do, then you can make your snide little comments about “go for a walk”.
Yes, there are plenty of friendly, gorgeous people here.
I didn’t offer any intellectual conversation about the existence of god. There is no god so how can there be an intellectual conversation about it?
Believers reject any evidence or logical statements to the contrary and do not want to discuss, but to lecture.
I offered people an opportunity to talk to my face in the same insulting, outrageous terms they do on here. You will note that the same number of people have accepted that offer as there are that have proven that anything I have said is not true. (Hint, it’s a digit between 1 and -1)
One more thing, theists have beliefs. That’s accepting something with no supporting evidence and in spite of contrary evidence. It’s also called “faith”. I have knowledge gained from examining facts and independently verifiable evidence. That is nothing like beliefs. Not to worry, many people have a problem understanding the difference; mostly those with a lot of beliefs.
I am a religous person. I go to temple, I am a Bat Mitzvah. However, I do not believe in G-d. I interperate the torah as a story book filled with lessons I can use in everyday life. I believe in peace. I except other religions and do not try to convert others. I belive what i believe and pray the way i pray for me. James, you should believe what you believe for yourself. Dont try to change others minds because in all acuality, their beliefs doesnt change your life. Life how you want to live, but don’t try and make others cator to youre beliefs.
Good for you, Sarah. How refreshing to hear from someone that is honest and rational.
But, if you don’t believe in god, to who or what do you pray?
You say I should not try to change minds? But that’s what all theist do, proselytize constantly and try to pass their beliefs into law and force them upon others. All I do is point out the fallacies in religion and the flawed thinking of those who support it. For that, I am vilified, threatened, and told to “shut up”. Yep, that’s really religious love, tolerance, and kindness. Not to worry, I am accustomed to that as well and none ever responding with facts and verifiable evidence.
“point out the fallacies in religion and the flawed thinking of those who support it.” That is EXACTLY how debating works: you point out the flaws of an idea and show them to the opponent in the effort to change their mind. You can no longer say that you are not trying to change minds.
I think it’s wrong to associate crimes and evils in the world with religion. If religion did not exist, the crimes would continue. PEOPLE do bad things, religion does not act on its own. People may use religion’s name to justify themselves, but that doesn’t mean all religious people are that way.
And I was taken to church and taught the bible as a child, yet I am not religious today. The basic principles of religions are appealing to teach your child. It can’t be wrong to want your child to treat others well, to not lie or steal or cheat, which is what most religions teach. Whether they want to continue that faith when they’re older is up to them.
I have a lot of issues with Christianity, but I think it’s wrong to bash other things just because you don’t share that view.
Bad people do bad things. Some of them just happen to call themselves Christians. Christians cannot be blamed for the faults of society.
Good people will do good things. Bad people will do bad things. But for good people to do bad things takes religion. All you have to do is think about it. DO you think people would have bombed family planing clinics without religion? DO you think people would allow their own children to die of curable diseases if not for religion? Those are only two examples, but please think about it.
Yes, religion can be blamed for the things it causes people to do. Like it or not, that’s a fact.
I mean, some of those are just moral issues, not necessarily religious ones. I don’t think that conservative views stem only from religion. And those are extreme cases; I don’t think it’s fair to write off religion based on a small percentage of extremists. That’s like saying all Muslims are Al Qaeda or whatever.
I agree that many of these are moral issues. But religion claims to be the only source of morals. If you grant them that, then they are responsible for all moral issues. If the do not claim the moral high ground, then they must agree that one can “be good without god”. They can’t have it both ways. But they try that anyway.
I do not write off religion because of the extremists. I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly. Despite the number of times even I have personally challenged anyone to provide proof of any religion, not one person has ever done so. I am only one man. Imagine the countless others who have asked for verifiable proof and have been ignored.
No, not all muslims are Al Qaeda. But how many have stepped forward to denounce it?
Forgive me, i was referring to this quote: ” I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly.” Prove that one for me, if you are so damn sure it’s true.
Forgive me, i was referring to this quote: ” I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly.” Prove that one for me, if you are so damn sure it’s true.
I think that this is adorable. That it is sweet to think that kids can still have something to believe in. To think that these people believe that all the world is not cruel. Whether you believe in God or not, these people do and they trust in Him to make everything better. Don’t steer them to believe that the world is cruel and then we die. Whether there is a God or not, there’s more to life that cruel people.
We could teach children to believe in love, honesty, kindness, fairness in dealing with others, and helping those less fortunate. That would be a lot better than lying to them about what does not and never has, existed. The things I named do exist and have real value to everyone.
Who said to steer children to believe the world is cruel? Not I. Maybe someone who tells them they must obey some arbitrary and contradictory rules set down thousands of years ago or be condemned to an eternity of torture and agony. That sounds pretty cruel to me. Why teach them fear and trembling when hope and love are so much better?
Believing in a G-d does not mean believing in a rule book that he supposedly wrote a few thousand years ago. There are plenty of deists, who simply believe that the world could not have been created without some sort of omniscient force driving it. And just the use of the word G-d doesn’t mean that a person is a devout catholic. When someone says something mildly stupid, do you not sometimes say “oh my god” just because that’s the expletive you hear others using?
James, it is unfortunate that your ego blinds you from inapporopriate approach you have taken to innocent pictures. Do you yourself and everyone else a favor and put all of your opinions into a book. Write it all down, let the ignorance flow. Then those people in the world, who actually care what you think, can indulge all they want.
It is unfortunate that you project your own over-active ego on others. Do yourself a favor and stop reading. No one is forcing you to do so.
I could take the same tactic as so many on here have with me and tell you to just shut up. But I am not like that.
FYI, I am working on another book. Called “Conversations with Christians.” I’ll probably include a few of the things from this thread. Not just the hateful ones but the thoughtful, considerate ones, too. I know there are many, like you, that would prefer to demonize me and make me out to be a despicable person, but I am fair and honest. That’s a lot more than I can say for many on here.
James, as a fellow atheist that has tried to encourage theists to question religion, it is not worth the effort. Ignorant people cannot be changed, it just makes people hate you for no reason other than you disagree with them. However, I applaud you for your efforts.
This is directed at James, but there was no reply button so hopefully he checks this.
I’ll be open and honest and say that I am a Christian. And reading through what you have said, I feel that your opinion of Christian’s is based solely on how you have been treated by some “Christians” in the past. I understand that you disagree with our beliefs, and that is perfectly fine, you are entitled to your beliefs as we are entitled to ours. Obviously I can’t speak for those Christians that hurt you, but I promise that there are Christians out there who are grieving for you that you have had such awful experiences with “us”.
That being said, you have to realize that it is not CHRISTIANITY that is evil. If you have read through the Bible as you have said you have, (especially the words of Jesus) you will see that His teachings are about being kind to the grieving, brokenhearted, the widowed, the poor, etc. You cannot blame the fundamentals of the faith for the mistakes of those who supposedly follow it. People are by nature, greedy, power hungry, and selfish. Whether they claim to have the Holy Spirit in them or whether they think that the idea of the Holy Spirit is laughable. You have made a lot of generalizations about “theists” and innumerable logical fallacies. Although you claim to be looking for an intellectual conversation, you have not even ONE TIME defended YOUR beliefs. All you have done is insult and attack people who believe differently than you do. I am not saying that people on here have not done the same to you, that’s the thing about this all, no matter what side you’re on, there will always be people who do not behave the way they ought to. I’m sorry for that, and I’m sorry (in advance) if anything I say offends you, because I do not want to do that. I just want to defend my beliefs. Take it as you will.
Firstly, you mentioned the great evils of the church, such as the crusades and witch burning and the sort. Yes, that is evil, and terrible. As has been said numerous times however, that was not the problem of the beliefs of Christianity, that was the sin of the imperfect humans who got too big for their britches. But even the Bible has things to say about the hypocrites of the church (Romans 2:24 – The name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you).
I will be honest about the sins of Christianity– First we have The Crusades, Anti-Semitism in the Christian Era (perhaps the biggest proof that it is nothing to do with the faith of Christianity and everything to do with those claiming it), the Inquisition, the wars of religion, Salem witchcraft trials, many televangelists (who prey on people who are having weak moments), and social evils in general. When you add up all of those deaths caused by people claiming Christianity, you get about 17 million lives within the past 2,000 years. Yes, that is an unbelievably awful amount, but rather than looking at it as men doing evil BECAUSE of Christianity, you have to look at it as in SPITE of their Christianity.
Since I have been open about the sins of the church, I feel that I now have the right to do a comparison. Obviously if I went into more detail, I could write a whole book. So I’m just going to give names and numbers. Mao killed about 72 million people from 1948-1976, Stalin killed about 40 million, Hitler is responsible for 15 million (not including the deaths from the war in general), and then if you throw in other killings from atheistic or totalitarian states as a result of atheistic ideology, you get a number of more than 130 million in the 20th Century alone. So, if atheistic ideology has killed over 113 million more people in 100 years than “Christians” have in the past 2,000, I feel that it is either time to start being just as hard on yourself as you are on Christians, or leave the Christians’ past in the past.
People who claim to be Christians are by NO MEANS perfect. I know that there are some who get on their high-horse and claim to be all knowing and that they do know wrong and that they are perfect, but that is not what BIBLICAL Christianity is about. If anything, Biblical Christianity is acknowledging just how depraved we truly are and how there is no way that we can be anywhere near perfect, but that for some reason God loves us enough to do something about it. I’m not saying that Christians believe that we become perfect after being saved, I’m just saying that we believe that we are forgiven for it and we should try to not sin anymore.
Those are my beliefs, and honestly I absolutely love theological debates… I can definitely (intellectually) keep up with any atheist, using my own thoughts, science, and history. But I figure that keeping on one subject was enough for this response.
But as I have said, I do not believe that I am perfect, I do things wrong almost every day, I lie, I’ve stolen, I’ve hated, I’ve gossiped. All of that is wrong, I am not under any delusions that because I call myself a Christian, I am perfect and don’t do anything wrong, because I DEFINITELY do. But I’m just saying that it’s not CHRISTIANITY that is at fault for my failures, it’s my own. The church is full of hypocrites, I have met many and every time I sin, I am one. But atheists are too. That’s what we are asking YOU to acknowledge.
This is just a suggestion, since you have read the Bible, I’m assuming you are not against Christian literature. And since you’ve said that you like to consider honestly every argument that is presented, I think you should read the book “What if Jesus Had Never Been Born?” by D. James Kennedy and Jerry Newcombe. I read it like, 3 years ago and if I remember correctly, it’s just dealing with everything that you have said is wrong in the church from a brutally honest point of view, I think you would appreciate that because I think you feel that Christians like to brush their failures under the rug, this book doesn’t do that. I don’t remember if it’s the type of book to try and convert, honestly that’s not my goal, I just want you to read a book on Christianity that is honest ABOUT Christianity. So yeah, that’s my suggestion!!! I hope you have a great day and I hope I didn’t say anything to offend you. I just wanted to defend CHRISTIANITY (but not the sins of Christians). =)
Sure, you’re using the “No true Scotsman..” argument. Then you admit that people do bad things in the name of religion. I hope you realize that most of them would not consider you a “true christian” either.
A book that is honest about christianity. That’s exactly what I have been doing all my life. Christianity is indefensible. It is founded upon lies and hs been continuing to lie to this day. Here’s some reading for you. Look up Horus, Attis, and Mithra. You’ll see where the jesus myth was taken from. Also, think of this. There is not one contemporary account of any Jesus.
The first mention of any jesus character is in the Gospel of Mark. That was written from 40 to 100 years after the “facts”, depending on which scholar you believe. Isn’t it strange that the Romans, who otherwise kept excellent records, make no mention of someone who was supposed to have has such an effect politically and socially, performed miracles, fed the multitudes, and all of that?
It’s as if no one ever hear of George Washington unto the late 1800 when a biographer suddenly came up with a life story about a colonial who defeated the most powerful nation on earth and became the first leader of a new nation under an new political system. Think about it.
Actually, Jesus is mentioned in Gen 1:26 when God is saying to His son to make mankind in their own image. I believe you had said He had said that to Adam in an earlier post, however, he was created in Gen 1:27. So God was talking to his son, Jesus Christ. The first time people remember the actual name of Jesus being written in the Bible is in the book of Matthew 🙂
By the way, Hitler was a Christian and used his religion (Catholic) as part of the foundation for his hatred of Jews. That Stalin/Hitler/Pol Pot arguments is a very tired christian argument. None of these people did what they did because they were atheists (if they really were) but because they were intent upon suppressing what they regarded as threats to their power. Hmm, that’s what I see on here with all the “just shut up” people. They want to suppress me because the view me as a threat to the power of their beliefs to delude people.
So they call me troll, and much worse. Maybe Stalin et al learned their methods from theists?
First of all, I am definitely not (or at least wasn’t at the time) one of the “just shut up” people. I was very interested in having an intellectual conversation with you, but you have just shot that in the foot by being rude and condescending although you had no reason to be.
Second of all, those people that I listed were secular humanists, and the theology of secular humanism is, you guessed it, atheism. I am just going to say now that, I personally find you to be the single most irritating human being I have ever encountered. I would be more than willing to have this discussion with you, but you are so arrogant that you feel that you are 100% correct and everyone else is just out to get you. That is not the case, most of the people here would probably be perfectly willing to talk with you, because unlike you, most people enjoy having stimulating conversations. But you are so arrogant and rude that you think you are right and the rest of the world is wrong (and although what you said about other atheists is somewhat true, I’m pretty sure that even they would be embarrassed by you). And also, if you would have READ what I wrote, you would see that I was, in fact, disproving what you said. So maybe if you “read what was there instead of what you wanted to see” you would have seen that. But I guess that was too much to ask. With that being said, I am going to argue my point with as much love as I can possibly dig up from the depths of my heart… and just leave this. Because I am pretty sure this is the most futile discussion I have ever witnessed or been a part of.
Ok, so about what you said about Jesus. Even though most HONEST scholars now-a-days do not deny the existence of a man named Jesus (where the debate comes in is what Jesus actually was), I will present you with a link (although, I’m not convinced you would read it), because I’m not going to waste as much time as I did yesterday writing something out that will go in one ear and out the other.
So, as you can see, the MAN Jesus definitely did exist. I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you can be open enough to look at history as it was. Given that Jesus ministry was only 3 years long and was extremely centralized (he had a very small place of ministry), it seems very odd that over 2,000 years later, the biggest religion (with 2.1 million, followed by Islam with 1.5), and still has not been disproven. I know that you will say that it has been, but honest historians, archaeologists, and scientists have been able to go to the middle east and do actual research in the places of the Bible, and have found that the Bible is actually amazingly accurate to history. In fact, Christianity has been the starting point of many discoveries. I won’t even get into that because the list goes on and on and I feel like it would be a waste of time with you. But do you not find it interesting that all of those Christians that existed in the time of Jesus were willing to die, painful, excruciating deaths… for someone who supposedly didn’t exist? Or the fact that history has been split in two… because of someone who didn’t exist? I think it is very foolish and dishonest to have yourself so deceived that you can’t even admit that Jesus was real. To me, you are doing exactly what you are accusing Christians of, hiding your face from the truth. I’m not even asking you to admit that He was the Son of God, I’m just saying, have enough integrity to admit that the MAN was real.
And with that all being said, even if you don’t want to admit that any of the above is true, you can at least have the intellectual honesty to admit that Christianity (true Christianity that is) has had an amazing, POSITIVE impact on the world, dare I say it? Scientifically. Here’s why I can give the credit to Christians, because I know that you will deny it if I don’t… you probably even will once I do… but oh well.
Science obviously originated with the Greeks, who were trying to find an answer to their questions that did not include God. But they never came up with anything like modern science. The reason modern science did not develop with the Hebrews was because the natural world was simply there to give praise to the Creator. It could not have come into existence with the Arabs because of Islam. Although they had Aristotle’s writings (which were quite scientific), Arabs never created any real science because of the fatalism dominating Islam… it would be pointless because ‘all things are unchangeable.’ Modern science could also not come from the animists of Africa or anywhere because they would not have experimented on the natural world. It couldn’t have come from the Buddhists or Hinduism because they believe the physical world is unreal and there would be no reason to learn anything about something that’s not real. So, that leaves Christianity to introduce modern science in the 16th century. The reason Christians would have been willing to do anything is because we believe that God is a rational God who would create a rational creation.
And before you say anything about how the Catholic church treated Galileo, they issued a public apology for their censure of him. So. Don’t even go there.
Anyway, here is a list of all the things the Christians contributed to science, so that you can at least give us SOME credit where credit is due.
Antiseptic surgery, Joseph Lister
Bacteriology, Louis Pasteur
Calculus, Isaac Newton
Celestial Mechanics, Johannes Kepler
Chemistry, Robert Boyle
Comparative anatomy, Georges Cuvier
Computer Science, Charles Babbage
Dimensional Analysis, Lord Rayleigh
Dynamics, Isaac Newton
Electronics, John Ambrose Flemming
Electrodynamics, James Clerk Maxwell
Electromagnetics, Michael Faraday
Energetics, Lord Kelvin
Entomology of Living Insects, Henri Fabre
Field Theory, Michael Faraday
Fluid Mechanics, George Stokes
Galactic Astronomy, Sir William Herschel
Gas Dynamics, Robert Boyle
Genetics, Gregor Mendel
Glacial Geology, Louis Agassiz
Gynecology, James Simpson
Hydrography, Matthew Maury
Hydrostatics, Blaise Pascal
Ichthyology, Louis Agassiz
Isotopic Chemistry, William Ramsey
Model Analysis, Lord Rayleigh
Natural History, John Ray
Non-Euclidean Geometry, Bernard Riemann
Oceanography, Matthew Maury
Optical Mineralogy, David Brewster
So yeah, there’s a list. I got that from the book I recommended that you read… but you had a sassy comeback, proving to me that you really are not willing to do anything that you’ve told us “spoon-fed Christians” to do. You are the epitome of a spoon-fed person. Think for yourself. Once you have read the books and actually looked at the history, science, archaeology, etc. THEN you can sass at the Christians for being ignorant. Because you are honestly the most unwilling, ignorant person I have ever come across. And don’t say that I am a “just shut up” person, because I would have loved to have a civil conversation with you. You are the cause of everyone’s poor attitude at you. I don’t hate you for “speaking the truth” because you haven’t even SPOKEN a word of truth. You’ve spoken insults and what you want to believe. I am not intimidated by you…just extraordinarily irritated.
First, I never said YOU were one of the “just shut up” people. You take umbrage where none was given. But perhaps you know your own inner thinking better than I do?
Next, to not make a post as long as yours, let me cover a couple of things. Just because the bible is accurate on some well-known historical points doesn’t mean it is truthful about everything. I could tell you a long involved fish story and state it took place on a lake known to exist and from a make and model of boat with a specific motor. Al of those things could be true but it wouldn’t prove I was even there, have ever fished, or that anything else was true.
I can show that the important parts of the bible are not only untrue but impossible. The fable of Noah’s ark comes to mind. Just for a sample, there is no way a craft of that size could hold the millions of animals needed to have “two of everything”. Nor has any wood vessel of that size been built that did not fail with the first reasonable sized waves it met. Then, the provable fact that there is not enough water on the planet to cover the entire earth and drown every living being. But people believe that nonsense without considering if it were possible.
Finally, the fact that some people that were at least nominally christian have done some good things means what? That they did these because they were christians? Not hardly. But christians like to believe that atheists do bad things because they are atheists even though there is no evidence to support that. It’s just another convenient lie for the religion.
I haven’t spoken any truth? The reason you think I am irritating is because I have spoken the truth and neither you nor anyone else has proven that I have not.
You don’t want a civil conversation, you want to preach.
As far as everyone’s attitude, it is what I expected. Theists always become angry and hostile when anyone dares question or criticize their cherished delusions. I always am amused by this and think of the Bard. “Methinks they doth protest too much.” Exactly as you are doing.
DO I hate religion? No, it it too ridiculous to hate. DO I hate the things I see being done in the name of religion? Any rational person would. Children being allowed to die from curable diseases so they can be “Prayed to health”. People being murdered for doing things “against god”. Hate being preached because of someone sexual orientation, or lack of beliefs. All of those are done because of religion.
As has been said, “Good people will do good things and bad people will do bad things. For good people to do bad things takes religion.”
James, first of all, I really do want to apologize for everything that I have said that has been offensive to you. It was wrong, and although you do not believe in my God, I do and I believe I am supposed to act according to His character which is Love. I haven’t and for that I am sorry. Please don’t say anything offensive or anything about me being delusional. Just because you believe something to be fact does not mean that you have to say it out loud.
As much as it pains me, I decided that it would be best for me not to even bother responding to what you said. Not because I could not defend my beliefs or give logical, verifiable, well thought out answers, but because I have read through your comments enough to realize that I will never be able to persuade you, and you will never be able to persuade me. That’s really the only reason I didn’t. If you knew anything about me, you would know that I can have these discussions for hours and hours and hours with people who disagree with me. I honestly feel though, there is much more here than just your atheism. I don’t know what it is and I’m not trying to get it out of you. Feel free to keep your past to yourself (if you want to share it, that’s ok too, I just want you to know that I’m not trying to force you).
I truly wish that you could hear my tone of voice when I say this, because text always makes things seem much worse than they were ever meant to be… but honestly, this is the most sincere, heartfelt apology I think I will ever make. I am sorry for the things I’ve said. I know I said that already, but I truly am. I’m sorry that you have been so mistreated by people claiming to be Christians, if I remember correctly, you said something about physical abuse. That is wrong and awful and I’m so sorry you had to go through that. If atheists beat me up or yelled at me or called me horrific names, I am pretty sure I would feel the exact same way towards them as you do towards us.
I’m really trying to word everything in a way that does not give any offense, or set you off on something, because that is truly not my intention. I thought when you were saying things about how you wanted a discussion that you actually wanted a discussion. I believe (this is me truly saying my beliefs, not trying to be antagonistic) that a discussion between two people who disagree is each person taking their turn and discussing the inconsistencies in each other’s logic. I would have been very willing to ponder the things that you were saying. All that I asked was for the same in return.
You make blanket statements about “theists” and how they do not think for themselves and how you cannot reason someone out of a conclusion they did not come to using reason… but you know nothing about how ANY of these Christians came to their beliefs. You definitely don’t know mine, and I’m offended by your statement. The reason I started studying worldview stuff so adamantly 4-5 years ago is because I was not only questioning Christianity but the existence of God in general. I was very open to both sides of the argument, and Christianity is the conclusion I came to. I am not the only Christian like that, there are MANY of us. I wish I could remember his name, but there’s a very famous Christian preacher who was a devout atheist who made his life’s goal to disprove the existence of God, and during his research he became a Christian. So, perfectly logical people can be Christians too.
I’m not saying that perfectly logical people will never be atheists either, I’m just saying that you cannot assume that you know everything about every theist in existence.
The problem with this is that you cannot prove or disprove God’s existence. The thing about science is that for the scientific method to work (hypothesis, theory, law) you have to be able to do experiments and repeat things. Neither side can do that for the claims on the existence of God. So really, (technically) both places are in the hypothesis stage. I’m not just saying atheistic views, even Christian views. Everyone has the same data, it’s just the lens you look at it through. That’s all.
Anyway, I’m not going to comment again, because as I’ve said, this is useless because I am as devoted to my beliefs as you are to yours. That’s fine with me, nothing I can say will change your mind, and I don’t want to. You can live your life believing what you believe. That’s fine with me. All I ask is that you practice some kindness when dealing with people. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
Honestly though, I really do genuinely believe that you have good intentions… you’re just aren’t executing them correctly.
I honestly hope that you have a really great day and that everything is well with you. I also hope you believe that I mean that and not just saying it to be a brat… because I’m not. =)
Another thing James, honestly, I was very excited about this. Worldview stuff is my passion and I have spent the past 4-5 years studying it in great depth and I legitimately love to engage in these sorts of conversations. My current attitude towards you has nothing to do with your beliefs and my not being prepared or having an answer for the things that you say, and everything to do with YOUR attitude and your unwillingness to converse. Honestly… you have said nothing that was true, you have been exceptionally hypocritical (you complain about Christians shoving their beliefs down your throat…what have you been doing this entire time?), You have insulted our intelligence to no end, and so far, I have only seen people do that to you in retaliation for the cruel things you have said to them. You have used many logical fallacies (rather than just saying that you disagree with Christianity, you call it rude names and insult it to the very core). You have given no reasons why you believe what YOU believe and why people shouldn’t believe what they do.
I feel that if you want to have some integrity, and have people really consider what you say, you need to give real points, not talking points. you’re like a politician. You have what you want to say, and nothing anyone else wants to say can get you off of it. You need to engage in what is actually being said. You’ll find that maybe these people aren’t as idiotic as you think.
It is perfectly fine for you to disagree, and no one is saying that you need to change your beliefs, just change your method of coming at it! You get insulted and offended when people say things harshly, but that is all you have done. Expecting to be treated any differently is very hypocritical. Even Jesus was brought to anger. No Christian is anything like Jesus, but if He even got angry, obviously us sinners will be even more swiftly brought to anger.
You’re allowed to have your thoughts and you’re allowed to express them, no one is telling you to shut up. People just want you to be civil when you present your arguments. Seriously… I have a stack of books taller than my bed sitting next to me because I wanted to have this conversation, I didn’t want you to shut up. I wanted to have a civil debate. You were uncivil. That was YOU. I didn’t react correctly in my last comment… you made me very very angry. I’m still angry at you. But I should not have insulted you, that was rude and I apologize. Please forgive me. But my point about YOUR attitude and YOUR way of reacting to the things people say still stands. Please reread everything that you have said. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for how you handled things.
So according to your logic, if a group of atheists started killing people in the name of no God, you would start to believe in a God to do the opposite of them?
How is that logic by me? It is your own delusions at work again. I am amazed that even you can be that stupid. Yes, that IS an insult. One you richly deserve.
Maybe you feel better saying that, but it simply is not true. Many quotations from Hitler show him to be a devout christian. One of his stated purposes was to eliminate eliminate atheism.
By his own edict, school prayer was required every day. Your “social darwinist” is just another theist lie. It is also a rather silly lie as it is so obviously untrue. But being silly or obviously untrue doesn’t seem to bother you, does it?
Please back up your claims? Because Hitler got rid of the Bibles and replaced them with Mein Kampf. If you can back up your claims, that’s fine, but you can’t just say things that are not true and then expect people to believe them. If they ARE true, then you can back them up no problem, and must do so if you want people to believe you. =)
Kaitlyn, here are some direct quotations from Hitler. He never “got rid of the bibles and replaced them with Mein Kampf” Saying things that aren’t true without backing them up? That is exactly what you did with that statement.
Here’s some of Der Fuher’s own words, for you.
“My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them.”
-Hitler in a speech on April 12, 1922.
Hitler made similar remarks in his book, “Mein Kampf”, which was written when he was young. So he must have changed his mind and lost sight of his faith later, right?
“The National Government will regard it as its first and foremost duty to revive in the nation the spirit of unity and co-operation. It will preserve and defend those basic principles on which our nation has been built. It regards Christianity as the foundation of our national morality, and the family as the basis of national life.”
No, that isn’t from a modern day, Republican speech; that’s what Hitler said in a statement in 1933.
And even more surprising was the Nazi banned book list; Darwin’s “On the Origins of Species” and any book deemed to support evolution it were on it.
“The most marvelous proof of the superiority of Man, which puts man ahead of the animals, is the fact that he understands that there must be a Creator.”
“Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith.”
– from a speech Hitler gave on April 26, 1933.
Did I mention that school prayer was mandatory under the Nazis? If I wanted to commit the logical fallacy of guilt by association comparing Hitler’s beliefs in a Christian nation, family values, creationism, and school prayer to America’s modern Religious Right, this would be an ideal opportunity for it. But that would bring me down to their level. Oops. Guess I already drew the parallels. Oh well.
In his own words, Hitler was a devout Christian and he was a Creationist.
“For it was by the Will of God that men were made of a certain bodily shape, were given their natures and their faculties.”
– Hitler in his book “Mein Kampf”
So why aren’t we told about Hitler’s enthusiasm for Jesus in America? After all, it’s common knowledge in Europe. Funny how there’s little to no mention of Hitler’s religious beliefs in the average school curriculum or documentary, while we learn at length about Hitler’s other beliefs.
Economics and politics played huge roles in the Nazis coming to power. But so did religion. Anyone who denies or ignores that fact is enabling a repeat.
Finally, the faithful might argue that Hitler was not a real Christian. Although the average German, will readily tell you that Hitler was. And given Hitler’s statements, I think it’s safe to assume he would argue that he most certainly was a Christian, and that’s the important aspect. Because whether Hitler was a Christian in someone view or according to their definition is beside the point; the point is that, as someone who believed in a god, Hitler was not an atheist.
National Socialism and religion cannot exist together…. The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity’s illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity…. Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things.
10th October, 1941, midday:
Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure.
14th October, 1941, midday:
The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death…. When understanding of the universe has become widespread… Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity…. Christianity has reached the peak of absurdity…. And that’s why someday its structure will collapse…. …the only way to get rid of Christianity is to allow it to die little by little…. Christianity the liar…. We’ll see to it that the Churches cannot spread abroad teachings in conflict with the interests of the State.
19th October, 1941, night:
The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity.
21st October, 1941, midday:
Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism, the destroyer…. The decisive falsification of Jesus’ doctrine was the work of St.Paul. He gave himself to this work… for the purposes of personal exploitation…. Didn’t the world see, carried on right into the Middle Ages, the same old system of martyrs, tortures, faggots? Of old, it was in the name of Christianity. Today, it’s in the name of Bolshevism. Yesterday the instigator was Saul: the instigator today, Mardochai. Saul was changed into St.Paul, and Mardochai into Karl Marx. By exterminating this pest, we shall do humanity a service of which our soldiers can have no idea.
13th December, 1941, midnight:
Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imagine nothing more senseless, nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery…. …. When all is said, we have no reason to wish that the Italians and Spaniards should free themselves from the drug of Christianity. Let’s be the only people who are immunised against the disease.
14th December, 1941, midday:
Kerrl, with noblest of intentions, wanted to attempt a synthesis between National Socialism and Christianity. I don’t believe the thing’s possible, and I see the obstacle in Christianity itself…. Pure Christianity– the Christianity of the catacombs– is concerned with translating Christian doctrine into facts. It leads quite simply to the annihilation of mankind. It is merely whole-hearted Bolshevism, under a tinsel of metaphysics.
9th April, 1942, dinner:
There is something very unhealthy about Christianity
27th February, 1942, midday:
It would always be disagreeable for me to go down to posterity as a man who made concessions in this field. I realize that man, in his imperfection, can commit innumerable errors– but to devote myself deliberately to errors, that is something I cannot do. I shall never come personally to terms with the Christian lie. Our epoch Uin the next 200 yearse will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity…. My regret will have been that I couldn’t… behold .
and tried to endorse his own version of a white Jesus…..
LOL. I am more amused at how this conversation continues, if you skim through the monster of a comments page, I think all readers and posters got the message of this discussion long ago….except for one
Oohh, Wikipedia. Such a reliable source of information!
Hitler was a Catholic and had the support of the Catholic church. I even have a picture of of a group of cardinals and other church officials giving the Nazi salute. Adolph’s henchman, Mussolini, was the one that made the deal establishing the Vatican as a separate state in return for church support.
FYI, the reason there are a lot of “official catholics” in Brazil and other places is the church refuses to take anyone off their roles without a specific written request. Even if a person has not taken any part in the religion for decades, they are still counted as being “catholic”. They would list Dawkins and Hitchins as catholics under that policy.
On the other hand, they will excommunicate a doctor for performing an abortion to save the life of a mother. The mother will also be excommunicated. This has happened even if the fetus was clearly a danger to the mother and unlikely to live in any case. Nothing like choosing death over life, is there?
IN that particular case it was even more silly because, with the mother alive, she can have had more children to be turned into good little catholics. Very clever, these priests.
You can also check out my reply to Kaitlyn, above this. But maybe you wish to create your own facts. That’s really what faith is all about. Anyone is entitled to their own beliefs. But not to their own facts. Think about that, if you care for some mental exercise.
You need to check my reply to your reply. I’m definitely not denying that he said those things, just don’t deny that he said the quotes that I have either. Like I said, a man of contradictions.
Kaitlyn, I do not deny your quotes, either. You point out that Hitler was inconsistent, contradictory, and a hypocrite. Do you need any further proof that he was christian? Those three items certainly do it for me.
See? That’s the kind of thing that is unnecessary. Just because someone is hypocritical or inconsistent does NOT mean that they are a Christian. I know some Christians are, but assuming that someone is a Christian just because of that is a logical fallacy. It’s like saying “All dogs are mammals, therefore all mammals are dogs.” It does not work. And I promise, no Christian is saying that Christianity needs to be abolished unless they’re not really a Christian.
Kaitlyn. Growing up in the 50’s, I have probably been exposed to more christians than you. Even though I have friends that are christians, some quite good friends and close relatives, I have never known one that was not inconsistent, contradictory, and hypocritical. Not one, not ever.
I am certain that somewhere, there are some that are not. But we have to go with the evidence. If every person you met in your entire life with green eyes was a liar and a thief, even though you knew there must be some that were not, how would you feel about green eyes? You you be suspicious of them until proven otherwise?
“Not really a christian” that’s the “No true Scotsman” argument again. How many people do you think would consider you, “Not a real christian” because you didn’t agree with them on a particular point? I am sure that the members of the Westboro Baptist church would look upon you with disdain as not being a “real christian”. Maybe you feel the same about them?
Your “All dogs are mammals…” statement is the circular reasoning I see far too often. I based my comment upon observed evidence, not circular reasoning. I even agree that there must be exceptions. But I still have to go with the percentages, as I am sure you also do. That’s only good sense. Would you download a file on your computer from a source unknown to you, given the frequency of virus attacks? I doubt you would even though you know that some must not me malware, but the odds are not in the favor of that, are they?
These are adorable. The comments that follow are hilarious. I don’t see any harm in keeping religious views to ourselves and just enjoying these “letters.” Keep the debates to the websites created for that reason and off here.
Oh good, another “shut up” person. If christians kept their views to themselves and didn’t vote them into laws for everyone, there would be no problem. But they do and they want to demand respect and freedom from criticism, taxes, and everything else. So they will have to expect people to protest anywhere and any time they like. You don’t have to read it, you know.
You are generalizing Christians here and just a couple paragraphs up you were angry about someone generalizing Atheists. Throughout all these posts you have only proven yourself to be a hypocrite the exact quality you seem to despise so much in “most Christians” you meet. Unfortunately you are so blinded by your closed mind and arrogance you can’t admit it. One day I believe you will stand before your maker and be corrected and humbled and extremely saddened for your mistaken beliefs.
She actually didn’t tell you to shut up, she just told everyone to argue in an arena where it is welcomed and encouraged, not on a little kid notes’ site.
I don’t know if “Mr. James long name” can possibly be serious, but it seems to me like he is trolling. I really hope that a fellow atheist isn’t really being this much of a jerk to everyone on this site. And James, if you aren’t trolling, and I’m sure you’ll read my comment, please just calm down.
Thank you for this. Some people have nothing better to do I suppose. And yes, we are all idiotic, humorless, unwitty, ignorant, bible-thumping morons in your mind James, but that’s okay with me.
Ihateyou. Oh yes, a fine christian sentiment. Exactly what I expect. You are not “idiotic, humorless, unwitty, ignorant, bible-thumping morons” only in my mind, posts like yours prove it.
Yes, I have other things to do but this doesn’t take much time. Post like yours are so simple-minded, replying doesn’t require much in the way of time or mental effort.
Mr. James I am sorry that you feel that religion and God had been forced down your throat. But please don’t force atheism down another persons. Thank you for your time. 🙂
How have I been “Forcing atheism on anyone? By pointing out the fallacies of religion? Is there something about the truth that disturbs you? Keep in mind that not one word I have posted has been shown to be untrue. Yes, some have said it I wasn’t right, but they offered no one bit of proof.
I don’t “feel” that religion has been forced upon people. It is a fact. That fact has been demonstrated many time in courts and proven beyond any doubt. That religion has consistently flouted the law, common sense, and even human decency has also been proven. If you, or anyone wants those proofs, I can point you to sites and examples that cannot be denied.
There is a huge difference between feelings and facts. For example, religion is feelings, atheism is facts.
I’m sure you can’t tel if trolling or really stupid. You don’t have the mental agility to do either. Show me a contradiction I have made. Or are you just saying that because you think it sounds good?
If you want to sound good, try writing in complete sentences. You’ll have a bit more credibility if you don’t come across as semi-illiterate.
Automatically attacking the grammar of the person making the argument! Typical theist tactic —– wait. That was James’s comment. Now I know there’s no god!
“Just calm down”? Yes, calm down and allow the bible-thumping, intolerant, religious reich to pass their sick beliefs into law, over ride common sense and human decency. “Calm down” is how every totalitarian system gains a foothold. Only when people have enough courage to stand up and say, “No more!” can outrages be stopped.
I will not back down and I am calm. I haven’t threatened anyone on here nor have I cursed them or used language such as been used to me. I have called them like I see them. When someone makes idiotic statements or tells outright lies, I say so. One of the things I have learned in life is the one thing people hate more than anything else is someone that tells the truth. That is obvious on here as no one person as tried to prove anything I have posted is not true. Instead they whine, moan, and complain. But show proof that I am not right? Nope, not once.
Once again I see you have put the burden of proof onto us (A typical theist tactic). No one on this comment board is responsible for your statements, you are responsible for your own statements and you must back them up. Also, please try to stay away from wild generalizations of religion. I am an atheist in the Bible Belt and I’ve had my fair share of forced beliefs but none of these people have done any forcing here.
Religion has been at the root of many catastrophes and has caused many injustices, as you have so deftly pointed out, but I sincerely doubt that any people on this comment board, either here from stumbleupon or frequenters of this site are the religious extremists that you portray. You act as though you are an honorable crusader, defending your beliefs from militants. Though you may not like to hear this, you seem to be taking out anger that has been pent up elsewhere out on people that have committed no wrongs against you. You also talk like you have been on this site often. If you keep having flame wars with the patrons of this site I have to ask. Why are you still here?
Religion has been used for several reasons. As an “institution” or “system”, it can be used for good or evil. A war fought over religion that ends in countless deaths is one example of the evil that the system of religion can accomplish. (As would be taking advantage of people, like what was happening in the temple that Jesus overthrew, for the Christians out there.) However, religion has accomplished some great things. Christians are the biggest group of people combating sex trafficking all around the world. Christians also pioneered the field of social work.
Religion, then, is simply a tool. We should not be concerned with condemning it (James) and should not place it on a pedestal (many others). Instead, we should be more concerned with simply living a moral life. These children, most likely, were not maliciously brainwashed. Notice how none of these prayers were vengeful or hateful. These kids will probably grow up to affirm and deny some of their various childhood beliefs. They’ll figure life out. Let’s not cheapen the term “child abuse” by extending it to parents trying to instill a sense of right v. wrong.
And not you? Yes, you. An arrogant ass. YOu ignore anything that doesn’t agree with your pre0conceived ideas. That’s arrogant. You can’t see any comments I have made to anyone agreeing with them, or at least agreeing to disagree. You are unable to recognize that I respond to people in the manner they treat me. But to do otherwise would cause your ideas to crumble. Can’t have that, can we?
And yes, all religions do force their views upon others. I know none of you like to hear that, but it’s true even if you can truthfully state that you personally have not done that.
For that matter, have I demanded anyone become an atheist? Al I have done is point out the fallacies and shortcomings of religion. If that bothers anyone, maybe instead of attacking the messenger, you do something positive to correct it. But killing the messenger is always easier than fixing the problem, isn’t it?
Now for the good news. This is m y last post here. I have other commitments to friends and family. I have several videos for others to make and some photo editing to do. You can see videos I have made for myself and others at http://www.vimeo.com or http://www.tubewatcher.tv Enter slrman in the search box at the top right on either.
It has been amusing, but sometimes disappointing to see “good christians behave in a vicious, hateful manner. I do have christian friends that are decent, caring, good people that I am happy to know. Too bad so few like that frequent this site.
According to the dictionary, Religion can be defined as:Details of belief as taught or discussed. Therefore Atheism is a religion. So before you get all high and mighty pretending you are religion free, realize you in trying not to have a religion, have one.
What dictionary? Atheism, as I have explained elsewhere on here more than once, is not a belief. Beliefs are held without supporting facts. That’s “faith”. Atheism is based upon evidence that can be independently verified.
If atheism is a religion, then bald is a hair color and not collecting stamps is a hobby.
I hope that the email address on your blog is one for things other than your book! Just in case I’m commenting because I’d really love to start a friendly dialogue with you, you’ll understand once you read my email (I won’t seem so random), but either way James if you could reply if the email on your blog is for buying your book only that way I could find a way to talk (I feel like this forum is a terrible place for discussions at this point).
Sincerely,
Someone who thinks we learn by having dialogues with those we don’t see perfectly eye to eye with
I was raised Roman Catholic, and for a long time was ignorant of beliefs other than my own. I was that way simply because it is the way I grew up. All of my friends were Catholic, all of my family was Catholic, and I went to a Catholic school, so all of my teachers were Catholic. When I got to highschool, there was, in a word, a “clusterfuck” of religion. Muslims, Jews, Agnostics, Hindu(s?), and, Atheists. At first I was just blatantly ignorant to them, “How can someone be so blind to not see the beauty that is God?” was about all I could think.
After a while I became close friends with a few Atheists. Being around them so much, I just got used to other views. It no longer bothered me. I even began to understand why people would have their doubts about religion, or, like you, why people would despise religion. You’re right. It’s done terrible things to the world. It’s also done good, as far as bringing people together in times of need goes, but I can agree that it’s done more good than bad. If you’re still even reading this, I’m going to go ahead and assume that you actually give a shit what I have to say.
These are children.
They are innocent.
In many ways, they cannot fully think for themselves.
Their parents give them a basis of morals and a brief understand of how life works.
But at the end of the day, the decision is up to them.
There is a reason you hate religion. I’m going to take a shot in the dark, and say it’s because your parents tried to shove religion down your throat. They were God-fearing people, and Heaven forbid their son won’t be just like them. They probably even beat you. When you think of religion, you think of your parents. I’m saying parents here, but keep in mind this is just a brief generalization of what I believe (with the little knowledge I have of you) that your childhood was like.
I’ve seen that image before, the one about religion being like a penis. I think it’s pretty hilarious. But can’t you see that you’re doing the same thing here? Just not with religion, but with the lack thereof. You’ve come onto a harmless page, filled with people who were laughing and smiling at the innocence of children, and burnt it all down.
Even if we (I’m speaking on behalf of the Christians in this comment section) are wrong about our religion, why do you care?
I agree that many Christians are egotistical, self-centered hypocrites. Many are rude, many go about trying to spread their beliefs the wrong way.
You are just as passionately against religion as Christians are for it. You are completely convinced of the non-existence of God. Christians are completely convinced of the existence of God.
Christians are pushy because they truly believe that if you don’t believed, you’ll have an eternity of punishment. It’s essentially compassion for others that drives them, but many go about it the wrong way.
It’s silly to get into semantic gymnastics and grammatical errors in an attempt to ignore the issues at hand. There is only as much evidence of God as a person will allow there to be. If someone sees the beauty of nature as a sign of God, so be it. You, on the other hand, see it as scientific evidence. That’s your belief. And in this country, every one is free to believe as they will.
The rude behavior from both sides is an example of bitterness. That’s not acceptable. How can either side persuade or even enlighten the other in the midst of insults? There’s no debate here or convincing arguments here. This is apparently a contest on who can make the other look like a fool.
Though many of us disagree, we need to keep in mind a mutual respect for each other.
Atheists can try to shove their beliefs onto others, just like a religious person can. This is a lesson we’ve all hopefully learned today.
As much as James can say that he doesn’t care about what other people think, there is no other reason he would post at least a dozen replies in this thread. He’s just trolling.
While I agree with most of what you say, James…this is a post about children writing funny letters to whatever God they believe in. Get over yourself. You’re just as bad as the people who try to cram religion down our throats, and I’m sure to you that’s a horrifying comparison- but it’s true. You act the same way against religion as some Christians act for it- is there really much of a difference?
Although I agree with James 100%, you should probably stop responding to these zealous idiots. Their indoctrinated minds force them to lash out at anyone who disagrees with their views, and that only causes problems.
Here is the problem, and what causes us to “lash out.” It has nothing to do with the fact that you disagree with what we say. Sure, some may do that, but many of us “zealous idiots” can in fact argue very reasonably for our points and are really very willing to have conversations about this stuff. The things that cause anger are the hypocritical statements. “You’re not allowed to stifle my free speech! you’re an idiot! you know nothing! you are a spoon fed Christian with no original thought! HEY! HOW DARE YOU INSULT MY BELIEFS!!! ANY TIME YOU SAY ANYTHING ABOUT GOD YOU ARE FORCING YOUR BELIEFS DOWN MY THROAT!!! wait, did you just say God was real? HOW DARE YOU! teaching your child that God is real is ABUSE! ABUSE I TELL YOU!” But then you turn around and make statements like “God is not real” If you read on here, not once has anyone insulted atheistic beliefs by calling those who believe it “delusional, idiotic, abusive” etc.
That really is the problem. Not the disagreement in beliefs, but the hypocrisy. If you want to believe that, go for it! if you want to defend that, by all means! but as soon as you start getting angry at Christians for believing and defending what THEY believe, that’s where the anger happens because it is not fair. Honestly, read through this all. You’ll see that that is exactly what has been happening. No one has insulted your beliefs straight out, they have merely defended theirs (insults have been thrown in, which was wrong) but all James has done is insult, insult, insult, and insult again.
The problem is, no one said anything about whether the God that these children were writing the letters to was real. The only person who started the insults and offensive comments was James. Sure, people should’ve just left it and not said anything back to him, but this never would have started had he kept his opinion to himself. People would’ve read it, been like “aw that was kinda cute.” and moved on.
Thank you to all parties who helped transform this post into a warzone. Not only has it been an amusing read but it truly illustrates that people of all creeds are capable of being narrow-minded assholes. Recognize the good and evil present in all points of view and extract what wisdom you can from every system of beliefs you encounter. Truly try to educate yourself without looking to prove a point and you will find truth in the most unexpected places. Most importantly stop blowing each other up… anyway I’m done sounding like some kind of new age fortune cookie, have fun everybody!
“… that permits it to perform it’s evils.”- “it’s” is a contraction of “it is”, while its shows ownership.
“You’re not an atheists”- “atheists” should be in the singular form.
“l;and”- misspelled “land”. nice.
“… it doesn’t matter to me until the insist I do the same.” misspelled “they”. nice.
… or anything else, What does that matter to me?” capitalized “What” in the middle of a sentence.
… and destroying entire civilizations including plants and animals?” plants and animals are not civilizations. a civilization is defined as “the stage of human social development and organization that is considered most advanced.” plants and animals belong to kingdoms of life, and no kingdom has ever been destroyed. nice try buddy.
i could go on, but i got bored. keep on this intellectual crusade of yours under pictures of notes written by children though, i’m sure your driving home your point to all the people who don’t care and just came across this on stumbleupon like me. kudos.
(and i’m aware i don’t capitalize any words. i don’t like to.)
Hey Ryan, how typical of you theists to attempt to distract from questions you cannot answer by introducing irrelevant subjects.
What do typos have to do with the subject at hand? When have I ever said I am a perfect typist? When have I ever said I carefully edit each post? SO you are another person trying very hard to look like a superior intellect by avoiding the genuine questions. But that’s typical, so how can I be surprised?
I can still say that not one point I have made here has been proven to be wrong. Instead, morons like you think by introducing distractions, they can look like winners. All it does is show you know nothing and are determined to stay that way.
How ironic this would come from someone that doesn’t use capitals because “I don’t like to.” In other words, “I am ignorant and like to stay that way.” Congratulations, you have managed that, at least. Never, ever make a typo where I can see it.
“No kingdom has ever been destroyed? Read your bible, you hypocrite. Your god did order entire kingdoms to be destroyed including all of the trees, animals, and every structure. Genocide is a common theme in the babble.
My advice to you comes from Brother Dave Gardner. “Obey the biblical imperative to go forth and multiply thyself.”
buddy, read a biology book. there are six kingdoms of life. and stop masturbating to atheist blogs, there are better things in life. i didn’t say i wanted to argue about your content. i just pointed out you have poor grammar when you’re trying to be all sophisticated. anyone can throw out names of people way smarter than themselves. you’ve got dawkins? fine, i have c.s. lewis. what i don’t have is all day to sit around and argue with you, because i have a job and contribute to society. later gator
Yep, I was right. You ignored the issues and hide behind what wasn’t even brought up. Thank you very much for proving again that I am right about people like you hiding behind irrelevancies and avoiding the genuine issues. In the process, you have also shown that you are an intellectual coward and have no ethics, either. None of that surprises me in the least.
You have C.S. Lewis? Gee, what a towering intellect the fool was. In your position, I’d be embarrassed to even mention him. But nothing is too ignorant to embarrass you, is it? How about the genocide in the bible? You conveniently ignore that.
What about the great flood that killed almost every living thing on the earth, including plants, animals, people insects; anything that couldn’t thrive in fresh water. Or did it rain sea water? No matter, it’s all a fable anyway and so full of contradictions and impossibilities than only the stubbornly stupid could believe it.
Then you start with the sexual insults. Why do all of you people, when cornered result to sophomoric sexual jibes? Is that as far as your mentality has progressed?
BTW, start using capitals so your writing doesn’t look like that of a second grader. Or is that the effect you desire so no one will expect too much from you?
you conveniently choose to ignore the great gifts God gives us that are talked about in the bible. negative nancy over here. just so you know, because i’m sure you’ve never actually read the bible, the genocides and great floods were consequences of sinners bringing on the wrath of God. would you like to know how it stopped? just a slightly influential figure named Jesus who, even if you think he was delusional, believed himself to be dying for the sinners of the world, us included. so you can call him crazy if you want, he loved you, and as hard as your trying to make it for him, he still does. i won’t lie and say the church hasn’t messed up, the crusades are a bit embarrassing. that’s what happens when the church strays away from christ. which is why lewis was a christian apologist. and i’m sure you haven’t read any of his work either. on the warpath to become the most openminded atheist out there, i think you’ve fallen into the trap of becoming just as ignorant as you accuse me of being, in that you won’t even consider the possibility that God is real. i’ve had doubts before, everyone has. but i still have faith, and believe very much in God. it’s easy to criticize God, but honestly, who is the creation to question the creator? it’s one of the hardest concepts of religion to accept, but if you try, maybe you can open your mind to see it from our point of view, instead of getting all flustered and sarcastic.
BTW, i’m proud of you. hardly three minor grammatical mistakes in the last post. you’ve been spell-checking 😉
First of all I would just like to say that all of these posts are rather unfortunate, particularly the ones from “THE CHRISTIANS”! If anyone on here has claimed to be a Christian and has slandered or demeaned James in anyway, you may want to check yourself, those kinds of things do not seem very “Christian” to me at all.
But anyways…
James the issue I want to address are the horrors committed in the name of Christianity. It is obvious that you are a proponent of Dawkins’ views (referring to religion as some kind of sickness (a pseudo-scientific notion presented in one of his books if I’m not mistaken) and saying, perhaps not verbatim (i haven’t read every post on this thread) but at least strongly implying that the world would be a better place if religion did not exist because then things such as planes flying into buildings wouldn’t happen, I’m referencing 9/11 just to clarify. (another notion presented in one Dawkins’ books).
Now stick with me here James and lets be fair,
but has atheism not been forced upon people in much the same fashion as religion (E.g. The Soviet Union, China) and have not atrocities against humanity (millions upon millions of people killed) been committed by these atheistic regimes? And are not these horrors just as bad (or perhaps worse, perhaps not) than what has been committed in the name of a god?
I hope to read a response and that you are keeping up with this thread, but whether you are or not, all the best.
Believe me. It’s useless. He’ll just grasp onto the “but you say that crimes have been committed by Christians!!”
This is legitimately not to be slander, I feel awful for him that he has had such terrible experiences with Christians. I feel terrible that I insulted him, it wasn’t right.
Kaitlyn, your apology is accepted. Even though we will disagree on the reality of religion, I have to say that, in some ways, you remind me of a christian friend of mine. She’s a very nice woman in Indiana that has had some terrible things in her life. In addition to suffering horribly from Fribomyalgia, (SP?) in less than one year, both her twin sister and her husband passed away. Both had been ill for a long time and I am sure they were both ready to be relieved of the pain.
But that’s not the point. She is a remarkable resilient woman and has purchased a little place in Florida where she can spend the winters close to another family member.
My point is, while she and I disagree on a few things we share a liking for writing, reading, and photography. She also paints a little, something that is well beyond my meager talents. We simply do not get into discussions about some areas. She respects my views enough to understand I have good reasons for them. I respect her need for something to get her through the disasters that have fallen into her life. If contemplating her religions helps her with that, good for her.
As I have said, I have no objection to anyone believing what they wish. I do object with them forcing those things upon others. No one can rationally deny that has happened and is happening. All religions that I have studied attempt to make their beliefs laws for everyone. That’s how creationism is being force-fed to school children in the USA.
One of the things I like most about Brazil is that the intrusion of religion into the running of the country is far less than in the USA.
Hmmmm, I agree that it is possible that at least the appearance of atheism has been imposed upon people in some totalitarian regimes. As I have mentioned elsewhere, the reason is apparently because the dictators, under any name, see religion as a threat. Some, like Hitler, used religion to further their aims and improve their control. Others, like the communists, saw religion as a threat to their power and therefore tried to suppress it.
I suspect that, in those cases, there were many “closet theists” as today, there are many “closet atheists” who pretend to be pious for social, political, or financial reasons. Yes, I agree that is as hypocritical as theists praying on Sunday and cheating on their spouses on Monday.
At least I can retain my integrity in that regard. I have never pretended to be anything other than what I am, an atheists since I was 13. I “came out” to my parents when I was sure and paid a heavy price for it for many years afterward. Estrangement from my family, loss of friends, physical abuse, and continual demands that I “change my ways” under threats of eternal damnation if I did not. That was a really loving, tolerant approach, wasn’t it?
I could give many examples of the mental and even physical abuse I have received for my atheism. I am certain that other atheists would not be surprised and many theists would excuse it as “not being typical” or these were not “true christians”. As I mention in my fitness book, excuses are always easier than action.”
You asked me: “How have I been ‘Forcing atheism on anyone?’ By pointing out the fallacies of religion? Is there something about the truth that disturbs you? Keep in mind that not one word I have posted has been shown to be untrue. Yes, some have said it I wasn’t right, but they offered no one bit of proof.” You are forcing it by say that I am wrong to believe in God and implying that I am stupid and disillusioned because I choose believe in a truth that includes God. I’m not saying that you are wrong to believe what you do but please don’t tear me apart for having different beliefs. I posted the apology not to antagonize you but as a sincere apology. I was taught that as a Christian my job is to only let people know about Christ and his ability to save people from sin but I cannot force them to become a Christian.
That’s the difference between us. You have beliefs. I have facts. You decide your own truths and discard evidence to the contrary.
Your job is NOT to let people know about christ, but to stop evangelizing and maintain your beliefs in a private, quiet manner, as your bible says to do. How many “christians are content to do that? Not many. I know a few, but not many at all.
My Bible tells me to “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,” Matthew 28:19. It does not say to just sit and be quiet. But it also says “If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town.” Matthew 10:14.
I was not brainwashed as a child and even though both of my parents are ministers, I was raised to make my own decision about my faith.The reason I believe in God is because I feel that the events in my life prove His existence to me. Yes I made the choice to follow Christ but it was not without evidence as you say.
If you follow the quote you gave, then you ARE forcing your beliefs upon others. Only after you have been rejected do you “leave that town” But first you must preach to those who clearly have no interest. Thank you for confirming what I already knew.
One of the trademarks of brainwashing is the person does not know how they have been conditioned. Both of your parents were ministers and neither of them ever suggested that you should learn about the truth of things for yourself? You were never discouraged from questioning what you were told? If you think not, I suggest that your mental conditioning was more effective that you are able to grasp.
Tell me then, what evidence did you have? If anyone could produce evidence of the truth of any religion, I would retract all of my atheists statements and convert on the spot.
Theists have been trying, threatening me with damnation, and doing all they could to make me believe. I am more firmly atheistic now than I was 50 years ago. Take your best shot. But please don’t be offended when I laugh.
BTW, victory over what? Common sense, truth, the law, human decency, free speech, rational thinking? Most of those seem to be fatal to religion.
By force I meant saying that you will burn in hell for not believing in God. Not once Have I said that. My whole argument has been that you should not force atheism on others by doing exactly what others have done to you.
And, no my parents never discouraged me from asking questions. They answered every question I had and showed me where I could find the answers.
As I said, the evidence I have is proof to me. Stuff that may not mean anything to you but it changed my life. Things that happened to me that to me cannot be explained by science or anything man can offer.
Also, the name I chose has to do with a song I had in my head at the time and is more for internet security than anything.
Again, my argument here is not over religion. I know that you will not receive anything about religion. My argument is over the hypocrisy of your statements. You say that one of your problems with Christians is that they have forced their beliefs on you but you are practically doing the same thing by saying that Christians are all idiots and are choosing to believe lies. All I am asking is that you consider this fact before you go off on Christians.
I never said that you said i would burn in hell, but admit it, you believe it. I have been told that by many christians.
How am I forcing atheism on others? Have I told them they will suffer eternal torment for believing? I have pointed out the fallacies and often outright lies told by theists. But that is being truthful, not forcing anyone to embrace atheism. You cannot force anyone to accept facts. They either will or they will not. Nor have atheist voted atheism into law. What we have tried, with only moderate success, is to prevent theists from making their beliefs the law.
Still, religion mostly gets a free ride on everything from taxes, freedom from regulation, criticism, and questioning, to the use of public money to promote themselves. In places like Australia, they actually receive tax money to teach their beliefs in public schools. Very much like in the USA where laws forcing the teaching of creationism have been passed.
Your parents never discouraged you from asking questions? Did you ever ask, “How do we know all of this stuff is true?” “How do we know what is in the bible is true?” I suspect that, to this day, you have never asked either of those questions.
As the quote goes, “Science asks questions that may never be answered. Religion provides answers that may not be questioned.”
Again, I ask, “What evidence?” I have has so many religious people of every persuasion say the have “evidence’ Not one has ever provided it. If it won’t mean anything to me, perhaps that’s because it isn’t real?
You say “Things that happened to me that to me cannot be explained by science or anything man can offer.” There are many things that cannot yet be explained. It is a major mistake to assume then they must have a supernatural explanation. As I wrote in my blog entry, Flying Pharaohs”, the ancient Egyptians would have thought a simple sailplane was “the work of the gods” because they knew nothing of the laws of aerodynamics.
In many ways, we are hardly more advanced than they so many things that seem mysterious to us, will be child’s play to future generations.
As Author C. Clarke said, “Sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic,”
Again, how is stating that believers are delusional and reject rational thought and the evidence of their own senses forcing atheism on them? If I sate you are bald, and it is a fact, is that forcing a toupee on you?
I am asking that before you vote your beliefs into law, is that the right thing to do? If you think it is, then you are giving others the right to make their beliefs into law. Take a close look at places like Iran and Saudi Arabia. Those are de facto theocracies and there is no freedom of religion there at all.
The “Freedom from religion” and separation of church and state protects your right to your beliefs as well as mine to not believe.
Theists would serve their own cause much better if they stuck to the truth instead of obvious falsehoods, like “This nation was founded upon christian principles.” and “Atheists like Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot committed great evil because they were atheists.” Those statements have been demonstrated so many times to be untrue that repeating them does nothing but destroy the credibility of theists.
Again, how has anything I said been hypocritical? I have pointed out I am not forcing atheism on anyone. In fact I has clearly stated that is impossible. One of ht main problems theists have with credibility is they think, because something is said, it is automatically true with no supporting evidence. But, that is the basis of religion isn’t it? Believe without proof.
Yawn
I cant believe you lot are having a full on debate over something that people shouldnt fight over
In my opinion everyone should believe in what they want to believe, just dont shove it down people’s throats.
Atheists are as much to blame for doing this as religious people.
Chill out guys go live your life how you want not how someone else thinks you should
I would like to start out that I am a Christian. Yes, I have strong beliefs but I will not try to convert people that want no part in Christianity. I am not here to try to get you to stop believing in what you think. I get that you do not believe in the different types of religion, Christianity, Islam, Muslim, Catholicism, etc.. But to say that atheism is not a religion is a lie, to be blunt.
Religion, by definition, is a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with faith. Faith is the principle of “believing without seeing”. These definitions prove that atheism is a religion.
You were not there when the Earth was “created”. You were not there when “Jesus was crucified”. You were not there when the “Bible was written”. Because you were not there, you will never know if these things really happened or not. That is pure faith whether you believe or not.
Yes, you may have facts to back up your faith that there is no “higher power”, but you still have faith as the foundation to your belief. I just wanted to bring this thought up to you so that you could think about it.
Please do not dismiss my point with “You are just another arrogant Christian”. I just wanted to bring up something that may open your eyes to the basis of your belief. Please receive this with an open heart.
You make the same arguments that I have seen so many time, but it turns itself on you. No, I was not there and neither were you.
Yes, I have facts and you have none.
No, I do not “have faith”. As you said, I have facts. Faith is professing continued belief is something when there are no facts for it and many against it.
“Just so I could think about it”? That’s how one becomes an atheists, by thinking about it. One remains a theist by refusing to think about it, consider facts, and accept the evidence of their own senses.
My eyes are open. I do not have beliefs, I have fact. Your insistence that atheism is a belief is evidence on arrogant theism. Open your own eyes. “None are so blind as those who refuse to see.”
An open heart? When yours is closed to truth and rational thinking?
I know both of us were not there. So that means that both of us have faith that it either happened or did not.
You have facts that lead your thinking in the direction of atheism. And I have facts that lead mine to Christianity.
Faith is believing in something that you are not 100% certain of. You may have many facts that point toward one direction, but you still were not there. So this leads to your faith to fill in the answer that all your facts build up to.
Contrary to your belief, I do think about the opposing arguments and listen to what “faults” may be in my thinking. I challenge my beliefs by thinking through these problems and it only makes my faith stronger.
My eyes are not closed, and I will not accuse you that yours are closed either. Thank you for proving to me what many atheists have proved to me before. You call me arrogant and close-minded, when I know that in fact I am not “arrogant” for believing in what I do.
You may have facts, but so do I. So either my thinking is not religion/beliefs, or yours is.
You have faith. I have facts. YOu have beliefs. I have hard evidence.
If you think about opposing arguments, you do so with pre-conceived conclusions and ignore anything that points in another direction.
That’s they only way that considering the truth could make your faith stronger.
Yes, you are arrogant because you refuse to consider verifiable evidence or anything that points to your beliefs being wrong or impossible.
Tell me, exactly what “facts” do you have? I will not hold my breath waiting for them. I have asked many theists for their facts and I have never been given even one. Well, there have been some “facts” that were not facts at all, but made-up silliness that is laughable in their face. Independently verifiable facts. Either you have them or you do not.
I’m not sure why anyone would take the time to argue either for or against religion. I am an atheist with a religious studies degree and in a masters program for religious studies and I still don’t think I have spent as much time arguing Christianity as you James. Though I agree with your religious views let’s be honest we can’t prove there is not a God the same way that theists can’t prove that there is. Why not just let people believe what they want and realize that when a Christian tries to “shove their religion down your throat” that they are coming from a good place because they honestly want to save your soul. Instead of getting offended just respectfully decline.
I’m going to make it apart of my daily routine to read this before I go to bed. This is way better than anything I’ve seen on T.V recently. This could even be on MTV. “The Real World Religion: James versus everyone else.”
I was raised christian, and as I got older I decided to read/learn/think more objectively about the things I was taught whilst growing up.
These notes are from little kids who’s parents bring them up teaching them about God and Christianity I ASSUME.
You know, we lie to kids about Santa Claus, and use other fairy tales to help make their life while they are younger as worry free as possible, to keep their innocence.
Is this a generally fucked up world, and should kids be baby-ed to the point of being wusses.. No.
But this doesn’t necessarily mean all these are children of christian brain-washing parents…and even if so, when they get older .. they can make the choice for themselves what to believe.
This is humorous because you see children referring to what is known to them and assumedly their parents as the creator of ALL LIFE AND EXISTANCE, in an extremely casual manner almost as an equal. Pointing out this innocence/Lack of pre-occupation with the hierarchy of society IS AMUSING. and damnit I think its freaking funny.
To Mr. James… I really do see your point. But I mean come on, I know you dont CARE what other people think of you or your thoughts… but at a certain point…dont YOU just get tired of people ganging up on you and calling YOU a jerk. I agree that 99% of people are a waste of space.. but COME ON MAN. it seems a little immature to me to just not let it GOOO.
We don’t believe in a life after this one, so why spend it arguing and being offended.
To James:
I didn’t even bother reading the entire conversation, because it seems to me that you continue repeating your same argument over and over again, simply rephrasing it. This page was not intended to shove anything down anyone’s throats. You need to get off your high horse sir, and calm down. You remind me of a middle school girl, with all your drama. You also seem very caught up in generalizations and stereotypes. You cite authors to prove that you are not alone in your beliefs. You make comments such as “a typical theist tactic.” I hate to break it to you, but EVERYONE is different and you can’t change people. If people have different beliefs than you, let them. If they try to shove stuff down your throat, (which, for the record, no one did here) ignore them. Why waste your time arguing when you could be doing something universally productive (like volunteering at a homeless shelter or something). I came across this site on stumbleupon and I thought, “Oh, how cute!” I then saw this long-winded cyclical argument and thought, “Of course, someone always has to take it the wrong way. There’s always the touchy person that absolutely HAS to be right.” That person, sir, is you. What really pissed me off was when you said you didn’t want people telling you that you had to “respect” their beliefs and practice the same ones and be tolerant and whatnot. No on said you had to practice someone’s beliefs but tolerance helps everybody. It was INTOLERANCE, rather than religions that caused events such as 9-11, the Holocaust, and other ones mentioned. Live and let live, it will make EVERYONE happier(: If you respond to this, I probably won’t see, I just hope that you take my advice (which is universally acceptable and applicable to many situations and has nothing to do with religion of any sort) and fuck off.
To every one. I no longer have the time to devote to this page. I have a life and commitments to others.
A few of you have been reasonable people and I think you for that. The rest of you gave been smug, arrogant assholes. If i have repeated myself it’s been because so many of you have a large comprehension deficit and cannot understand anything. Stating the same idea in wildly different ways only confuses your already weak minds.
So to those of you like that. Go fuck yourselves, shitheads. That’s about the only thing you can understand. Too bad none of you had the courage to face me directly. I would have enjoyed seeing you cringe and backpedal in person. What a large group of intellectual, ethical, and physical cowards I have attracted here.
As I leave, please notice the mistletoe attached to my shirt tail.
We are arrogant and stupid? Who the hell died and made you god? Seriously. You must walk around in an office somewhere with your head hidden. Does the internet and fighting give you power? Do you feel brave.. I have yet to see you meet anyone in person. Not one person on here was throwing their beliefs down your throat.. they just want you to choke on your words and shut the fuck up, cause you dont know any more than anyone else. If you are billions of years old and were there when the world began, than praise you.. but believe me, I would rather spit on the ground you walk on than think you are an intelligent person. A wise man knows when to speak, an intelligent man knows what he speaks. and you represent neither, so before you start telling people they are stupid and ignorant and mindless retards, look in the mirror, cause you are looking increasing fucking ugly by the second.
I said I wouldn’t reply, bit I’ll make an exception for you.
I have yet to meet anyone here? How convenient is your memory. I’ll make you the same offer I made before. I’ll pay your way here so you can confront me personally. Then we will see who is brave.
Come on, you gutless jerk, show everyone that you are not just another spineless internet hero hiding behind your computer. I’m putting my money where my mouth is, what are you doing besides hiding behind a fake, insulting ID?
I’m sorry that you have this view of religion, but I can assure you that many theists are free thinkers, sure there are plenty of people who seem brainwashed but that can be said of Atheism also, you yourself criticised fellow atheists for it on this.
Anyway thats not what I want to say, what I want to say is that no matter how angry you are at God or religion or whatever God loves you and will always do so. And I love you, it is the principle tenet of my faith, to love thy neighbour. So much love, God bless and I hope you find happieness and comfort in your beliefs or lack thereof.
Angus, you do not “love” me. That’s what you have been taught to say. Also, there is not god to “love” me. Considering how this mythical god has behaved, killing millions of people and condemning them to an eternity of torture foe not other reason than they had never heard of him, I can do without that kind of “love”, thank you.
Finally, as I have said before, but had ignored with other things, how can anyone hate something that has never existed? Do environmentalists hate Paul Bunyan?
I can hate religion, for it has done great harm in the world and has caused me to be personally abused mentally and even physically. After I announced to my parents that I was atheist, I endured four years of threats, demands, and lectures. Even after I left their home the night I graduated high school, I still heard about it every time I saw them. Fortunately for me, I was able to pay my own way in school and afterward, so I stayed away from them with no contact for years. Sadly, these were years when I would have enjoyed being with the a lot, but their insistence on “bringing me back to the fold” kept us apart. Another strike against religion for me.
Please try to understand this. Atheism isn’t a belief, Atheism is a lack of belief in the unprovable. Faith is professing a continued belief in what you, in your heart, know cannot possibly be true.
No James, I know exactly what I said and I meant it, whether or not you accept it is up to you. And also did this God not in fact send his son to earth to die so that we may be saved.
I will agree with you wholeheartedly in the fact that people take faith too far, they put it where it’s not wanted and wave it around as if it makes them better than everyone else, but I would say those people aren’t truly Christian (or whatever faith they claim as their own).
I’m sorry that you had such troubles due to your stance, that again is not true religion, religion should not be used that way, if someone rejects it that is their choice, we were given the ability to choose and it is our God given right to do so.
And I am well aware of what Atheism is, it is a complete lack of belief in anything that cannot be proven beyond doubt. But as for faith, I know in my heart it is true that is why I profess it and continue to believe it. It is like the feeling of love, you cannot really explain it, it is different for everyone, some people don’t believe in it but in your heart you know it to be true.
No James, I know exactly what I said and I meant it, whether or not you accept it is up to you. And also did this God not in fact send his son to earth to die so that we may be saved.
I will agree with you wholeheartedly in the fact that people take faith too far, they put it where it’s not wanted and wave it around as if it makes them better than everyone else, but I would say those people aren’t truly Christian (or whatever faith they claim as their own).
I’m sorry that you had such troubles due to your stance, that again is not true religion, religion should not be used that way, if someone rejects it that is their choice, we were given the ability to choose and it is our God given right to do so.
And I am well aware of what Atheism is, it is a complete lack of belief in anything that cannot be proven beyond doubt. But as for faith, I know in my heart it is true that is why I profess it and continue to believe it. It is like the feeling of love, you cannot really explain it, it is different for everyone, some people don’t believe in it but in your heart you know it to be true.
If you were able to comprehend what I have posted, you would not say that atheism is a belief. But perhaps the concept is too difficult for you to understand?
You would also know that there is no Jesus and never was. I have directed people to look up Horus, Attis, and Mithra to learn how the jesus myth was created by stealing things from earlier myths.
I’m sure you don;t want to know because your fragile little belief system might come falling down.
You have beliefs that are based upon faith. Faith is accepting myths with no verifying evidence.
I have knowledge. That knowledge is based upon facts, evidence, and rational thinking. All of those must be dismissed to have beliefs and faith.
James, you need to lay off the steroids or whatever you are taking that is making you so angry. I would not be surprised if you wind up with high blood pressure and health problems because you are clearly so full of hate.
I agree with your opinions however you are coming off as a pretentious a**. I know how you feel and how frustrating it is to deal with people who are so clearly not behaving rationally and worse try to enforce laws based on their beliefs. However, these posts your making are not doing a damn about anything. Why don’t you get a life?! Get out there and make a change in the real world. Stop b*tching and moaning here because your too scared to go out there and take a risk. Or maybe your not scared, maybe you just have way to much time for a grown man and prefer to spend all of your time ranting on random websites.
Oh, and your responses are really getting old. I can practically quote what your going to say to me in response to this right now.
“Your such a moron hiding behind your computer you coward. Why don’t you come over here and tell that to my face? Stop forcing your opinions on me. I can do and say what I want! Whaaaah”
Seriously, it’s getting old. If your going to respond to this, come up with something new or I will be forced to leave out of sheer boredom from your predictable cut and paste responses
No, that’s not a big surprise. It is Saturday after all. So this is how you amuse yourself? Sad… fourth of july weekend and everyyything! So how exactly did this post show I’m a stupid fool? Mmmm let me know!!
Aw, I’m sad too! We could have had so much fun with each other!! I always love making people SMILE!! xoxo
Every time I think you have exhibited the ultimate in your stupidity, you surprise me by demonstrating, “No, I can be a lot more stupid than you thought.”
This is Brazil, you sad moron. July 4th is not a holiday here.
Everything you do demonstrates your lack of intelligence, like not being able to figure out that July 4th is not a universal holiday.
I would be the only one smiling. You might not be quite so happy, then or ever again.
But you’re not brazilian yourself sir. Seeing as you were a resident of Arizona and Florida, I assume you have some sense of national pride even if you are elsewhere in the world. So no, I’m not a moron. I never said it was a universal holiday now did I?? Nope! Thanks though for letting me know! Gee, and I was wondering why people in Zimbabwe don’t have Monday off!!!!
Why wouldn’t I be happy!!! Why would I never smile again??????? Awwww, that’d be a bummer, but please give me a detailed explanation as to why I would never smile again!
Again, you reveal your ignorance. How do you know I am not a Brazilian? Because I have lived in other places. I have also lived in Quebec and Holland. Does that make me Canadian or Dutch?
No, you did not say it was a universal holiday but your words “on fourth of July weekend” give the impression that you thought it was a holiday here, too. Maybe if you chose your words more carefully, you wouldn’t appear as a semi-literate moron.
You would never smile again because you would not have anything to smile about. After being shown irrefutable proof of your failings as a human being, is might be hard to be happy about yourself. When you’re not happy about yourself, how can you be happy about anything else? That’s why I smile so much. I am happy with myself, my life, and where I am. So sorry about everything for you.
What kind of Brazilian name is James Smith? Since you’re the one all about making assumptions, it’d be safe to ASSUME you are not Brazilian. I could believe the Canadian one though, maybe you are. Either way, I don’t particularly care 🙂
Sorry you’re bitter about life and nobody likes you :/ You could never come up with irrefutable proof that I’m a failure of a person because there is none. I’m not a failure as a human being- nobody who has written on this page is sir. Not even you, however, I never said anything like that about you. You should be nicer! It’s great you smile, your mom probably will smile once you move out of her house. 🙂
On another note- I want to see more of these little kids’ notes!! Put up more please!!!
Oh and PS—- you did make a little speech telling everyone how you were leaving instead of simply not responding anymore, so it appears as though you were looking for a reaction!!!
I think this webhost should start a new posting with little kids’ letters to JAMES! How cute would they be!!!!
Ah, that explains it! Oh I’m not wound up, don’t worry! Like I said before, nothing really phases me 🙂 You did ignore my last request though to please please dooo tell me why I would never ever smile again after a visit with you! Would it be that deportation process that would bum me out? :/ All talk sir! I don’t appreciate you completely ignoring my retort to you calling me a moron due to your assumption on my fourth of july comment 🙁
So sad about what you pick and choose to respond to!!!! ciaoooo bebe!
The pictures were meant to be funny. Laugh at the ridiculousness and move the hell on. It’s not about religion it’s about kids and the silly things they jot down. Have yourself a good giggle and move the hell on. You’re making yourself look like an ass.
P.S. arguing over the internet is like being in the special olympics, even if you win you’re still a retard.
Dear James,
Your surety and dedication to making sure no one can critise you makes atheists look bad. You do not represent me as an atheist, nor do you represent me as a critical thinker.
Reasonable people can disagree. Your need to follow the comments on this page have proven there is no rational disagreement with you.
In conclusion (watch out, here comes the ad hominem!!), you are a dick.
Exactly when have I said that I represent you or anyone else?
Yes, rational people can disagree. When theists start being rational, there will be no theists.
Perhaps you should try harder to comprehend what is actually being said instead of reading into things what you prefer to have been said. That’s a theist problem. As a professed atheist, I would expect better from you.
Coming form a fuzzy thinker as you have shown yourself to be, if I am a dick, I accept that as a compliment.
Wow! You are *still* replying to this a week later!!
How you get that I am a fuzzy thinker from the few lines I posted is a little beyond me. I claimed that your dedication to knocking back every criticism makes atheists look bad, and I stand by that. I claimed that you don’t represent me as an atheist, and I stand by that. (Note that I didn’t say that you claimed to represent me, I just said that you didn’t — there’s a subtle but important difference there.)
I mentioned my opinion that your compulsive need to follow comments demonstrates an inability to be disagreed with, and I stand by that.
OK, I finished with a tongue-in-cheek ad hominem, but I was kind enough to admit it at the time.
Which was the fuzzy part?
As for your little hint that I have “a theist problem” — I can’t imagine anything more “theist” than compulsively watching an internet comment thread to ensure that no one says the wrong thing…..
Don’t take being a dick as a compliment. Take it as a childish insult with a morsel of truth hidden inside it. Grow as a person. Shut down your computer, go outside, and live.
(PS: I gave the wrong email address in this comment, so your replies won’t get to me. Unless you make the effort to reply to my original comment. Are you that pissed off that you’ll do that?)
What is compulsive about have a little entertainment helping people like you look even more moronic than they do naturally?
Are you against people enjoying themselves?
I am immensely amused by people like you that post ever-increasing mounds if ignorance. Then, when it is pointed out how stupid you are behaving, you whine, moan, and bitch that you are being insulted. If you don’t like the facts, change your behavior.
I stand corrected on the fuzzy thinking. That’s giving you way too much credit. ROFLMAO!
You gave the wrong email address, did you? Well, that adds another dimension to hiding behind your keyboard to say things that you would never say to my face. Why am I not surprised that you would behave like that? COuld it be your own words coming back on you?
I am a catholic who is struggling with my belief. I believe that everyone is entitled to their opinion, as well as you. But you will never see me tell a muslim that it’s despicable when their children pray to Allah, or tell Jews that there is Jesus and they are stupid. To be honest, no one will ever know until we die, and to sit here and argue it is pointless and a waste of time. I am not telling you that you are wrong. But I will also tell you that you are not right. Sometimes the best thing to do is to stick with what we believe and ignore what we dont. If there is a God, it is very cute what those children wrote, and you cant deny that. So look at it that way. What is so wrong with allowing people to have hopes and dreams that they will see their loved ones later in life? That there is always someone to listen to you, even if you cant see them? If you are right and they are wrong, then when they pass on, they will not die, the world will simply cease to exist. They wont know.. they’ll be dead. Some people dont want to live their lives fearing that.. so let people have a religion and dont think little of them. Its how we are and how humans cope with the idea of death and what lies after because that is where science ends.
hey um James Smith, I understand you have your own views and that is perfectly cool. I only say that if you are going to be hateful towards other random people in the internet you do not know and call them idiots, morons, what have you, you might want to not capitalize the first two letters of you. I see your need for emphasis but, it doesn’t particularly strengthen your argument. Besides the fact it is quite annoying.
First, thank you for your reasonable and rational post.
I have no real problem with Buddhism. Frankly, I don’t know enough about it to engage in any specific criticism of it.
I have heard some say that Buddhism isn’t a religion as no specific supernatural belief is involved. If that is true, I would think it is more like a philosophy. But, I have not made a study of it. Even though I have been involved with eastern culture, mostly Korean, for decades. My focus has been on the martial arts, customs, language, and food.
james thank you for your reply. now stop insulting all religions and making broad blanket statements about things that you do not understand. if you have specific complaints im sure the leaders of the places of worship where you live would be more then willing to listen and talk to you about it. please stop this foolishness.
Religions have earned and deserve contempt and to be resisted whenever possible. It is not insults when it is the truth. Please keep in mind that no one has proved that anything I have said is not true. People have whined, complained, and bitched but have not offered any verifiable proof.
Yes, plenty have said they don’t like it and many have said to “Just shut up” but proof? Not one, not ever.
I apparently understand religion better than you do. Maybe I have more experience with it. Maybe I have been exposed to more than the gentle non-theist philosophy of Buddhism?
Keep in mind that to fight evil anywhere is to fight it everywhere.
No, the religions leaders all over the world are not willing to listen and talk about it. If you really understood religion, you would know that.
It is not foolishness to point out the lies and hypocrisy of religion.
Finally, who are you to tell me, or anyone what to do? Do really want to be another of the “just shut up!” brigade? Is suppressing free speech something that is taught in Buddhism?
James, you are absolutely right, religion is responsible for a lot of evil in this world; one only has to look at the Crusades and see there is no argument to the contrary. That is why many Christians, myself included, would tell you that we hate religion, but we love Christ. Christianity at its core is about the love of God overcoming my imperfections, numerous as they are. God would never condone the Crusades, just like he would not condone gay-bashers and men who sit on corners preaching fire and brimstone. Your error is using Christians as the example of Christ, which is really our error as Christians. As Ghandi said, “I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” He hit the nail on the head. But true Christianity lived out would be a very different picture than the one you have painted (though largely warranted). With an open mind, I would encourage you to do some research on religion beyond just its problems and failings, and seek the core message… you may be surprised. As a compromise, I would promise to read any atheist articles or websites you send me. I hope you know that whether you believe in him or not, God loves you so much more than you can fathom.
James, You said that no one was giving you scientific evidence to prove you wrong?
You have also given no proof of the subject that you are defending I’m not here to make a comment such as “god bless” or something to make you mad I am simply on stumble and found an interesting conversation.
You are probably going to reply to this bashing me for making a simply statement to contribute to this conversation. Do you know what the word troll means on the internet?
You say you spend your days mulling around on the internet have you nothing better to do? Before you made the comment of people “trying to shove religion down your throat” no one here was “shoving” religion down your throat.
Human nature is to act defensively once attacked. Do onto others as you would have done to you.(Yes I realize that this is an overused now meaningless cliche) Atheiests will always not like religion because they do not understand. You may take this as comment saying atheiests are “stupid” that is not what I am saying at all I am saying that our minds work differnet.
You say that you had trouble with your parents at home as a child. That is unfortunate. Just think about this if you had different outside influnces there would be no discussion on this topic at all. I myself am a young christian.
I have met many atheiests that say the bible says for christians to hate atheists and everytime I ask them “find me the bible verse that says christians must hate atheists” If you can do this for me I will be suprised.
I came into this conversation open-minded and have made these views contemplating on this discussion. James, my fellow human are a troll. That is not a bash it is a realization. Embrace it. Good day.
James, you need to lay off the steroids or whatever you are taking that is making you so angry. I would not be surprised if you wind up with high blood pressure and health problems because you are clearly so full of hate.
I agree with your opinions however you are coming off as a pretentious a**. I know how you feel and how frustrating it is to deal with people who are so clearly not behaving rationally and worse try to enforce laws based on their beliefs. However, these posts your making are not doing a damn about anything. Why don’t you get a life?! Get out there and make a change in the real world. Stop b*tching and moaning here because your too scared to go out there and take a risk. Or maybe your not scared, maybe you just have way to much time for a grown man and prefer to spend all of your time ranting on random websites.
Oh, and your responses are really getting old. I can practically quote what your going to say to me in response to this right now.
“Your such a moron hiding behind your computer you coward. Why don’t you come over here and tell that to my face? Stop forcing your opinions on me. I can do and say what I want! Whaaaah”
Seriously, it’s getting old. If your going to respond to this, come up with something new or I will be forced to leave out of sheer boredom from your predictable cut and paste responses
Tell me exactly who is forcing you to read anything? Who is forcing you to reply?
Here’s a hint? Look in the mirror and tell that person to stop it right now. Then if they don’t stop, slap them hard across the face a couple of times.
That was a little joke you stupid POS. Now was it directed at you. You are the one that assumes everything here is about you. Remember what you said about “assume”. But your memory is as defective as your intelligence.
I never said anything in that post that would imply I thought it was directed towards me. Nice try though! Merely commenting that you sounded so violent!! So that statement is pretty void! 😀 But thanks for paying attention to my other posts, you’re too sweet!
What you communicated was your total lack of understanding of the post.
That part you thought was “violent” was the joke. I was suggesting that she slap herself for forcing herself to read and reply when it upset her so much. But I understand and forgive you. I knew in advance it would be far too complex for a mental defective like you to comprehend.
It has become clear to me that you have a streak of mental masochism (look it up, I know it’s too esoteric a word for you) that causes you to enjoy seeing yourself being abused in print and revealed to be such a worthless excuse for a human being. Come on down, I can do even better in person. 😀
No, I understood it was a joke. Terribly mean though sir, I would never want someone to slap his or herself repeatedly in the face!! DIdn’t you previously berate someone else for passing out unwarranted forgiveness? I don’t need itttt sir!
PS, for the myriad of vocab words you are spewing out, please get a synonym for ‘defective’ that one in particular is losing it’s harshness 🙁
I do, I love being beaten down on the internet from someone else who spends their time doing so!!! It reminds me about being back in fifth grade with the other little girls yelling across the internet!! 😉
Oh baby, I bet you can do a lot better in person. So sad I’m not coming to brazil. XOXOXO
I will be honest. I found our post and the resulting debate/name-calling contest quite interesting. I don’t want to insult your beliefs, but I have a few thoughts after reading the first 1/4 of the posts (there is WAY too much for me to read it all).
Firstly, good for you for sticking up for your beliefs. I don’t believe in the same things as you, but I do respect people who know what they believe. That is why when people ask me my opinion or beliefs, I tell them. I am a Catholic, I am proud of it, and I firmly believe in God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit and so much more that you do not believe in.
You claim that Catholic children are brainwashed. I have been in Catholic school all my life, until I went to college. This may sound like I am supporting your argument, but in both junior high and high school. I learned not only about Christianity, but about Judaism, Buddism, Hinduism, and pagan religions. I don’t claim to be an expert in these fields, but my schools (which were run by nuns and other Christians) taught me about religions that I don’t agree with. They didn’t teach me why these beliefs are wrong, they simply taught us what others believe. My schools would love me to spread the word of God throughout my life, but they would be ashamed of me if I forced it upon anyone, or if I ridiculed anyones beliefs. I don’t see how schools run by “arrogant” Christians would be capable of such open-mindedness and understanding.
You also claim that children raised in a certain religion have never had an original thought. However, my whole like the people around me (religious and non-religious) have encouraged me to question my faith and be my own person. No one I know would be (or ever has been) upset when I question one of God’s teachings.
James, I could go on forever about my thoughts on your posts. I am pretty sure I will not change your mind, and I am sure you won’t change mine, but I would like to understand you and your reasoning. I would appreciate it if you would answer these questions.
Why did you post on this website? What did you hope to achieve by writing your thoughts?
Do you expect us to applaud your (in my opinion) rude and insulting posts about peoples’ beliefs?
I don’t understand you, maybe I never will, but I would like to. I don’t believe in cramming beliefs down other peoples’ throats. At the same time, I feel you may have crossed a line by starting a religious debate on a website that is supposed to cherish the innocence and way of thinking that children possess.
I am sorry you’ve had bad experiences with Christians and i hope that in time, you will find meet Christians who can change your opinion of us. Please believe me when I say, we are not all bad.
I don’t have time to answer all of your post. Just let me say that, until you understand the difference between “beliefs” and facts, you will never understand a thing I have to say. Beliefs are putting faith in something with no supporting evidence. That is a nutshell description of religion.
Until you are able to comprehend that, there is nothing to discuss with you.
As I have quoted here before, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.” You have dismissed facts, logic, and rational thinking to maintain your beliefs. I have embraced the same to understand the realities of the world. That is the difference between me and every theist in the world.
1. Where did all the water come from? There is not enough water on earth for this to be possible.
2. Was the earth flooded with sea or fresh water? Based on the answer to this question, you could make predictions about which underwater species would have survived a global flood. Presumably, it would’ve been fresh water, meaning most (if not all, given the amount of water needed) of the salt water species would have died out.
3. Why can’t we find any geological evidence which points to a global flood. Flood’s leave visible impact in sediment levels, where are they? If this was really global, the evidence would literally be everywhere.
4. If Jesus was what stopped the flood, why was he born at least 2000 years after the fact? Doesn’t sound like they were related at all…..
5. Most atheist wouldn’t claim (honest ones, anyway) to know that God doesn’t exist, as how can anyone KNOW something doesn’t exist. Most atheists would rate God’s possibility of existing as roughly equal to that of Thor, leprechauns, unicorns, and Dora the Explorer.
6. “who is the creation to question the creator?”
This is my main problem with religion. I do not find that that is a valid way of thinking about anything. It’s an excuse to stop thinking.
I don’t pretend to be an expert in Christianity. I am not a perfect Christian, but I can give you answers to your questions. Not all Christians will agree with me, because there are many types of Christianity and each has slightly different beliefs. But this is what I was told when I asked similar questions.
When you talk about the flood, I assume you are talking about the story of Noah and the ark. First what you should know is that many of the stories in the Bible, especially the Old Testament, are make to help people understand a concept, but are not necessarily what really happened. For example, most Christians do not believe God created the world in seven days. The point of that story is to tell people that God did create and that it took time. However, the people from Biblical times, had no idea how long it really took and would have had trouble grasping the concept of millions of years.
Similarly, the story of Noah is not believed to be true. Christians believe God has the power to flood the entire earth, but the point o the story of the Ark is to warn people of the wrath of God, but it also shows God’s forgiving nature and His love for us because he would not wipeout the human race entirely. It is believed that this story is actually adopted from the story of Gilgamesh, which came from an earlier civilization.
As the question 6, once again I can not speak for all Christians, but I have always been taught to question and challenge my faith. All my life, I have asked questions like yours, and many more. I believe that by doing so, I am able to truly understand and defend what I believe. The Church does not want its members blindly following because they were told to do so. The Church wants people to understand and truly know what each individual believes. There is nothing wrong with exploring, thinking and questioning one’s faith.
“Not all Christians will agree with me, because there are many types of Christianity and each has slightly different beliefs.”
The fact that Christians can’t seem to agree on a lot of things doesn’t lend to the credibility of the Bible. In fact, to me it would seem to detract from its credibility. This is the same standard I would use for any information I was considering.
“When you talk about the flood, I assume you are talking about the story of Noah and the ark. First what you should know is that many of the stories in the Bible, especially the Old Testament, are make to help people understand a concept, but are not necessarily what really happened. For example, most Christians do not believe God created the world in seven days. The point of that story is to tell people that God did create and that it took time. ”
So why is this story figurative when the story of Jesus is considered literal? The writers didn’t seem to denote which parts were allegorical or figurative, so where are you getting this information? If the Bible itself does not say so, who are you, the creation, to question the creator in its meaning?
“Similarly, the story of Noah is not believed to be true.”
By you, no. By others, yes.
“Christians believe God has the power to flood the entire earth”
So why don’t you believe in the flood? You say that you believe God can do those things, but how could you believe this without believing it had occurred at some point?
“but the point o the story of the Ark is to warn people of the wrath of God”
The all-loving wrath of God? Wrath is not synonymous with benevolence nor love. Does it not sound paradoxical to say that people need to be WARNED about this all-loving God? So they, in essence, can protect themselves from him.
“but it also shows God’s forgiving nature and His love for us because he would not wipeout the human race entirely.”
What crimes had the people of earth committed that they DESERVED TO DIE by drowning? What crimes had the newborn’s committed when the flood’s tore down their homes and washed them away? So it’s FORGIVENESS he’s showing when he chooses not to drown EVERY person? A man who in a group of 20 people who murders all but one, is not forgiving for having saved the one. He is still a murderer.
“It is believed that this story is actually adopted from the story of Gilgamesh”
Why isn’t it believed that the story of Jesus is similarly adopted from another culture’s mythic tale, given this obvious evidence? Why single out the creation story and the Ark story and deny evidence that your claim may similarly apply to God and Jesus themselves?
As for faith, plenty of people have it such as Muslim’s in Allah, and Zoroastrian’s in the Creator Ahura Mazda. Do you think Muslim’s also question their faith and, if so, why is it that so many continue to be Muslim. You must admit, that because of your exploration and questioning, you have found that Christianity is the truth and you understand it better as a result. However, the exact same thing is occurring in the Muslim’s, they explore, question and find Islam to be truth and obtain a better understanding as a result.
To you, their exploration and questioning is continuously leading them falsely. Thus, exploration and questioning do not necessarily imply that your belief is truth, or that your inner thoughts help to crystallize truth. Rather, it seems to imply that it is a mechanism of rationalization, as even false beliefs are affirmed by questioning/exploration.
Didn’t intend for this to be so lengthy, thanks for your reply!
This just shows that it only takes one asshole to turn something as innocent as that into some huge debate.. Can’t we just follow rule 32 of ZombieLand and just enjoy they little things?
you are a sad, hipocritical, cynical, and all around thoroughly myopic little man. you claim that responses to your opinions are trivial, not actually referring to the topic at hand, while you yourself respond to them in such a manner as well. intolerance is far from necessary to express your beliefs, just as you, yourself, suggest. you look down upon those who argue via the internet, all the while your views have been the sole ignition of this intense and idle debate. if you believe that Julia’s beliefs are so contradictory to other atheists’ opinions, then explain to me where the other dozens of people on this comment thread came from. i won’t sugarcoat my opinions: you are a pathetic and despicable person, and i take pity upon you. i believe that people like you (NOT other people with your beliefs, origin, or ethnicity, but merely others with your MINDSET) are sole reason for counter-productivity in our society.
How would they be risking their lives? No one has been threatened with death. Well, I have but, like the other hate mail I have received from theists over the years, it’s just bluster.
Perhaps if you tried reading what is actually written instead of what you prefer to think was posted, you wouldn’t make ridiculous replies.
actually you previously threatened ME, this little random internet person here, previously. It was really sweet and endearing and I felt all warm and fuzzy inside that you gave me that kind of attention <3
No, I didn’t threaten you with death. Instead of “heated”, all I did was give you a factual account of what was likely to happen. That account was based upon prior experience.
As always, your comprehension of what you read is only what you want to believe. That’s a common problem with the reality and mentally impaired. I am not surprised you have it.
MM, I don’t know, as I said in anotherrrr post you made assumptions based off a “previous visit” you apparently had. Because I’m sure there is one person out there nuts enough to visit Jurassic Park!! That’s pretty ignorant, you know, when you ASSUME you make an ass out of U and ME. Geez, sir. HYPOOOOCRITE! AHHHH!
Your ignorance is further exposed by your “Jurassic Park” statement.
Those really were not assumptions. As I stated, they were based on experience with a previous experience.
I have a great idea. Why don’t you accept my offer and come on down? Then you can determine for yourself if I am a liar. If nothing else, you will prove I was wrong when I said you were coward intellectually, ethically, and physically. How could anyone as certain they were so right about everything resist that?
I don’t understand all of the anger being passed here. Trying to get a reaction out of another person is just making things worse and everyone keeps ignoring little things they say themselves just to try to make a point. If everyone here really wants people to actually listen well then I would suggest quit with the horrible attacks on people personally it isn’t going to make them listen any better. It will just shoot up wall around all logic and is not conducive to a logical debate.
YOu actually catch more flies with vinegar or apple juice. That’s been demonstrated, too. It was I believe on Mythbusters. It’s just another old wives’ tale like 98% of all religion.
So there are two possible reasons for this “James” character and his actions:
Number 1: Trolls be trollin’. In that case, he’s just trying to stir shit up for the lulz. Don’t feed the trolls and they’ll go away ladies and gents!
Number 2: He really IS posting his thoughts and beliefs on this thread and putting a DAMN LOT of effort into his attempts to refute and belittle anyone who challenges him.
And I really, really, REALLY hope that it’s number 2. You know why? BECAUSE THAT IS HILARIOUS.
James, dude, are you SERIOUSLY getting this pissy over a COMMENT THREAD? Because if you are taking this much time to return to this page over and over again and leave these essay-length responses to anyone who dares to disagree with you, it means you are sad. You are a very, very sad little man. Clearly, your life is empty and filled with a whole lot of anger and stubbornness. And the fact that you are putting this much time and effort into replying to everyone and insisting that everyone else is ignorant, brainwashed, and whatever other fabulous adjectives you threw in there, it just means that you have nothing else better to do.
Yeah, I took the time to write a comment, which means I have nothing else better to do (duh, I found this on Stumble). But OH look at that: I’m gonna leave now, and not give a fuck as to what your response will be.
You guys realize that these are 4-6 year old little kids writing these right? That they aren’t supposed to be taken so seriously? These little kids were told to write a letter to God at Sunday School or something. Obviously whoever told the kids to do this was not “forcing religion down these little kids throats or else you would have seen letters that were extremely more proper and much more robotic.
I don’t think that writing a letter to God when they are 5 is going to seriously scar them for the rest of their lives. Like any other person they will grow up and make a decision on their own on what and what not to believe.
I want to say all of those who were hurt by religion that as a believer I am sorry. Throughout history there has been atrocious crimes against humanity all in the name of “religion.” But let me assure you that even if there was no religion in this world whatsoever, these radicals would find another reason to harm human life and probably commit the exact same crimes. It is for the most part a scapegoat for nutcases who want to have extreme amounts of power to control others to do what they want them to do.
If you even read a bit of Jesus’ teachings in the Bible, he roamed around with people that society had outcasted or turned away from. (i.e. lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes, ect.) He said THE most important rule was to love your brother and treat him how you would like to be treated, NO EXCEPTIONS! He said to love your enemy and pray for those who mean to do you harm. This is the man I try to emulate in my life and who most Christians try to also.
I’m sorry if you have had bad experience with Christians or any religion for that matter. Do not let the choices of a few mask the good that millions of regular religious people do everyday. Life is too short to hate.
You guys realize that these are 4-6 year old little kids writing these right? That they aren’t supposed to be taken so seriously? These little kids were told to write a letter to God at Sunday School or something. Obviously whoever told the kids to do this was not “forcing religion down these little kids throats or else you would have seen letters that were extremely more proper and much more robotic.
I don’t think that writing a letter to God when they are 5 is going to seriously scar them for the rest of their lives. Like any other person they will grow up and make a decision on their own on what and what not to believe.
I want to say all of those who were hurt by religion that as a believer I am sorry. Throughout history there has been atrocious crimes against humanity all in the name of “religion.” But let me assure you that even if there was no religion in this world whatsoever, these radicals would find another reason to harm human life and probably commit the exact same crimes. It is for the most part a scapegoat for nutcases who want to have extreme amounts of power to control others to do what they want them to do.
If you even read a bit of Jesus’ teachings in the Bible, he roamed around with people that society had outcasted or turned away from. (i.e. lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes, ect.) He said THE most important rule was to love your brother and treat him how you would like to be treated, NO EXCEPTIONS! He said to love your enemy and pray for those who mean to do you harm. This is the man I try to emulate in my life and who most Christians try to also.
I’m sorry if you have had bad experience with Christians or any religion for that matter. Do not let the choices of a few mask the good that millions of regular religious people do everyday. Life is too short to hate.
Oh shut up everyone. This wasn’t meant to start a religious debate. This is adorable, funny and it goes to show how innocent kids still can be. I think this is so sweet. It’s really sad that some people can’t take a break and just laugh at the litte things. I wish people didn’t feel the need to argue literally, everything.
I think this is a great post. It’s funny, it’s cute and it makes me realize that the little things in life matter most. Thank you.
Yes, just shut up! When you see something you don’t like, tell them to just shut up. Free speech isn’t for everyone, is it? Especially for those horrible godless atheists.
Here’s a news item for you. We are all godless because there is no god. Some of us just happen to know that and can live with it without pretending it isn’t true. Theists deny the obvious and waste their lives and resources in denial.
My point was, these kids are so young, they don’t know better whether to believe in God or not. I believe in God and I practice my religion. I’m only 19 and I’m disgusted by the ignorance of some of the grown adults that are arguing over whether God exists. That wasn’t the point of this post.
Sorry James, but you’re very ignorant. So someone believes in God, get over it. Just because you don’t and you can’t put your ignorance aside, is really sad. You can’t convince someone who believes in God, to not believe in God so there isn’t a point in you trying. Not to mention the fact that they’re not going to listen to some random guy who’s being an asshole to everyone over the internet. You’re just being an instigator. The same goes for everyone else who’s trying to.
The point of this post was to be cute and funny – not to start a whole argument. CLEARLY these kids don’t know any better whether to believe in God. And my point is, if someone believes in God, let them. They probably don’t agree with people not believe in God but who frickin cares! No one is going to convince someone out of their beliefs via this post.
YOu cal me ignorant. I am not the one believing in an imaginary god without on iota of proof of it.
If you were not willfully ignoring anything that doesn’t say what you want to believe, you would have noted that I have repeatedly said I do not care what anyone believes. I do care when they use those beliefs to enact their “faith” into laws that force others to follow the same delusions.
I have also said many times on here that I do not expect to convince any believers. To quote. “you cannot reason a person away from a position the did not reach through reason.”
If I am being an asshole what do you think your arrogant post is? You are demanding that I surrender my right of free speech to accommodate your beliefs.
No one is forcing you to read anything. But you want to force others to stop posting. In your mind, that is OK.
You ignore the facts to maintain your religion. You also ignore the fact that no one on here has ever proven that so much as one word I have posted is not true. Like you, they whine, moan, and complain, but it changes nothing. If you don’t like what I say, demonstrate with verifiable evidence that I am wrong. Or, you could just stop reading and answering. I have told others that, but you ignore that, too. Is it any surprise that “ignore” and “ignorant”have the same root?
I proved your point only if it was that you are a willfully ignorant person that believes you are the head web Nazi that is supposed to tell everyone else what to do and say.
Show that anything I have said is not true. But you ignore that like you ignore everything else that is a little difficult for you to understand.
If any point has been proven, it is mine that you are determined to be arrogant about your ignorance and will never respond intelligently to anything. You may think of that as an insult, but it is what you have demonstrated about yourself. If you don’t like it, perhaps you should simply slink away like so many others.
Facts, proof, rational replies, all of the things that are dangerous to any religion. That’s what I am asking for from you and everyone.
And you are horrible for being a semi-illiterate that cannot think of anything other than “troll”. I am not a troll for stating nothing but the truth. You are so arrogant in your ignorance that you refuse to acknowledge or even recognize that no one has proven that anything I have said is not the truth.
How am I a semi-illeterate exactly? Please PLEASE let me know, I’m so offended!! For the MILLLLLIONTH time GEEZ, I am not attacking your atheist views, I really don’t give a shit if you’re a buddhist, catholic, jewish american princess or worship the devil sir. I never said you were a liar have I? No, so please don’t use those same words on me that you do other people that don’t like atheism on here. I have very good friends who are atheists! And they’re great. Good for them for believing what they want, they’re not wrong, I don’t assume I’m right in my religion either, which you still don’t know what I am either. I’m pretty passive actually when it comes to religion, I think it’s great everyone has something they believe in, whether it’s god or nothing. I don’t take the bible literally or worship anyone or preach to anyone. Do your own thing and let other people do theirs is the way I see it!!
Nothing really bothers me on here, it’s just fun to get these angry wild reactions out of you literally over NOTHING!!! Keep them coming sir!
YOu are semi-literate because you cannot think of anything but “troll”. Even that is not original with you, but something you read that looked good to you so you use it because it’s easier than thinking.
When did I say you were attacking my atheism? Again, you are so poor in thinking ability that you can only see things that you hope are there.
I said you were a liar because it’s what you are. It’s not an insult if it’s the truth. You haven’t said I’m a liar for the same reason no one else has proven anything I’ve posted isn’t true.
I doubt you have good friends that are atheists. I doubt that you have any friends at all.
I could not care less about your religion, as I have said here many times. What a person chooses to believe isn’t important to me. I only care when those beliefs affect my life and freedom. Every religion wants to absorb more members. That’s not wrong, either. If they can do it with facts, and the power of logic, good for them. When they do it by forbidding questions, enacting their beliefs into law, and demanding freedom from criticism, and the liberty to brainwash others into compliance, especially using public funds, then there is a problem.
That’s been my entire message here. It’s too bad that you are so determinedly stupid that you refuse to see that or accept it as being a rational, fair attitude.
Is it any wonder I regard you with the contempt you deserve as a liar and intellectual, ethical, and physical coward?
I never said it was. But this is hardly the first person here to tell me to “shut up”. So I have good reason to assume it is directed at me, while you have little to assume it is not.
“Yes, just shut up! When you see something you don’t like, tell them to just shut up. Free speech isn’t for everyone, is it? Especially for those horrible godless atheists.”
Yes, you were implying it was aimed towards you!! Bahaha hooray. So no, when she says “shut up everyone”, that is not a good reason to assume it was aimed towards you just because others directed it at you. Gotta give everyone a chance!!!!
so, regardless, ALL christians belive in something that is purely, logical not true. it’s obivous to anyone who spends even a few miniutes honestly thinking about it.
and to those of you who say “well, they’re not hurting anyone” or “those people who … are not real christians” are both idiots and denying the very truth of the matter.
chrisianty has been, and continues to be, a plague on society. christ and your make-belive god has been the reason for everything from the crusades to the salem witch burnings to bombing abortion clinics. and it doesn’t stop there. Sure that my not represent ALL christians, but the fact that this dangerous religion can be used to legitimize any of these atrocities clearly shows that this religion can be interpreted in such a way to make these terrible things okay, and even encouraged.
let’s say there was a club… we’ll call it the C+J club, and we’ll say this club encouraged people to help sick people get better. sounds good on the surface, right? now let’s say they call being gay, sick… now it doesn’t sound so good right? ask anyone in the C+J club and they tell you “we help the sick,” and when confronted with “what about how you treat gay people?” they would have to answer 1 of 2 ways. 1) “i don’t belive they’re sick, and those who do, do not represent ALL C+J Club members” or 2) “gay people are sick and we should fix them” put that way, nobody would want to be a member of this club, unless you’re a biggot and hate gay people, because either you’re a person trying to defend a club’s belief structure to those who can see that they’re doing wrong, or you’re one of those doing wrong. so either you’re defending those wo do wrong (by defending your club) or doing wrong yourself.
simple.
God is a lie, you’d be foolish to belive it.
read up, and free yourself.
You know people that post comments, like these here, are said to have the lowest IQ. Shit, now I’m one of those idiots.
Come on people…while yes, this was all very interesting to read, I just realized I could have been watching porn and learned more than I did from this discussion.
You are right about those guys. They are all crazy and give Christians a bad name.
Praying for your child rather than use medical facilities is dumb. I don’t really care about religions not paying taxes but I can’t recall ever being exempt from then simply because I’m a Christian.
Personally I don’t agree with homo sexuality but it’s not like I hate them. One of my good friends is a bisexual.
Man I wish I had your faith. It’s pretty awesome
You do get a tax deduction for any contributions to a religious organization. If you didn’t know that, you need to brush up on your tax codes. The religious organization doesn’t pay taxes on those contributions, either. so that money is never taxed and other people have to make up for what you d not pay.
I have said many times here but you choose not to understand. Atheism isn’t “faith”. It is living by truth and rational thinking. Beliefs and faith is rejecting those things in favor of myths, lies, and fairy tails.
Believing in any religion in the face of truth and reason is more than awesome, it is admission of willful ignorance.
You are an idiot. At least your fake ID is accurate. You ARE an idiot. Your comment is neither original or kind. DO you always denigrate and make fun of those less fortunate than you? That sounds very immature to me.
How ironic you should use the insulting phrase, “grow up”when you are clearly a childish fool without originality or the intelligence to even select something less over-used.
Pff this “Youre an idiot” guy just got owned. how dare he make fun of the mentally disabled. Obviously they are the only people that James here accepts because they have a similar I.Q. to him. This guy will obviously know better before he decides to regurgitate something he saw on the internet.
then “your an idoit” has the gall to offer the advice to grow up! What a complete dingus! If you can tell by James is a 70 something year old smiling hat wearing gentleman. To say this man needs to be older is basically telling him to die.
Did you see that James? This guy just sent you a death threat…
Just to let you know you sadistic basterd, James is not going to let you get away with this. If you cant tell by his picture he is an avid hunter or tour guide at A wild animal park it could be either or with that amazing hat. Either way though he is skilled tracker and will hunt your ass down like a lame wildebeast.
If you are going to indulge yourself in sarcasm, please take some advice from an expert.
First be sure you have your facts correct. I am neither “70 something” nor a tour guide at a wild animal park.
If you wish to denigrate someone, pick on something substantial instead of non-essentials like my hat. All that does is show you can’t think of anything rational to pick on, so have to choose something that really doesn’t matter. Whether you like the hat or not, you must admit, I am not one of those idiots that wear a cap backwards because it’s “kewl”. A cap on backwards looks cute until you are about 5, then it just looks as though you are too stupid to know which way it goes on.
Yeah if I ever choose to be sacastic i will definitely find an expert to help me out on such a delicate subject.
I apologize about my insane accusation that would infer you were as young as “70 something” Next time i will definitely fact check my statements. As far as you being a tour guide that was my second guess behind avid hunter… Would you happen to be an avid hunter and/or go on safari’s on a daily basis? Because that is the only reason i would see such a need for a preposterous looking hat.
But as far as putting your hat backwards I do not think it would make you super kewl or anything because its a round hat… I think i would look the same backwards as it would forward. But thats just me talking I dont know anything about how you hipsters from the 1930’s like to be kewl.
I don’t know if you were refering to me getting “owned” or not but I can’t really look in a mirror because I also choose to wear the same exact rose colored old lady glasses that you have on. They not only help with my cataracts but they also give me an excuse to give the police when I plow through a redlight and hit some school kids crossing the street.
Thank you for letting me know the error of my ways. Obviously you know what your talking about when it comes to fashion. I will always from now on pay attention to the direction on my face my hat is facing since it is no longer kewl to walk around with my sombrero backwards.
WHOOOOAAAA you totally look like my buddy who played him!!!!!
Did you do that on purpose or do you just always walk around with a big dumb hat like that?
Either way you should look into becoming a look a like!
Jeff: Yes, you are another moron that cannot think of anything intelligent to say. So you pick on something totally irrelevant and reveal your stupidity to all. Kiss my ass.
Connor: Why do you care and what business is it of yours? I have answered that question here several times. If you are desperate to know, read until you find it.
I was just curious why you continue to argue the same points continuously with different people even though very few provide somewhat different information to provide a basis for their own beliefs?
This has gotten way out of hand….Its childrens letters to God,So WHAT?!!If it was letters to Santa would there have been a debate at all??Instead ye lot turned something that showed there was some little bit of good left in the world into an example of how messed up and hateful we have become…bad example for the future generation!!!
I wonder what it’s like to be driven by so much hate? To constantly go through your days, plotting and planning cold and troll-like responses. It must be exhausting. How could you be happy, when all you exert is hatred and stubbornness?
Now I know you’re going to have some witty, acidic response to fire back at me, and all that hate you fire off at me will get you off tonight, but I just want you to realize that I pity you. & I know you “won’t care” but I think you should know. These people here responding, atheist or religious, live happy fulfilling lives, but it seems you do not. They have something other than hate to get them up in the morning.
Why are you such a troll? Why are you even responding? If you had actually read the things I wrote and my replies to people you wouldn’t write something so clearly uninformed as “hate”. But it seems that theists are obsessed bit hate. Are you a theist?
Theists are also obsesses with telling everyone “what I want you to realize” and that “I pity you”. SO for you, I want you to know your attitude is arrogant, condescending, and I really don’t care what you allegedly think.
Furthermore, you cannot possibly know that the people on here “live happy, fulfilling lives” or that I do not.
Think about this, your post is filled with unwarranted assumptions and attempts to assign motivations that directly contradict what I have said. Several times I have directly stated that it is amusing to me to observe how many ignorant, ridiculous statements people will make on here. Even after they have been told this, people continue to make me smile or even laugh by posting even more preposterous things. Thank you for starting my day with a smile. You, too have demonstrated the unrelenting arrogance and stupidity of theists.
A couple posts above you were just calling someone stupid for using the word troll and you just used it to “insult” someone else. Maybe you should go look through your old posts to remember what you said and stop being a hypocrite.
It isn’t an insult if it’s true. So many have a hard time understanding that. As for being a hypocrite, I have stood behind every word I have ever said. There are so many, even on here that could give graduate-level courses about hypocrisy. To pick on me is hypocritical, too.
This James guy is a Genius! He gets all of you guys riled up by posting complete nonsense on a random website to argue with people he will never meet!
Its free entertainment. He could be arguing that the sky is brown for all it matters to him. He just wants people to get pissy and argue something ove the internet.
Someone just keep insulting him and his intelligence so I can keep reading this threat.
Everyone follow me:
Jose if you weren’t such an asshole then everyone here could enjoy these little kids writing to God. But instead you had to just shit all over it. Congradulations you ignorant bastard I think you gave a puppy cancer with all of your retarded illogical rants you were trying to pass off as an arguement. I will not only forgive you that you said God doesnt exist but I also will forgive you for being a complete loser that, in between your hardcore masturbation sessions and watching farm animal porn, you choose to spend your meaningless life on a random thread on the internet trying to tell everyone about your “overwhelming” facts. You should spend less time on this website and more time clubing baby seals or telling kids with cancer that their parents don’t really love them and they will die soon, since you have such a way with words. Fall down some stairs into something hard and sharp. Thanks.
What gives you the right to forgive anyone? Similarly, why does YOUR forgiveness matter (to say it does rings of arrogance)?
Examples of good Christian dialogue (courtesy of James is a genius):
“I also will forgive you for:
being a complete loser
your hardcore masturbation sessions
watching farm animal porn
your meaningless life
clubing baby seals
telling kids with cancer that their parents don’t really love them and they will die soon”
You then tell him to:
“Fall down some stairs into something hard and sharp. Thanks.”
Sounds like he’s not the only one who’s going to need some forgiveness.
Ok “ugh” I dont know what this whole glass house and throwing stones thing is but it sounds like a threat and one thing I dont appreciate is threats pal. James needed forgiveness and he recieved it from me. He is welcome. As for you asking for forgivness along with him, I will allow this one time as a one time “double forgiveness extravaganza weekend.” Your welcome because usually i wouldnt forgive such a pathetic cousin ****ing inbred such as yourself. But i am feeling “God” like this very day. Something you wouldnt know about you godless heathen.
Next time you think about tossing rocks or putting people in glass shanties you should remember that that kind of thing isnt very polite and usually is met with hostility. I have seen people killed and/or horribly disfigured (most often with a extrremely sharp pencil or prison shank) for saying much less.
However if you were to toss marshmallows and adopt kids and put them in a nice fancy glass orphanage then that is a different story altogether.
Just remember to always remember what Jesus would say to someone like me who is trying to spread the good word to people across the internet.
To Jamses I am a Christian (just thought I should state that first off) and I was just wondering if you like intellectual conversations why did you never answer Kaitlyn back? and yes I did read the ENTIRE conversation on this site so yes I do know this. but also I would like to say that through out this whole conversation you have been calling theists morons and so on. you have also been ridiculing the people on this site (note I did not mention the ones outside this site because I don’t know that information[and given they did start it,most of them]) for bashing your lack of belief and your wanting tolerance but you give none in return. I loved reading you thoughts please share them but please do not call all Christians morons becase that hurt very much and you have not met all the Christians in the world. I do not wish to anger you because I was taught to respect my elders. And I also wish to apologise for the people on here for being rude and hateful to you.
I just wanted to say that i go to catholic school was raised half jewish half Christian and to accept the power and holiness of nature. I believe in the power of fate and morality. But i don’t think that anyone should be viewed as stupid or ignorant because the choose to follow or not follow religion. By forcing others to believe what you do causes you to look like a fool. although debate is a productive tool for reasoning, for it to work correctly “simply stating fact” which comes across as rude and hurtful is not helpful on either side. I am saying that neither side of the argument is in the gold here because both have resorted to word violence, immediately disgracing themselves. There are points in the bible or torra or Koran or any other religious scripture where I feel that reasonably we can guess that the exact thing didn’t happen. however when we look at any tale this happens, dragons may not exist, but they tough me that i can overcome the most dangerous and scary monster, in that alone i find them valuable. One of the most scientifically reasonable girls I know is also the most religious, she understands that when the bible was written it was being used to explain phenomenon that are now explained by science. I am stating all this to say that maybe I don’t agree with you, I will not pretend that i read everything that was written because lets be serious… but I think that although religion can be blamed for some for the evil in the world it can also be granted with some of the peace, for very clearly it is stated that tho shale not kill.
ps i purposely left a large amount of grammatical errors because I think that we should look past the flaws of quick fingers and look more at the words one is trying to speak also im dyslexic so i have a hard time spotting them 😛
Yes, I can. You can probably tell how I feel about whatever you allegedly think by my previous posts. I only respect people with rational mental processes who have the courage of their convictions and are willing to engage in honest discussions. You do not qualify on anything in your post.
I don’t think according to you anyone matches up to your intellect. That’s called arrogance. Sorry to break it to you but I doubt you are smarter than EVERYONE on this website and you would be delusional to believe that.
Tel me, Bree. Exactly when have I said that? I do think it is obvious that I have made better use of my intellect than many on here.
Perhaps you should go back and read my posts a little more objectively. You are so determined that I am a horrible person and am wrong about everything that you cannot be “fair and balanced” in your evaluation of what I post. It seems you start out with a conclusion then interpret everything you read so it supports that conclusion.
I may have to change my atheism position. Over the weekend I personally saw solid proof of the power of prayer!
Here, the national sport is futebol. (soccer in America) I saw and heard with my own eyes and ears, no second-hand reports, several people praying for their team to win. This team, although not the favorites, did win!
The laws of probability and physics were suspended in their favor. Even though, around the world, 27,000 children were dying of starvation and malnutrition at the same time the game was being played. You can’t explain that!
If you don’t believe me, I can show you the very stadium where the game was played!
I applaud you and your efforts of sitting on this website for hours at a time waiting for someone else to get upset over something you said. That takes dedication and commitment. In the words of the ever blessed Richard Dawkins: “Fuck bitches, get money”.
You expose your own ignorance. No surprise at that on this site. I don’t have to sit on this site, you moron, I have notification set.
I couldn’t care less if people get upset. If you didn’t have the comprehension deficit of the year, you would have noticed that it is low-level entertainment for me to point out the ignorance and stupidity of people like you.
You are also a liar. Richard Dawkins never said that. But you are far too stupid to understand that no one would fall for such a blatant lie.
Here’s my quote for you. “Just when you think someone can’t get any more ignorant, they come back and show you that they can be a lot more ignorant than you thought.”
Hmmm I never knew God said the world would be perfect. Where in the Bible or anywhere it says that everyone in the world would be free of suffering. Even God’s own son Jesus was crucified.
How does that prove any point whatsoever? I prayed that I would come home and my wife had made me dinner! WHOA the power of prayer!
It doesnt work like that and your arguement is extremely flawed.
But are you handing out trips to Brazil? Because I would be totally interested in that.
I think you missed the point. That was satire. But missing the point and failing to recognize facts is how you theists continue to believe in the impossible, improbable, and ridiculous.
Sure, come on down. Then we’ll see if you want to talk to me to my face as you do on here. Your risk, my fun.
Let’s not kid anyone. You have no intention of confronting me personally. You only hope you can get me to send you the money or a refundable ticket because what passed for ethics with you permits lying and cheating a “godless atheist”. I am not stupid enough to do that. The ticket would be electronic and only refundable to me when you didn’t show up. How is your interest now?
I think that was exactly your point. You said the power of prayer helped people’s football teams win but could not help starving children in Africa right?
How is it as crazy to think that we were all devinely put here then it is to think we were all somehow put here by a giant mistake?
It seems as though the world is so logically put together and explainable according to anyone that is able to understand science. But how is it so perfect? It is hard to believe that we are just a mistake that is a result of billions of years of evolution and a cosmic blast that just so happened to land us at an exact point in an infinite space.
That just takes just as much “faith” to believe that as to believe a diety put together all of that to create us.
Please do not create another ad hominem debate, just debate the issue.
P.S. Why do want someone to fly down to visit Brazil to debate an issue on the existence of God? Do you not have enough people in Brazil to debate that issue with? Im being honest with you in saying it sounds a little creepy.
HAHAHAHA I loved that. Thank you for making my day James. And I completely agree with everything you believe in.
and in response to “a free trip to brazil?”…the world is NOT perfect, we are NOT made perfectly. for example, we have a number of vestigial structures in the human body that serve no prupose, yet we were created to be perfect? If you knew anything about science, you would understand that.
The problem is that ‘creationists’ think backwards…ponder this, you see a puddle on the side of the road. If thinking from a creationist point of view, you would say to yourself, wow..that puddle fits flawlessly that hole. that water must have been made perfectly to fit in that hole! In reality, the water conformed and changed to fit that hole…
Thanks for the reply. Although I disagree about “beliefs” That is what theists have, beliefs because they have no foundation in verifiable facts.
The world is not perfect? What does that have to do with inviting people to speak to me to my face the way they do on here?
You are correct about the vestigial organs, such as the appendix, tail, and others. Those alone seem to be proof of evolution, although creationists would deny it as they do any other fact that does not match their delusions.
“If I knew anything about science”? What makes you think that I do not? I have been a technical writer for IBM, Hughes Aircraft, and many companies in computer-related and aerospace fields. How could I not know anything about science? Most of my life has been involved with science.
Yes, I have heard that puddle in the hole story many times. It is a goof illustration of the fallacy that the world was created for humans. It ignored the obvious fact that most of it is uninhabitable for humans without high-technology protection. That’s one more fact ignored by creationists, no?
BTW, it’s “you’re” not “your”. And your comment is the typical juvenile retort I have come to expect from immature, brain-damaged jerks.
I have had more and better jobs that a nut-case like you will ever have. FYI, I am an IBM retiree, owned martial arts and Nautilus fitness canters, have been a technical writer for computer industry and aerospace firms, and a consultant to police forces in the USA< Mexico and Brazil.
Do you feel stupid enough yet? I have plenty more for you if you need your masochistic impulses fed.
James, I have to giggle a little bit. I read up top you said something to the effect of “Juvenal avoidance of the issue at hand” because someone pointed out your typing errors.
I don’t mind them, I think they’re cute. I do them too.
But why it’s so funny is you’ve completely got out of hand yourself. This original post was a funny little thing about kids being dissapointed in the god that their parents gave to them. Now you’ve just painted yourself as a faux-intellectual with a false sense of superiority because your opinions are “right.”
Also, please note, these are all your opinions. And I find it silly that you’re fighting with a bunch of atheists. They have the same idea of your opinion too. Didn’t you ever have a gym class when you were a kid? Remember when your teammates would get pissed because you wouldn’t pass the ball to them? They’re all on your side.
For Giminey’s sake, come back down to earth. That goes for all of you. Remember rule of the internet #19, “the more you hate it, the stronger it gets.”
So, James Smith Joao Pessoa of Brazil. Get over yourself. The internet hates you. That makes you strong. I await your retort.
My, aren’t you the arrogant little twit? YOu know everything and are entitled to tell everyone what to do. If that’s what you can do, then you must grant me the same privilege.
Opinions? I deal in facts. Tell me one word I have posted that was not correct. I have said this before and no one has even responded. So you wonder why that is?
The internet cannot hate me. The internet is a vast network of computers, links and lines. It is not self-aware or intelligent. Very much like you. LMAO!
Well, we could even simply just look at this reply to my post, as a start. Then after that, I’ll bring your very first post down here, just so we can look at the root of the problem.
“arrogant little twit”= opinion. You cannot prove I’m an arrogant little twit. Others may think differently.
“You know everything and are entitled to tell everyone what to do.” = opinion. While I appreciate the thought, I really don’t know everything. And that’s my opinion, feel free to feel differently (or not, I can’t tell you what to do after all)
“The internet… is not self-aware or intelligent. Very much like you.” Again, opinion. The reasons why should be self evident.
Now, all of these remarks were simply defense against your silly little attacks, so I’m going to bring your very first post down here that started it all and show you how much of what you say is complete and total poppy-kosh.
“more examples of children being brainwashed”
“religion based on lies”
“So many of them learn to lie so well”
“Crimes against humanity created by religion”
First of all, religion can not commit a crime, it is a non-physical idea and is not self-aware or intelligent.
Also, until I see the data that children become brainwashed by religion, I really can’t take that one as a fact. I was born and raised in a Christian home, but I left the religion because of how annoying the activists are. However, just because they choose to raise their children in the way that they believe is correct, does not mean they are trying to brainwash the child.
For example, say a child is born to a family of psychologists. They all firmly believe that Nature has a stronger role in the personality of a human and are making a living by researching for proof. However, as the child grows older, he decides for himself, even though his parents don’t believe it, that Nurture probably has more to do with it. So he starts researching it himself. He was never brainwashed, he was just raised on one idea. It’s possible to change. Therefore, that statement is an opinion.
Number two, religion based on lies.
I once watched an interview with Ayn Rand and some big important religious leader person. She said something very unintelligent, which upset me, but it gives me a good quote to use here. This is paraphrased of course, I can’t exactly remember what she said, “I should not be asked to disprove something. If it cannot be seen, touched, tasted, smelled, or heard, then it does not exist.”
Well, if you want to go by this, then you, James, do not exist. And this can be scientifically proven according to one of the greatest atheists in the world. But it simply doesn’t work like that, does it? Of course you exist, you here typing back to me, aren’t you?
So even if the burden of truth does lie on the religious, that doesn’t mean we can absolutely say that they’re wrong or that they’re lying; we simply choose to believe that there is no god. Let’s live and let live.
Number three, learning to lie.
Again, no empirical evidence. No physical tests to be done, no data to be taken. And hell, if you really want to get into it, a person that does the religion right shouldn’t lie at all. So, because I have the ability to say that you’re wrong and have just as hard of a time proving it, due to the fact that it’s also an opinion, makes your opinion an opinion as well.
So James, you’re right. The internet may not hate you. But perhaps a lot of it’s users do. I know I don’t though. But it really is a shame to see an older gentlemen who did so many great things with his life get on the internet to do something like your doing. Your time on this earth is limited, and if the religious people are wrong, then let them be. They’re going to the same place as you. And if you can’t stand what they do against humanity, then teach them how to follow the religion in the way that it was meant to be followed according to the new testament. If you could do that, you could both have your cake and eat it too.
Lets find a way to make everyone happy, James. Weed out the lies placed in the religious community. Learn the new testament. Use their weapon against them to try to bend them to be better people. If they are still religious, but living to better the world and not impose their ideas, then what does it matter?
Can you tell me one offence to humanity these children who wrote these letters committed? I see no harm in a letter to god.
As I expected, you made a long, rambling reply without proving a thing. What you say is my opinion are statements of observed fact. For example, that you are a brainless twit. Your own post demonstrate that.
I asked you to prove that one word I have written is not true. Also as I expected, you ignored that and inserted more pointless rambling of your own.
Skipping all of your nonsense, let’s get to the brainwashing. If you knew how it worked, you wouldn’t say the indoctrination of children is not brainwashing. Yes, other beliefs can be brainwashed into them too. Here is how brainwashing works.
The desired beliefs are repeated frequently.
The beliefs are not permitted to be questioned.
The recipient is required to repeat the beliefs by rote.
Pressure from superiors and peers is applied to ensure compliance.
That is exactly how religion is taught to children.
You can find a way to make me happy. either start being rational or STFU.
I have never said the letters were an offense to humanity. That is simply a lie from you. Nor is there arm in a letter to god. I never said that, either. It is you that is a deluded liar.
And I quote, “More examples of children being brainwashed into a religion built on lies. Is it any surprise that so many of them learn to lie so well. Never mind the ones that are delusional for the rest of their lives. Those are just more crimes against humanity committed by religion.”
You did say it, buddy. It was actually the first thing you said.
And you’re right about the brainwashing, kudos to you. But in that case, you could say I learned history in the same way, is history a lie too?
Regardless, the burden of proof doesn’t lie on me, sir. It’s up to you to prove what you say. You’re the one saying it. So I would like some links, some studies, anything to show that every single religious person is a liar.
If you knew how opinions worked, you probably wouldn’t be saying half the things your saying
Opinions can’t be proven
Opinions differ from person to person
Opinions can easily be fought over for centuries.
Also, I’m trying to hold a decent conversation with you. I just want us to come to an agreeable stalemate, so if you could please discontinue the insults. It’s upsetting and does not provide to your argument. All it does is empower me. If you want me to believe you, then prove that you can respect another human being… otherwise you’re just proving that you really have nothing to say, you’re only saying it in a way that will get people to listen to you.
One more little thing. Isn’t it interesting how it’s always the religious people that mention hate? For something that is supposed to be about peace and love, theists seem to be obsessed with hate. The bring it into the conversation frequently and practice it in their daily lives. But then, hypocrisy and religion are semantically equal, as I have said before.
Note by blog listed below. In it, I recommend that we not worry about whether jesus existed and instead concentrate on the messages of tolerance, (“let he who is without sin, cast the first stone”) love and peace. But that isn’t good enough for most christians. Everyone has to conform to their interpretation of the bible. And yes, I have read it several times, both old and new testaments and find it is nothing more than a badly-translated, politically edited, collection of myths and lies.
Again, you spout total nonsense. What you choose to believe are insults are statements of the facts I have observed.
You have an opinion that you have yet to back up with facts.
Until you do, you are not holding a conversation, you are attempting to lecture.
Until you bother to produce fact instead of ranting about how you don’t like my facts, don’t bother replying.
You have earned every “insult” by your own statements. You assume I, or anyone cares about what passes for thinking with you.
I know most here do not care what I say, that doesn’t bother my. It amuses me when people like you respond with increasingly ignorant remarks and evade direct questions and challenges.
I have said that here many times but it seems a few have a hard time comprehending that. Well, that’s not a surprise. When they are unable to comprehend anything else that doesn’t agree with their brainwashing, how could anyone expect them to understand that?
Firstly, thank you for not insulting me, I appreciate it.
Secondly, yes, the bible is poorly translated and politically edited. But if you really think about the story of Jesus, would you reprimand him for anything he did? Honestly, I think he was an okay guy. If people were more like him, then people would be happier and better people.
And unfortunately, what you said about religious people hating more often then not is somewhat true. But again, that doesn’t mean they are all like that. Just the ones who have no idea what they’re doing.
Again, I’m standing beside my opinion that if religion were done right, living your life like Jesus from the New Testament, then the religious people would not be such a bother. So again, I implore you, teach them what it means to be a good person, if you have to manipulate their own brainwashing, so be it. Teach them how Jesus really lived, ignore everything else in the bible, just teach them the best way to live.
People are more apt to listen to you if they think you’re agreeing with them, so let them think that. Calling them mindless twits isn’t going to help them. No one likes feeling stupid. So let them feel smart, then you can use your own intellectual superiority to steer them in the right direction.
James, I’ve decided that you’re an okay guy, you’re just going about things wrong… So just try out my theory for a while. See how it goes for you. If you want to preach against hate, start by loving.
Oh, nevermind, I though you went a whole response without insulting me.
I can’t prove my opinions, and if you want to call what you say facts, then so be it. But you still can’t prove it. You sit here rambling how wrong people are. How they can’t prove anything they say. How it’s complete nonsense. Yet suprizingly, it’s all you keep saying. I honestly don’t think you have anything to back you up, you’re doing exactly what you’re accusing others of doing. Evading.
Give me proof, or there is none.
You haven’t shown me a single thing you said to be true. You just insult and hide behind your endless loop of perceived ignorance. Everything that comes from your mind to this page is complete garbage because nothing is anything but attacks and insults.
So, it’s already established that I’m a mindless moron, now prove to me that you aren’t.
And just so you know, insulting me in this next post just proves my point. Telling me my opinions are wrong proves my point. Saying everything you’ve spoken is truth without evidence proves my point. Why you may ask? Because it just goes to show that you can’t really defend yourself. It just goes to show that everything you say is mindless angry rambling. It just goes to show that you’re afraid of loosing to a 19 year old.
To me, sir, you’re just as bad as the religious… Militant egotism is the worst disease a person can have.
Doing things like Jesus? “I come n in in peace but with a sword”?
You can live like the jesus myth said only if you pick and choose your verses. That’s what most theists do anyway.
Again, I never said ALL christians are obsessed with hate. What I said was, when it is brought up, why is it always by a christian? Why is it that the religious people of any stripe are flying planes into buildings, murdering gays and “heretics”, demonstrating their intolerance, bombing family planning clinics, shooting doctors, and assaulting those that do not fit their idea of what should be?
Everything I say is mindless angry rambling? Again, prove one thing I have posted is not true. You can ignore that forever and all it proves it that you know I am right but are afraid to admit it.
Militant egoism? What a crock you are. Come on, either prove something right or wrong or just slink away and pretend you “won”.
When have I said that your opinions are wrong? I have only said to prove them correct or to prove anything I have written is not true. You have done neither, so my statements stand.
Give me a verse where Jesus gets upset with a person that claims no religion. If you do, you win that argument.
And you keep saying my opinions are mindless rambling, so yes, you imply that their wrong. What sort of mindless rambling is right?
And I already told you, I’m not interested in proving you wrong. I’m interested in you proving you right. You haven’t done that either. And you can’t.
I can’t prove you wrong because everything you say is an opinion. You can’t prove them right for the same reason.
So please, prove yourself right, or you’re only providing evidence to my opinion that you’re a militant egotist. Therefore proving one of my opinions right, therefore proving that I’m probably more credible than you are.
Also, I’d like for that verse to come from Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John. That’s the only time where Jesus walked the earth in a physical body. So if they come from there, it’s more powerful. The other books are just people talking about what they think their god would say.
When did I say jesus gets upset with a person that claims no religion? Again, you are making up something to try to prove you are right. I said that everything attributed to jesus was not peace and light.
I don’t have to prove anything. I am not the one making absurd claims. If what I am saying is opinion, you should have no problem proving it is wrong. If it is fact, keep avoiding as you have been is evidence that I am right.
Jesus never walked the earth. As I have said before in here and elsewhere. There is not one contemporary account of any jesus. The first mention is in Mark, written from 40 to 100 years after the alleged facts, depending upon which biblical scholar you believe.
The Romans, who otherwise kept excellent records make no mention of someone who was supposed to have such great social, political, and religious influence. No mention of feeding multitudes, walking on water, raising the dead, nor of any trial and execution.
You still avoid every point. That proves my point. Case closed. I won’t waste my time with such a simple-minded intellectual coward again.
I keep fucking telling you that I can’t prove you wrong or right because they’re OPINIONS. It’s so sad that such an old man doesn’t even understand the difference between that and a fact.
You said “Come n in in peace but with a sword” when I mentioned living like Jesus. So yes, you suggested that he is a violent person. He gets upset with those who claim his own religion.
And I’m sorry for my misspeak, he probably didn’t walk the earth. But theoretically, lets say the character did. Jesus the character was still a good guy.
And by the way, if you’re going to insult me, do it properly. I can’t be simple-minded and intellectual at the same time.
And for Christ’s sake, shrink that head of yours, we don’t need a second Jupiter sized object floating around in our solar system. Then again, it may be nice to have the sun suck you in.
holy shit this james smith tool is a RIOT! I scrolled all the way down to the bottom to see how long he’s been at this.
we get it. you’re right and everyone else is a big dumb theist or something.
what’s funny to me is that someone who knows there is no afterlife would spend so much of their precious time on earth arguing with teenagers on the internet. im pretty sure even richard dawkins would find that, after some extensive emperical scientific research, you are a HUGE DOUCHE BAG.
Lol, small world James. I seem to be running into you everywhere, though it’s usually after the fact. You may remember me as that fellow debater on GodlessBlogger.com.
Anyway, my comment for these pictures is that the funny thing is that those are essentially the same prayers that many adult Americans give. While most Americans are Christian, only a very small few actually know anything about their religion.
IMHO James problem is not that he’s for or against religion. It’s cultural. He is a typical Brazilian. I have experienced many like him. They are pushy, self centered egotistical boors. I have my own opinion on these things and will now take them in my own direction. Bye.
First, you are a liar. You have never met a Brazilian in your life.
Second, I have lived here for over eight years and can safely say that Brazilians and generally more relaxed. polite people than for example, you.
Finally, I am an American who has lived many places including seven US states, Quebec, and Holland before Brazil. So I suspect I know a bit more about cultural differences than you will.
Speaking of egotistical bores (not boors) You seem to fit that very well. Perhaps you are projecting your own faults on others? That seems to be a common failing of the mentally deficient.
You’re a liar, you’ve never lived in America, you were born on mars, and you’ve only been in Brazil for two months, duh. This statement is obviously true because I said it.
Also, I know more about cultural differences than you because I’ve been to Haiti, Quebec, Ontario, Mexico, Illinois, Colorado, New Mexico, Pennsylvania, North Dakota, New York, Main, Virginia, Michigan, Ohio, Kansas, and Nebraska. I’ve also visited towns by the name of Panic, Desire, and Paradise. So I’m obviously smarter than you when it comes to shit like that.
And no, he meant boor, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/boor. Although you do seem to have a bore in you brain (–noun 9. a hole made or enlarged by boring.) And you are a bore (–noun 2. a dull, tiresome, or uncongenial person.) But who’s keeping score huh?
Also, I forgot to mention Minnesota. And I’m also friends with a Chinese foreign exchange student. And I have met many Japanese people through the internet.
James,
You really should check the dictionary before claiming that it’s bore instead of boor. A bore is a hole. Boor is correct for what I meant. I have met Brazilians, while working at DisneyWorld, boatloads of them would visit the park on tours. They would cut in line, verbally assault waitpeople, openly throw trash. Generally unpleasant people overall. I do suppose you would be right to say I shouldn’t generalize a whole culture so I will stand corrected. It is you who is a boor.
To bore someone is to be like you, a liar and an idiot.
YOu have never met the first Brazilian. You forget, in your eagerness it be an lying SoS, that I have lived here , know many Brazilians, and have even accompanied them on trips to Disney World. The do not behave as you claim.
I could say that Americans are arrogant, fat, and liars by what I know of you.
No, to bore someone is to be so dreadfully dull or annoying that no one wants to listen to you anymore, much like yourself James.
And an SoS is a type of steel wool with soap in it to clean dishes. Insult better you retarded sack of shit.
And you’re a liar, like I said before, you’ve only been in Brazil for two months, no way did you go to Disney with them. You don’t even know what Disney world is.
I can prove every word I said. Why don’t you accept my offer? I’ll prove some other things, too. But you are nothing more than a lying punk coward. You lack the intellectual. ethical, and physical courage of a tomato.
Join me in a more personal conversation if you dare. I will enjoy it so much, you stinking little worm.
Of all the people that have replied to me on here, you are the one I would most like to confront in person. So either put up or admit everything I have said about your character is true. You are a coward, a liar, and a disgusting example of a human being.
Come on and be amusing in person. No? Did you shit yourself just thinking about it? Well, more fecal matter around you won’t make much difference with what is already there.
Haha, dude, I’ve taken you up on that offer ages ago. I seriously want you to prove yourself right. I’ve been saying that over and over again. I just got tired of your endless loop of ignorance so I decided to play with you. So if I finally have your attention, yes please, I’d like to see the proof.
Kaemon: YOu are such a lousy liar. YOu have never taken me up on any offer.
If you were a something other than an intellectual, ethical, and physical coward, you would have either accepted my offer of a trip here or made me a similar offer to come to you. All you have done is spout lies, evade direct questions, and deny everything I have said without proof. YOu will not come directly on line with me at slrman420 on Yahoo Messenger, you have not called my phone but lied about trying it.
You have also brought my deceased mother into this. If anyone needed proof of what a miserable little snot rag you are, that should do it.
The only thing I don’t understand is why your own family has not made you vanish. They surely must be shamed and embarrassed to have you around.
Yes, I am from America. As always, you cannot understand the difference between a hypothetical statement and reality. What I said (and I’ll type slowly so maybe even you can understand) “I could claim that Americans are fat and arrogant but that would not make it true.” But to you, if you say something, no matter how blatantly false or ridiculous, it automatically becomes fact.
Come on with me on Yahoo Messenger as I have repeatedly asked. I’ll furnish you with my Brazilian ID that shows the date of entry. I’ll prove very word I have said. You won’t do it, of course, because you know it will prove you are a liar and a stinking little coward.
Picking and choosing your stuff. I do admit I concentrate on the most outrageous lies and the more obnoxious statements. But I have other things to do. I know this is hard for you to accept, but the world does not revolve around you and your ostentatious prevarications.
WARNING: It might cause the religiously inclined to doubt their concept of what is atheism. Your beliefs will be exposed to facts and rational discourse. That’s very hazardous to any religion.
“If you could reason with theists, there wouldn’t be any theists.” – Dr House
When did I do that? Again, you only understand what you want to. That’s evidence that you are a moronic asshole.
What I said, was that this person expressed it better than I do. But you are too stupid to comprehend that, aren’t you? That was a rhetorical question so don’t bother answering. All you’ll do is reveal yourself to be even worse than you have so far.
You’re the moronic asshole, moronic asshole. And of course he knows how to express it better than you, I could have someone explain it to me in Finnish better than you can explain it. Seriously, stop speaking in Martian. It’s really annoying that I have to keep going back and forth from Google Interstellar Translate all the time.
You really do only see things they way you want them to be. I was not having him speak in my place. I was giving that as an example of someone saying what I have been saying but doing it better than I do.
What you’re claiming is like saying a better singer recording a song you have recorded is having them “sing in your place.”
Why are you so determined to demonstrate increasing levels of ignorance?
I’m not the ignorant one here, James. I’m speaking the truth, and the babble that keeps coming out of your mouth is just so silly. And I never said someone had to speak in your place, I was only saying that he was saying the same thing as you, stop being so redundant, you mentally challenged boor.
You did say the reference I gave was speaking in my place.
“Kaemon Rose says:
July 6, 2011 at 9:23 pm
And the proof is because you have to have someone else speak in your place.”
You can’t even keep your own posts straight even when it is right there. You lie so much you even lie about what you said. It’s obvious that you would never tell the truth is you can think of a lie.
You are the mentally challenged asshole. I want to see you face-to-face so badly! It will be one of the happiest days of my life. You do like to make people happy don’t you?
Also, what the fuck sort of sentence is “It’s obvious that you would never tell the truth is you can think of a lie.”? At least I can form proper sentences, you bloated git.
Quit lying, you don’t have a phone. Everyone know’s that’s the Rick Roll hotline. Why are you being such an ignorant ass to everyone?
Also, quit saying you can talk. You’re mute. You lost your voice after drinking all that lye your mum gave you for your birthday. I called her and she told me, that’s how I know.
YOu ugly bastard. My mother has passed away and you are a total asshat for bringing her into a private fight. If you ever decide to be a man and face me personally, I’ll make you pay heavily for that, you shithead. I put my money and my skin where my mouth is, you only hide and shiver in fear.
You are walking a very thin line between obnoxious and being brain dead.
Wow, someone’s got a big mouth. All that workin out make you feel like a big kid now? And if I were brain dead and you beat the shit out of me, wouldn’t that be the same thing as beating the shit out of a mentally retarded person? Which you have already called me multiple times. So in all reality, you’re the asshole.
Also, I called your number. Rick Astley. Seriously dude, quit lying.
Also, we were never fighting. I’m just trying to tell the truth. So if you want to call this a fight, go ahead. I won’t stop you. I just want you to know that when you’re ready to grow up, I’ll be here to talk to you like a real person. But until your gray matter learns how to reproduce itself, I think it’s best you leave the thinking to the big boys. No run along and play with your toy weights.
If I beat the shit out of you, it would take a caravan of semi trucks to carry it all away.
You did not call my number My phone is right next to me. But perhaps you are far too stupid to know how to make an international call? That sounds likely. Almost as likely as you are lying about that the way you do about everything else.
Nor are you trying to tell the truth. I am the only one that has done that. I have challenged you many times to prove that anything I have said is not true. You have ignored that every time because you know you cannot.
Just as you lied about I have only been in Brazil two months. Show me some proof of that. I’ll show you that you are a liar. I have proof. You have bullshit.
Run and hide some more. I know you will never even try to prove anything you have said is not a lie. Your inability to do that is evidence that you are not truthful. If you had proof, you’d furnish it. I have posted where to fins my videos and evidence that I am who and what I say I am. What have you done? Lied some more is all. Put up or shut the fuck up, you little asshole.
You can’t prove that dude has never met a Brazilian.
And I keep fucking telling you, I CAN’T DISPROVE SHIT YOU SAY BECAUSE EVERY GOD DAMN THIS IS AN OPINION!
Seriously dude, try to read what I’m actually saying. If you want me to take it as fact, you have to prove it to me. I can’t be asked to disprove something. That’s silly.
Also, I find it hilarious that you keep saying how violent the religious are, yet you’re the only one here threatening to beat the shit out of anyone. Did you finally lose your temper, old man? It just goes to show that people are people. You can’t pin religion to a person, it’s all what they decide to do with how they were raised and who they decided to be.
Theists can suck. Adding “a” to the beginning to the word makes you just as much asshole potential.
You still have yet to prove that everything you have said is not a lie.
Danny boy: What would be fun for me will not be a bit of fun for a little shitfaced moron like you. Come on down and I’ll show you. You have no idea who you’re talking to. But you plan on hiding behind the internet forever so you aren’t worried. You are just another yellow-belly semi-literate jerk.
No idea who we’re talking to? On the internet? Dude, no one’s anyone on the internet. Get over yourself. You own a gym or two. You give advice on what the military should do. So what? Doesn’t that just make you a bigger hypocrite? You claim religious are violent, yet you advise violence. You say theists are bullies, yet you train people to be able to kill easier.
But at the same time, military and body building can be used for defense. It’s all who you are. Not what you do with what you were given. You can’t blame the religious for everything that goes wrong in the world. Because no matter what, they’re just people too. They have their own ideas and agendas.
The difference between us is that I am backing up what I say with my money and my skin. You only lie and hide.
When did I say I advised the military? That never happened. It’s either another lie from you (no surprise) or just the meanderings of your diseased mind.
I train people to kill more easily? Take a look at my video at http://www.vimeo.com/16815804 you’ll note that I also taught handicapped people to be less defenseless. But that is probably beyond your comprehension that anyone would go to any effort to help someone less fortunate.
I also never blamed the religious for everything that goes wrong in the world. I said that most of the problems in the world have always been caused by religion. They center around the intolerance, prejudice, and hate taught by many religions.
Evil people will do evil things (like you). Good people will do good things. For good people to do evil things requires religion.
Your agenda seems to be telling lies and hiding from responsibility for your actions. That’s another difference between us. I don’t hide and I take responsibility for what I do and say. When are you going to try that?
So what you’re saying is you’re right because you can beat me up and pay me off? Dude, I’m tired of this little kid’s game. I have yahoo now. Let’s talk. LIKE ADULTS. And if you can behave by the rules of society, I will too. No matter how much you hate me, let’s be civilized. Alright?
Also, you have yet to prove that anything /I/ have said is a lie. You have also yet to prove anything I have said is the truth. So, which is it then? Disprove me, or prove yourself. Either way, I’m calling you out.
If you were not such a coward, you’d come on with me on Yahoo Messenger. I have invited you many times and I can send you all the proof you want on there as you can send proof to me. But you are terrified of even getting that close to me. I can’t reach out through Yahoo and hurt you, other than mentally by demonstrating what a liar you are. So do it or just admit your an ignorant, cowardly, little boy.
I have called you out many times and you ignore that. Do it or shut the fuck up, asshole.
I did prove it only yesterday and with your own quote. You conveniently ignored that, too.
It must be very pleasant to live in a fantasy world where the truth is whatever you want it to be and you never take responsibility for any of your own lies or statements. It is so easy when you can delude yourself into thinking something was never asked, shown to you, or proven to be fact.
Far easier than honesty, thinking and personal responsibility, isn’t it?
hahahahahaha, very nice jimmy, “another yellow-belly semi-literate jerk”, is that all you got? come on buddy boy, looks like your getting soft. i think someone needs to get laid, you have too much anger boy. hey you can tell, i wont tell anyone, your a bottom right? judging by you dumb ass pic, you look like a bottom. oh and by the way, if you pay for my ticket, i will be there. And rose, i like you! your sound like your cool people. and jimbo, JESUS #1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAH AND HA. and your still a douche.
Danny: Your sexual-themed insults are exactly the kind of silly, sophomoric, unoriginal stupidities I expected from you. At least you didn’t disappoint me there.
Done deal I will pay for your ticket. I’ll need the following:
Your real name, address, and phone number.
Your passport number and Brazilian Visa number
Your city of departure
I’ll book an electronic ticket. It will not be refundable by you, but only by me when you don’t show up. You can forget cashing in the ticket and stealing the money. I’m not as stupid as you are.
You can contact me on Yahoo Messenger at slrman420 to provide the information. So what’s your excuse now, you little squirmy worm?
hahahahahaha, Ohhh looks like jimmy is mad, hahhaha,you wanna know what i like about you? you read one or two paragraphs (about anyone who wrote here) and you assume you know everything about us. that takes a special person my man, guess they got the right person for the job… come on man, we both know that your “offer” is only because i have no intentions of going there. but hey, you claim to be a traveler, if your ever in Chicago, look me up; i have a weird address but im in the corner of go and fuck-your-self, since you “travel” so much, im sure you’ve heard of it plenty. quite frankly i wouldn’t be surprised if you’ve “been there, done that”. as far as the “sexual themed insults”, well you have your angles and believes and i have mine; i really believe you need to get laid, it does a body good, really good! doesn’t look like you get out much so my advice to you is to go out, get yourself a girl (or guy, or goat, or chicken, or even a melon) and just go to town on that poor (souless[hahaha])sucker. then let us know how that turns out…on second thought, maybe just keep it to your self. hahahahaha. hey by the way, i did a bit of research (yes, i know, it turns out this “unoriginal stupid sophomore” can do research) and as an act of irony, it turns out that the name ‘james” is in fact a biblical name. go figure. after finding that, i looked up the history for “james” and it turns out that it comes from some Greek word that means douche bag. wow jimbo, maybe its time for a name change. by the way, for future references, where the hell(wait, theres no hell right?[hahahaha]) do i get and Brazilian visa? well my biblical friend, i gotz to be goin now, i have things to do, people to see, and places to be. don’t think ill be coming back here so good luck in your quest to being the worlds biggest douche (you have my vote) and remember that laughter is for the soul…wait, souls aren’t real either right? what about angels? cuz man, are they hot!!! imagine a girl with wings!!! oh my god!!! oh crap, there’s no god either right? damn i keep doing it!!! Jesus Christ! (hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha) later days, asshole!!
JESUS #1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHAHAHA
@Danny Wow, you are not only delusional, you are totally insane. Are you an escapee from a mental asylum?
I can understand cowards and liars, the world abounds with them. You are completely on a different planet.
You make up the most outrageous things, then believe them yourself. You make Nick look like a rational, reasonable person conducting a sober intellectual discourse.
Does your family know that you’ve escaped from the “home” and are running loose making wild comments then fleeing like a skunk in the night?
You seem to be seriously disturbed. I a compassionate human being, I urge you to turn yourself in and get back on your medications. Thorazine is your friend.
Look, James. If you really want to talk, then let’s talk. One on one, you and me. No insults, no logic loops. If you want to prove your point, lets prove it. Give me a nice way that we can get in contact with each other in private and we’ll have a nice conversation. I’m getting tired of this back and forth and I feel like it’s time to end this. So we’ll talk and see what each other has to say and settle this in an adult fashion. Sound good?
Well, Anonymouth. I stand behind everything I said about religion. To anyone else, it would be significant that no one has tried to prove it isn’t true.
Or perhaps you are saying the Crusades, the Inquisition, Religious wars, Dark Ages, Witch trials, 9/11, family planning clinic bombings, and all those other atrocities didn’t happen?
You can believe whatever you want. It will not change the facts one bit. Damn pesky facts! They just won’t go away. But I am. I’m tired of dealing with those in “on the river” (De Nial) about so much.
first though, I legitimately enjoyed your “anonymouth” thing… I found that very amusing, and if you don’t mind, I may use that in the future. Because it was hilarious.
But secondly, the thing that’s going on here is that you’re so dead set on your… facts… that you can’t acknowledge what anyone else says to you. I know that you “know” that your facts are right, but the people you’re arguing with “know” that THEIR facts are right too. Except they’re able to acknowledge that your intentions behind the things that you say is to disprove what they are saying. You keep saying that no one has even tried to disprove you, yet people have. over and over and over. You just refuse to see that that’s what’s going on. I’m not saying that you have to say that people HAVE disproven you, but people have tried to speak reasonably with you. but you think that it’s just evasions. which honestly, is very silly and ridiculous. At least acknowledge that people have tried to have a conversation with you.
And a while ago, I spoke to you about the crusades, the inquisition and such… I also brought up many things that were brought on by other ideologies that are significantly more awful in number of deaths. I’m not justifying the things done by religion, but I’m saying that you have to admit that other ideologies can be just as bad if not worse.
This is just my question. How did you raise your children? I’m not trying to pick a fight here, I’m just trying to understand. Because theists believe that what they “know” is fact. So when they have kids, they teach them their facts. You did the same thing with your facts. How is what you did any different than what theists do? I know you’re going to say because theists are wrong and you are right, but to theists, YOU’RE wrong and THEY’RE right. So explain that. How did you raise your children without indoctrinating them?
First, thanks for the “anonymouth” comment. Being humorous in writing is very difficult. I have been on a site with writing advice where several of us bemoaned that it was. So when even a little thing succeeds, it is nice feeling.
I stand behind what I said about no one has proven anything I has posted is wrong. Yes, many have disagreed. Some, like you, have spoken reasonably. But disagreeing and doing so reasonably is not proof. Yes, people have had conversations with me. You and Kaemon, for example. Having a reasonable conversation is not proof that anything either person has said was correct or incorrect. One of the things I find most disturbing about theists is that very oven, saying something or hearing something that they like, makes it true.
BTW, when I use the term “theist”, I am referring to anyone with a belief in any god, not just christians. Christians, like many other theists, too often assume everything said that is negative to religion is directed at them personally. To have a rational dialog, that assumption must be discarded.
You are correct about other ideologies, including other religions. I have never said otherwise. Certainly the National Socialists (Nazis) did terrible things in the name of their ideology. That Hitler used parts of his religion to justify it does not automatically condemn all Catholics even though the RCC has much to answer for itself. That does include their support of Hitler and Fascism. I also have photographic and historical proof of that.
How did I raise my children? In two words, “mistrust authority”. That included myself. I played enough deliberate tricks on them that they learned that everything I said was not necessarily true. For example, I taught them to sing “Samuel the red-nosed reindeer”. They did this until the entered kindergarten and learned that Dad was wrong about that. When they confronted me with it, I admitted that “Maybe Dad was wrong. Good thing you checked that out for yourself.” As they grew up I injected more sophisticated lessons in that same fashion. When they wanted a pony, I said, “Sure”. But when they asked “When?” I told them whenever they liked. Just as soon as they could pay for it, had a place to keep it, could feed it, and take care of it. They learned that when someone was agreeable, it didn’t mean they would get what they wanted.
So they grew up knowing that while someone may not deliberately lie to them, that didn’t mean that person was right. “Sincerity does not equal truth.”
I do not recall ever mentioning my atheism to them as such. They were exposed to my own parents Presbyterian church, their mother’s parent’s Catholicism, and the various faiths of different friends. Both are now in their 40s with children of their own and are at least very agnostic. What I indoctrinated my children with was a healthy suspicion of authority. I know that for most theists, everything must be indoctrination unless it is their own brand of brainwashing. That is not the reality. To be a theist. one must accept the impossible, reject facts, and submit without questioning. I am aware that you, nor any other theist will like that statement, but it is the facts. If you read my blog about Universal truths, you would have seen the one that says, “Beliefs no matter how sincerely held, do not alter facts.”
Yes, you can raise children without “indoctrinating them”, unless you call encouraging them to think for themselves and to search for provable evidence “indoctrinating them.” Come to think of it, most theists might think that.
After talking privatley, James and I have found eachother to be rather agreeable people. We have decided to agree to disagree on the issue at hand and will be leaving this board.
A message from Nick. This person has tried to post a couple of messages on my blog. I have declined them as a favor to him because I doubted if he really wants the world at large to see what kind of person he is. But, he does keep trying to do it, so maybe he doesn’t mind. Here is his latest, unedited and without comment. His words tell us what kind of person he is better than I can.
“oh, me, oh my….I’m a total jerk? My feelings are so fucking hurt. And I can see you’re trying to do the calm, collected, no-swear-worded reply and making yourself feel good and better than me. Maybe you can put 2 and 2 together and see that I am the same person that also commented on that post and said the same thing to you–that you hide behind your little keyboard and just type things into the comments on some bullshit post which I think is actually pretty cute. Yes, I’m a dude, and yes, I can say cute.
And in my comment on there, did I say anything about your worthlessness to humanity? Ex-FUCKING-‘scuse me, YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE. If you can’t see that your statement is more nazi than mine, then you are TOTALLY FUCKING INSANE….AND BY THE FUCKING WAY, you and your little war against religion, YOU MOTHERFUKER, YOU TELL ME WHO’S THE NAZI IN THIS SITUATION. I’m not. It’s you.
And I would say this to your face and beat your ass while I’m at it. Just come up from Brazil, you shit.
Still reading? Or have you just deleted it already? I don’t even care.”
As I noted to him in a email reply, excessive use of cursing is a sign of a weak mind attempting to express itself forcefully. For that matter so is using all caps for emphasis. What is amusing to me is how he even misspells his cursing. LOL
Yes, you are far more articulate than this Nick character. I am sure he is much older than you but clearly not as intelligent or as well educated. Why do I suspect that, when he talks to people, he spits on them a lot. His outrage must cause a lot of sputtering and splattering. ROFLMAO!
BTW< have you looked at any of the books I sent yet? I think you'll enjoy the Jonathan Kellerman ones. I'm reading other now. If you like them, I'll send some more.
Alright, I’ll check them out. My girlfriend and I went to read in the park yesterday and we found a yardsale. $.25 a book haha. I bought 4 new ones. So I’ll have plenty of reading material xD.
More trash from Nick. This time, I’m including my email reply. I am indenting my reply and enclosing them in [ ] because there’s not much formatting available here. Although I doubt many would have a problem identifying Nick’s ranting.
I am not including his email address. Even though he deserves to be totally outed I will give him that much of a break – so far, anyway.
Nick said:
Okay, dude, I’m so done with this. You are not worth this time. And no, this is not a concession; I am literally done trying to reason with you. So don’t go skipping off to your little friends and start with that “oh, yeah I told him, he’s a pussy” bullshit. I’d love a Brazilian vacation on someone else’s dime, but unfortunately, I’m done with you and your faggot blog comment war (that you started). Yes you did. You did.
[I also knew you would continue with your juvenile insults. “Faggot” is the worst thing you can think of. When did you ever try to reason with anyone. You start off being nasty and have never written one word of truth. I say you are a coward and a liar. Your own words show that you are. You can deny it, but facts are hard to kill.
You’d love a Brazilian vacation, but not if it cost you getting your illusions about being a tough guy broken into bloody rags.
I never denied I started the comment war. Where did you think I said I did not? Unlike you, I take responsibility for my actions and do not run and hide from them.]
I’m never coming back here, so say whatever your heart desires. You will be the only one that will know, and the only one that will care. I am DONE with this and with you. Have a nice life, dick.
A lot of people will know how you are. I’m posting your nasty, comments to the same site. I am sure everyone will enjoy reading your comments. This time, I’m including my reply. Kaemon, not yet even 20, has more integrity and courage than you will ever have. He had the moral courage to contact me directly and we found much mutual ground. You continue to run and hide. Are you ashamed of your conduct? You must be, you are scurrying away like a rat in a sewer.
Go fuck yourself you arrogant chimp-fucking little bastard.
[Ohhh, more original, sophomoric insults. Again, ones you are terrified to make to my face. No one will be surprised at that. Your character, or lack of it is obvious.]
James, I really dont even understand how you can stereotype theists like you do. You say some very stupid comments and say that we are just trying to avoid questions but you are just saying the same things over and over and over and over so I think, THINK, that I speak for the majority of people here and say please, just stop. I am NOT trying to order you around but I just am asking. You most likely wont agree with anything I say but remember that even 15 year olds think you are an asshole (yes that one was meant to be offensive).
Exactly what comments were “stupid”? Just because you didn’t like them, doesn’t make them any less true.
Yes, even 15 year olds can be assholes. Especially when they think they speak for the majority. That’s nothing more than arrogant wishful thinking unless you have proof. I don’t see any proof.
YOu claim I stereotype theists. Then tell me what I have said about them that is not true.
BTW, it’s won’t. Devote more time to school and less to making uninformed comments on the internet. That’s not an order, it’s advice to improve your credibility.
Jesus Christ (yes, I used that intentionally just to make people upset) all this over some silly notes from little kids? Some of these kids will grow up to be theists, some will grow up to be atheists. But as of now, the’re just kids being goofy. No need to read further into this than was intended. Just laugh and move on. No need for an existential crisis. It’s the internet.
I hope i didnt miss james! I’d like to see his take…
Christianity teaches to love each other and the world around us and god above us. Sure each denom. has its own specifics, but the basic teachings of Christianity are to go about life filled with love, and to give love to others. If I don’t do those things, it doesn’t matter how loudly I yell that I am a Christian; If I do not act like a christian, i am not a christian. Its called hypocracy. The worst part is that many atheists and other no-nchristians like you seem to think that these hypocrites are actually reflective of the religion.
just cuz a bird flies around saying its a dog doesnt mean it is a dog, and doesnt give anyone the right to go yell at dogs for having wings [not a great metaphor i know]
ACTUAL DOGS [not just ones who say they are] DONT HAVE WINGS. ACTUAL CHRISTIANS ARE GOOD PEOPLE< AN ACTUAL CHRISTIAN WOULD NEVER TELL ANYONE TO GO TO HELL, OR THAT GOD HATES THEM.
It is so not fair to me to have to be called sick and twisted because i love everyone and everything and i think that there is something more to existence than just what meets the eye [even more than just molecules and atoms and energy] ALL because some assholes are walking around with my name on them. DONT blame religion because people are jerks, people are always jerks, and that has nothing to do with their faith or lack there of.
lastly jimmy boy, what is so wrong with you that you reject good will in any form? youre offended by someone saying bless you? as a christian, i would be happy to attend a service in a mosque or synagog, i would be thankful to anyone who asks whatever god or tree or star or element or ANYTHING anyone believes, to help me. Maybe people are confused about the universe when it comes to religion, but when someone is wishing you well in their own form, it is very arrogant and really just mean to refuse that, to take offense to it. With that mentality, you seem to be the kind of person who would go to thailand and call them disgusting for eating insects, or say that parents who take baths with their kids in 3rd world countries are perverts. Just because it isnt your way means its sick? It's not ok in international travel to behave that way, why would you think its ok to do that in a religious environment? people wish you good will, maybe the delivery method isnt to your liking, but the intention is still the same
You have such anger towards christianity, let me clear something up for you. Any christian you ever knew who was mean or hurtful, offensive, oppressive, obnoxious, arrogant, or shoved it down your throat, wasnt actually a christian. They just called themselves that, but they arent actually one. Just because people say they do things in the name of god, does not actually mean god endorses them. People say alot of shit, you shouldnt let them turn you away from harmless, even helpful ideas.
GOD IS LOVE and there isnt anything wrong with that. If its not love, its not god. so next time a 'christian' tells you youre going to hell, just remember, that isnt god or christianity talking, thats just some guy with identity issues.
rant back quick! ill go get some more popcorn this is getting good 😛
James and I both agreed to leave the forum. But the both of us don’t seem to be following the rules, haha.
I agree with you. You can’t stigmatize a religion because of the bad people involved in said religion.
However, myself being atheist, I view religion as a clever form of controlling a community. And the way you seem to do it is the right way to go about it.
However, religion has lost it’s magic to me. When I started viewing religion as “theology” instead of “religion”, everything became clear to me.
So I appreciate the thought. And I see your point. But the point of James and I have already been made. We have different views on the subject, but it’s time to stop roweling him up.
You claim to be a “real christian” but there are plenty of others that would say you, are not because you are not murdering homosexuals, ranting about “socialism” (Christ, if he existed, would have been a flaming socialist)
I never said that every christian I ever met was obnoxious or tried to force their beliefs on me. I have friends who are christians and we get along fine. They are very good people and do practice tolerance and care for others.
What I said was, “Every time I have been cheated, abused, misused, or taken advantage of, it was by a ‘good christian’. That would make anyone a bit wary of a particular group, even if you know they are not all like that. If I substituted “Redhead” for “good christian”, you would not be offended. One must go with the percentages. If you were always cheated by redheads, even though you knew there were honest one in the world, would you be reluctant to do business with redheads?
I suggest you read my blog entry “Does It Matter If Jesus Existed?” (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/10/17/does-it-matter-if-jesus-existed/) Reading that, you will see that we actually agree on some important points. Yes, you have to be a bit selective about the Jesus sayings and choose messages of tolerance “Let him who is without sin cast the first stone” and not “I come not in peace but with a sword” to extract the value from christianity. The actual existence of jesus or god, for that matter, isn’t important. It’s the message that is.
No, I don’t hate god, how can you hate that which has never existed? I do become angry when I see children allowed to die without medical care because the parents are “going to pray for them.”
I become angry when I see family planning clinics bombed and the employees murdered. I don’t like having to pay more taxes because religions do not and their supporters get tax deductions for the donations to them.
I do not like seeing more tax money being spent in promotion of religions under the guise of “faith-based initiatives.”
What people believe is of no importance to me. What people do with those beliefs is important to us all. How would you feel if the Islamic radicals succeed in their plan to take over the world and force their sharia law on everyone? As a woman, you would be the most affected. Forget driving, education, choosing your husband, wearing what you choose, being able to go where you want and always living with the possibility of being stoned to death for any “impurity”.
That’s a result of untrammeled religion. The sad fact is, when christianity ruled most of the known world, it wasn’t much different. It was called “the Dark Ages”.
That’s why I am so adamant about holding religion to a personal level and no making it public policy. Are you aware that in seven US sates that atheists are legally barred from holding public office? Is that a good and fair thing? If the movement towards a theocracy in the USA continues, it will become national law.
You can deny any or all of this, but it doesn’t change the facts. That’s the bad thing about facts, no matter who does or does not believe them, they don’t go away. A very pesky thing those facts.
I just wonder, James, who is really shoving religion down your throat? Are people banging on your door every morning shoving bibles in your face and forcing their religious views upon you? Is your television nothing but an endless sea of bible thumpers telling you that you should believe or burn in a pit of fire? Is every book that you open devoted to making you believe in God? When you go to the grocery store, the gas station, the library are you accosted by those preaching the word of God? I hardly believe that this is such a huge issue in your life that you have to be such an incredible asshole about a few cute little messages on a humorous website. Shame on you for turning this into stump to spout your incredibly arrogant ramblings. I can go on for months and never have the subject of religion come up in my life, only what goes on within my own thoughts. You chose to begin this dialogue and then berate everyone that doesn’t agree with you. You, sir, are what is wrong with this world, not because of what you believe, but how you treat others. Most (not all), of the responses to you were from people who wanted to understand your beliefs and why you believe that. Kaitlyn, for instance, was intrigued by you and had some very good points for you to debate, and you totally turned tail and ran. You pick and chose your fights like a child, it is laughable. I would have respect for you if you had proven anything to me, but all you proved is what an incredible jerk you are. If you are an atheist, then religious “law” does not apply to you, so why is it an issue to you? You seem to be so concerned about the starving children of the world, then you should be concentrating your efforts on aide to them, as my church has done for many, many years. What have you done to help them? How much do you donate to assist them every year? Your bullshit does not fill their bellies, but the dollars my church sends does. I would guess that you are so self-absorbed that you haven’t done a damn thing but run your mouth….good for you, buddy.
First of all, learn what is a paragraph and when to use them. Then your post will not look like a rambling jumble of nonsensical words. Oh wait. it IS a rambling jumble of nonsensical words.
You clearly know nothing about the religious reich attempting to turn the USA into a totalitarian theocracy. But, from your post, you don’t seem to know much about anything.
I “turned tail and ran”? When? From what? Just because you say it, doesn’t make it true.
Again, you don’t understand the difference between beliefs and knowledge. Beliefs are unsupported by facts and often held in the face of contradictory evidence. Knowledge is supported by independently verifiable facts. Beliefs are simply another word for “faith”.
As far as supporting children, what do you know about that? FYI, I help support a creche here for poor children. I eschew christmas presents for my own family to donate the money to providing them with things like milk, clothes, toys, and food. My family understands this and also send me money to contribute. That’s from a bunch of godless, evil atheists. But you are so prejudiced that you form your opinions without knowing anything.
You are a disgusting example of a human being. I will pick a fight with you because I will enjoy breaking you intellectually and ethically.
You are a liar, a fool, and a hypocrite.
I have no respect for you and never will. What a jerk you are and you wallow in it like the sick little idiot you are.
Prove that one word you have said is true or prove that anything I have said is not.
aw i must say im a bit disappointed :[ darn you copy and paste!
but furthermore, i would be just as offended if u said redheads, or jews, or anything i’m not. even more so because im used to uninformed people bashing my religion. its not right in any circumstance to judge a group or religion or tribe or anything based on the circumstances of the people in such a group that i met. if u had met a bunch of stupid blacks, wouldn’t it be wrong for you to feel that the majority of blacks are stupid? we have to overcome our instincts to judge others. its true anyone can claim to be a good christian and then go around killing others, but aren’t you stupid for believing that they’re good Christians then? yeah there are alot of lines in the bible you can pull out that endorse bad things, i’m sure there’s a line about killing gays, but as anyone should objectively read a text, they should also take into account the time period. For example devout baptists never dance or touch a deck of cards. when the denomination was being formed in america, the only cards you played were to gamble, and you only danced in saloons. do you honestly think a god who’s texts [read the lines in red basically] would iono damn a child for playing go fish? of course not! true, religion has been a way to control the masses, not always for the worse. but you know what? doesn’t government do the same thing? i don’t see you bitching about that and that is WAY worse. it was just the smarter person to use an all-powerful being to control people. I consider myself a good christian because i open my heart to god and to others, and i put love for ALL kinds of people first. I don’t go to church, i took a class on the bible [literature class not religion] but really didn’t read the whole thing. there is no way that the social institution of religion is controlling me. my parents are very different kinds of christian, we tried going to church but found alot of the people at the specific churches around us to be bigots and hypocrites, so we don’t go, but it didn’t stop me from being christian, blaming the entire institution of the religion just because 4 churches i’ve spent a year each at were filled with jerks. you seem to assume that every [or many if this will be your hangup] christian supports the things being done in the name of Christianity. no i don’t think its right that atheists should be banned from public office, tho any of them like you should be, but any religious zealot [of any religion mine included] should be kept from it too. and i know that’s not the way things are but yes politics should be separate from religion in a country that spouts its freedoms. but just as an american i don’t support a TON of things this country does in the name of freedom, i know its not actually for freedom… think iraq
you’re a good target to talk to, because you are inappropriate and overly angry. you’re tired of people shoving their religion down your throat but you came here and commented just to receive that. the psychologist in me thinks your so angry because you’re denying what you feel to be true on some level but you’re rejecting it so hard! moot point because you might be incapable of change, but you know what you were getting yourself into when you wrote your first comment. its a fool who throws himself into a pit of hungry lions and is angered when they eat him. you make the comments you make when they are not called for, to incite a reaction of people, piss some of them off, and then use their heated arguments as ammunition and support for you ideas. ahh.. the internet. that being said, i don’t care what happens with your religious views, but as a person maybe you need to do some internal reflecting. as it stands, im tired of people shoving their ideas [even atheism] down my throat as well. im tired of people leaving me pamphlets on how im going to hell in a tip jar at work. im tired of going to comic conventions and having people at the christian convention next door trying to save me. but im smart enough to know that that is that individual, and yes maybe that individual may be leading a church, but he or she is NOT leading the religion. i only ask that you be strong enough in your nonfaith to look at the amazing world around you, from the tiny and complex blade of grass to the function of ecosystems, and think that maybe, just maybe, something could have started this. do you ever think about what came before the big bang? or why it would have banged in the first place? because i spent alot of time thinking that what we see is all there is. i am happy to come to the realization that there is more, because honestly? this world sucks and if this is all there is ill just kill myself now and save the trouble. im sure you’d like to help :]
also i didnt say you said every christian, i said ANY christian you met who did do those things.
lastly… yes u can use history to point out a lot of bad things done when Christians ruled the world. don’t assume Christianity the faith has that goal, just because some churches and individuals do. you keep finding examples of people being stupid and then saying the religion wants people to be stupid. and you aren’t being a bit wary, you’re being a full on bigot. you also seem to be basing alot of your arguments on american christianity.
anyways… i gota go eat breakfast. haters gona hate. i hope you stop trolling websites, but hey you got to feel important for a few weeks. look at how many people talked to you! i mean wow! its almost like people cared enough about you to hate you :] good for you man! keep on keepin on <3
You read things, but only see what you want to believe. That’s so sad, but so common. I give you the same challenge everyone else had avoided. Prove one word I have written is not true.
Also, I am far from uniformed about christianity, but it makes you feel justified in your opinion to say I am not.
All you have done is to demonstrate that you are as intolerant, prejudiced, and ignorant and so many others on here. How do you expect me to treat you respectfully when all you do is bash me, my statements, and everything I stand for without one shred of roof? What you are doing is nothing more than earning yourself contempt and derision. Enjoy it, that’s all you’re going to get until you do something intelligent.
What makes me feel important is not trashing morons like you, but helping others like the creche for disadvantage infants I mentioned elsewhere. I always feel at my best when I am doing something for others. Dialog with people like you makes me feel sick that there are so many ignorant assholes in the world.
I’ll be one of the few ones to actually comment on the letters to god from these adorable children. ADORABLE. Ya morons should really take your theological and philosophical discussions to the appropriate place, and this is NOT it.
What is this? Another insightful, intelligent, well-substantiated comment? Al that is missing is the usual, “fuck you” I get from the typical mentally disturbed individual like you.
Everything I said is true. Everything you said is incredibly stupid.
Ha ha, this has made me laught a lot!
Five bucks says that James is just a borde person with nothing to occupy his time so he pulls up a slightly religious artical and starts insulting people for kicks.
Sad way to spend your time…but hey, each to his own!
Have fun with your life!
*Clicks the Stumble button*
Next, I stated nothing but the truth and not one person has ever been able to demonstrate otherwise.
No, I am not “borde”. If you bothered to learn anything about me, you would know better. But, like so many here, you like to have an opinion even when you know nothing about the subject.
Perhaps before you spout of again and make yourself appear even more ignorant, you learn a little first. I’ve posted on here different places where you can learn more about me and even contact me directly.
Only one person here has had the ethical stones to do so. Sadly, he is one of the youngest on here and has made the rest of you look like very sad excuses for intelligent people.
Speaking of a sad way to use your time, making yourself look like an uneducated. semi-literate person that can’t even use a spell checker is pretty depressing.
I just love when people get in giant online fights about absolute bullshit. Especially when it’s right beneath a bunch of pics of kids being cute. Keep it up guys.
Honestly, this debate has become even more amusing than the actual letters.
I just, really, really, have to say:
LOL @ this guy James for being a big enough douche and single handedly keeping this thread going for so long.
and also
LOL @ the people that actually replied, trying to shove their views down his throat and using so many unnecessary methapors my old lit. text might just throw up and
LOL @ people that replied in pretty much, essays, trying to prove their intellectual superiority? less is more, your 10 page papers don’t make you any better than him. and he only needed a few sentences to trigger this.
and also LOL @ the opposite side, that sicced a “psychiatrist” on him. he may or may not be an actual psych, and if so props cus its hard to major in that, but if not, then LMAO, you think watching a few episodes of Dr. Phil entitles you to post ridiculous psychobabble like that?
This is a fun conversation, and as i am filled to the brim with ignorance and bigoted ideas, I want in too.
on a side note : These letters are adorable!!!! kids can be so unpredictably cute sometimes.
Yal’ll…. cant we all just stop arguing on religion and disrespect other people’s beliefs. they can believe in whatever the heck they want to.I bet James is some lonely jerk who has nothing better to argue about the stupidest things.This is just an abdorable little collection of kids letters to god. No one cares if youre reading it and thinks its stupid. It was written by kids!! who the heck cares if they wanted a puppy over a brother! Its just shown to make you smile about little cute kids.No one has to make a big deal about this.
YOu want me to respect something that has not earned any respect? When respect is demanded instead of earned, it’s an admission that while, desired, nothing has been done to earn respect.
You know nothing about me but that doesn’t keep you from spouting an uniformed, totally ignorant opinion, does it? But ignorant and uninformed is what you have repeatedly demonstrated yourself to be. No, I have no respect for you, either.
James I’m wondering how anyone actually captured you smiling for your lovelllly picture.
I’m going to offer you some free advice here. I think you’re at the age where life has got you down. Go buy a boat. Get yourself a fishing rod. Venture out to sea and sort out all your little problems inside.
You never know, you may see some of the many wonders of God’s Earth… Like sunshine, it can really light up your life.
As for the main purpose of this stumble, those stories did make me chuckle. Nearly as much as James did.
First, your assumptions are as wrong as your religion.
Life has not “got me down”. I am in terrific health thanks to a reasonable exercise program and rational eating habits. I live in the best climate in the world. I feel this way because I have lived in eight states in the USA, some of them more than once, Quebec, Holland, and now Brazil. It also helps that I do not have the stress of any fake religion in my life and have not since I was 13.
There’s something truly liberating about thinking for yourself and not accepting fairy tales and outright lies foisted upon you by those with no interest other than controlling what you think, do, and say while relieving you of cash and resources of time and energy.
FYI, my handle and email address is Slrman as in “Sailorman”. I have owned many boats and lived on them. In addition, I have sailed all over the world for pleasure and doing deliveries of sailboats.
There is no god and you bible-thumpers delight in offending those of us who are rational enough to recognize this.
I have seen many wonders of nature but not one bit of evidence there is any god of any kind. It requires a special type of obstinate ignorance to accept that belief.
I have lots of pictures of me smiling and, unlike you, I have a real life that is very pleasant and give me many reasons to smile.
For one thing, I do not live my life in fear of offending some imaginary deity and condemning myself to an eternity of torment.
Yes, you do live in fear. One of the most common statements in Christendom is “Fear God”. Why do you have to fear a “loving god”?
Even better, I do not depend on a system of rewards and punishments to do the right thing. I do the right thing because it is the right thing to do and, in my experience, will benefit others as well as myself. I have written about this in my blog, (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/08/02/ethics/) which none of you theists like to read because it demonstrates that a person can be good without god and many are.
BTW, remember the old saying about “Free advice is worth what you pay for it.” Thank you for demonstrating that it is true.
Is it really so bad to have hope for something other than just this life? That there is someone who is watching over us all? James, I don’t claim to stand for all of those with religion…and I certainly wont insult you for your beliefs…but I’d like to ask that you stop insulting others for theirs? Just…agreeing to disagree? Sound good?
Oh my. After reading maybe halfway through this comments section, then heading down to the bottom and seeing that James, you are still commenting, I can only admire your persistence.
Yet, you continuously bring up the ‘fact’ that nobody on this site has yet to prove you wrong.
I’m sorry to inform you, but they have. Actually you did. The minute you commented on the site itself proved yourself wrong.
I’m sure you’re dying to know why, and I wont keep you in suspense any longer. Earlier you said the following:
“I have said many times, what others believe is not important to me. It’s when they try to pass those belief into law and restrict my freedom of speech thought, and action that it matters. Unfortunately that’s exactly what religion, all religions do. It’s what I see here and everywhere.”
What you see EVERYWHERE? Are you claiming to be omnipotent? I can bet on my life that you have not seen every single religion in practice, in every single place in the world. So there’s an awfully exaggerated statement to match yours. That’s just a technicality though, the reason that that quoation is even up there is becuase you say that what others believe is not important to you, until they try and restrict your freedom. What about this website is trying to restrict YOUR freedom? Nothing. You are FREE to leave it whenever you choose. You are free to ignore it to your fullest. Yo are even FREE to come onto this site and post atrocious accusations against anyone that thinks differently from you in the comments section of a cute post. SO it is evident to me that your statement that “what others believe is not important to me” is so blatently false, that you have to come back on here to argue with others about what they BELIEVE.
Oh, and the person who imitated you and ‘apologized’ on your behalf was genius. Actually made my day.
Additionally, I know you will refute this. I’m sure in an impeccable manner, coming out on top again, maybe you’ll start citing some of those authors you mentioned earlier. Honestly, that doesn’t even matter to me, what does matter is how childishly you acted on this site. I hope you realized that you bickered with 14 YEAR OLD kids. They haven’t even had a chance to form their opionions fully yet-and you attacked them. It’s great that you try and help kids and donate and whatnot, but who you are on the internet is an important reflection of who you truly are. And I’d really like to think that a retired (presumably older) man could do better than to argue with children, seeing as you wouldn’t do that in real life. Or maybe you do. Who knows, you obviously seem to have too much time on your hands. That is apparent to anyone who bothers to glance at the comments here.
Anyways, I know you’re probably happy I rose to your bait, because straight and simple, you are a s**t disturber. You enjoy getting people riled up. In reality, writing this out for everyone to see has made me feel 1000 times better though, and unlike you, I will never return to this site, so your oh-so-clever retort will fall on deaf ears:)
After that, I’m sure someone else will prove you wrong too.
Enjoy, and have a great, wonderful, sunny day everyone!
I came across this on stumbleupon so there’s a good chance I won’t ever come back to this but I thought I’d leave a reply anyway.
I find it odd that for almost a month people have been arguing back and forth on here over a post that was meant to be cute by showing the way children think sometimes. What was supposed to be used for a good laugh has resulted in feelings of hatred towards others.
Now, I am a Christian but I never consider my faith a religion and I never will. As a matter of fact, I dislike the way religion is portrayed in today’s society. I consider myself a follower of Christ as any Christian should. I’ll agree with James on one point and that’s that religion does cause a lot of problems in the world today and there has been a lot of religious based fighting. But I think that it is important to realize that these issues aren’t caused by Christians or Muslims or any other faith as a whole. The problems caused by religious groups are many times caused by extremists or people who are just ignorant. As a Christian it’s sad to see groups such as the Wesboro Church picket funerals and bash homosexuals. Acts like this don’t represent other churches well and it gives a bad name to Christians, just like terrorists give a bad reputation to a lot of Muslims. I have quite a few Muslim friends I went to college with and if you take the time to really talk about what their beliefs are like it’s the polar opposite of how terrorists act.
I get that everyone has their own opinion and stance on different topics, but just arguing and bashing others doesn’t prove anybody’s point and when others start reading posts like all of these on here everything comes across as being ignorant. The problem with discussions like these is that no matter how intelligent or well-supported someone’s argument is it doesn’t come across that way, which is why this post is just a general statement instead of trying to point out someone else’s faults. To call someone an idiot for what they believe is just ignorant because all it’s based on is the fact that that person doesn’t agree with you. So what if people have opinions. Why waste time arguing about something that won’t change? Everyone’s thoughts deserve to be respected as long as it’s not aimed at another person in malice.
Well, that’s all. Hope anyone who reads this will enjoy.
I am replying to myself. Because I’m not done talking. This has legitimately made my day. I LOVE it when people on the internet argue. It’s so awesome. I mean, I was having a pretty good day already, but reading through a bunch of these comments and responding to a few has been great fun. Nothing can compare to; after a hard day of school or work; sitting in front of a computer and reading people get all worked up over everything in the world. Ok, a lot of other things are easily better than this, but you know what I mean, this is pretty damn hilarious.
I of course mean no offense to anyone, as clearly I am here commenting just like the rest of you.
James, you seem to be a bit misunderstood by a lot of people on here and I’m sorry for that. But I think that I understand what you’re saying.. You are an atheist-which is completely fine-who doesn’t care what peoples beliefs are just so long as they don’t force them unto you. And I agree with you completely on that. I happen to believe in God..but I understand where your coming from. So often I see people who just won’t stop trying to make people see and think what they see and think. I agree with you again on how laws souldn’t be based on religion..like the whole gay marriage thing. (I’m all for it in fact.)I too get angry that terrible things happen in this world. And I think that most people would have no problem with you being an atheist, it’s just that I think people just didn’t like how you phrased your views. But James I really love that you stuck to what you believe, what you think, despite not even your parents supporting you. I admire you in fact. Not so many people would be able to do that, and I hope you continue encouraging people who have just recently expressed themselves to be atheists like you mention before. Not letting people get to us in something we all have to learn but few of us have..including me. So have a great rest of the summer! Bye!
P.S- to everyone else out there..maybe just take a minute to understand his thinking before you shoot him down. And really no need for profanities. 🙂
I don’t think it’s that they enjoy shooting him down for his beliefs, I think it’s more that his first comment for such a cute website was something so violent and kind of unnecessary. These kids weren’t trying to shove christianity down his throat.
these are cute and funny. i think its really immature that adults who stumble onto this site are arguing about religion and their views. this is not the place for it
Christians, all,… please take a minute to question yourself when you say things like “Entitled to your own opinion/beliefs.” Why is this phrase even mentioned in debates? What does it even mean to you? It is a phrase that is in direct contradiction to Truth. Sure it seems to calm things down in a debate and makes it seem like you are on one another’s side, but it excuses the fact that absolute truth exists. I say enough with using subjective phrases to counter arguments. Instead, counter with truth, spoken in love and kindness. And if you don’t know the truth in order to counter arguments intelligently…..GO FIGURE IT OUT!!! Stop making a philosophical fool of Christianity (which is exactly what some are instigating here).
THIS FIGHT IS STUPID! for as long as religion has been, there have been stupid fights, where they yell at each other because “Atheists are arrogant and dismissive of others”, and then the Atheists reply back with the SAME EXACT THING, “Theists are arrogant and dismissive of others”.
Why does your religion have to say what your personality must be?
In what way is this site shoving ANYTHING down your throat?
I don’t believe in god, but these letters are still so cute!
Believe what you want, but being an Atheist is NOT the cause of arrogance.
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?”
James… at the beginning, people were being cordial to you and you responded with only hate and bigotry. In the middle, people were being cordial and reasonable to you about your beliefs, and advised you to calm down a little in order to avoid much more hate. You responded with prejudice, assumptions, and trying to shove your believes down their throats. In the end, people were getting tired of your blatant hypocrisy as you accused theists of doing precisely the things you were doing: Forcing other people to accept your beliefs, not listening to other people, correcting typos instead of responding, being offensive and arrogant, and most of all hating. You are a hate-filled individual and you express that hate by accusing others of hate.
For all our sakes, think about life a bit. Try to be more accepting. Stumble on ‘quotes’ a bit.
And most of all, don’t accuse me of being a hater and a theist and telling you what to do. It’s perfectly acceptable to be an atheist and to hate on people: I’m just trying to be helpful. I know how it feels to have hate and only hate inside of myself. I know how much it brings down your mood, and I’m trying to help you by giving you tips, cordially, so as to help you become a happy person again. I’m being polite and cordial, merely stating the facts, as you say that you yourself do, and expect a polite and cordial response in return. Can you please just think back on your hypocrisy? You don’t have to rethink your beliefs or renounce atheism or anything stupid like that. Just pause for a moment, read your responses over, and realize how angry and hate-filled and prejudiced you sounded while you were accusing christians of being angry and hate-filled and prejudiced.
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More examples of children being brainwashed into a religion built on lies. Is it any surprise that so many of them learn to lie so well. Never mind the ones that are delusional for the rest of their lives. Those are just more crimes against humanity committed by religion.
*facepalm* I’m an atheist, too, but I don’t despise religion; I only despise those occurrences in which it is used for selfish purposes, or when someone tries to shove it down my throat. You are being extremely arrogant, and you are acting like the kind of atheist that religious people try to paint us all like. It’s really annoying, having to prove that I am considerate of benevolent faith…unlike you, evidently.
Anyone who’s reading this and who thinks he represents all atheists’ views…please don’t. There are tolerant people of all religions (or non-religions), if you look hard enough. 🙂
Double-up on that facepalm, Julia. I’m with you on this one.
You, Julia, are the kind of accommodationist person that allows religion the freedom from questioning and criticism that permits it to perform it’s evils.
Tell me one thing I said that is not true. Provide independently verifiable evidence.
You’re not an atheists, you’re just too lazy intellectually to take sides and are choosing the path of least resistance.
If you think I do not represent the majority of atheist views, read some Richard Dawkins, Hitchins, or anyone else with the intellectual honesty to speak the truth. Try going to some atheist web sites. A quick search will give you more than you can have time to read.
I think I do not represent your views and I am proud of that. But you are arrogant to say you represent most atheists. Please don’t project your own failings on others.
Ok, so i’m going to preface this with the fact that I am most likely never going to come back to this site (found it on stumble) so i won’t be able to respond to all of your wonderful replies.
-However-
Who cares what others think? Who cares what others choose to believe? Mr. James, does it truly matter to you what others believe? You say that religion has committed evils, however, millions of crimes are committed each year, for reasons besides religion, by religious folk, and atheists alike.
Yes, religion should be questioned and scrutinized. that is the only way we can learn for ourselves, and the basis of science IS questioning everything.
You also state that Bill and Julia are intellectually lazy atheists, implying that you believe yourself to be an intellectual. As such, i am going to go ahead and assume that you are a bit of a scientist yourself. If so, then you know that along with questioning everything, you must also enter each test and scrutiny with an open mind. Aristotle once said that it is the mark of a great mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. Without an open mind and a quizzical brain, how can we learn anything else? Instead of looking at this with hate, look at it as a possibility.
No matter who you are, you must admit that religion, whilst it brings great evil, also provides a model for humans to follow in bettering ourselves and our species. Besides, others views are not failings, they are simply what they are called, their views.
Let others think what they will, and you think what you will.
And Julia,
Instead of saying that he does not represent your views specifically, let him have his views. He believes what he wishes, and that’s that. Instead of saying how your view’s differ, show. Don’t say that he is arrogant or selfish, but write what you believe or the qualities you wish to embody.
To both of you,
Now, chances are, both of you will disagree with what i said, and that is perfectly okay. I prefer that you do, if you read it enough to disagree with it then that means that you are thinking about what i typed. Entertain the things i typed, however scrutinize them before you choose to accept them or to dismiss them.
Differing views are the basis of mankind and of all intelligence.
As I see so often, you only read what you want to think, not what is there. I never said I care what others think or believe. I only care when they try to force their beliefs upon me. Theists always do that by trying to pass their delusions into laws for everyone.
Anyone can have any view they want. I could not care less. But when they insist I share those beliefs and demand they be the law of the l;and and taught in the schools, then they affect me. If someone wants to rub blue mud in their navel while chanting nonsense syllables, it doesn’t matter to me until the insist I do the same.
If they do not believe in gay marriage, divorce, contraception, consuming alcohol, or anything else, What does that matter to me? Nothing until they demand I “respect” their religion and practice the same things and refrain from pointing out they are silly, delusional, and counter-productive.
Religion provides a model for humans to better themselves? How? By genocide, murder, rape, and destroying entire civilizations including plants and animals?
I never said I represented the views of anyone else. I did say the writings of Dawkins, Hitchins, and others indicate that a lot of people do think as I do.
I do a lot of reading and visiting sites on the internet. I see that many, if not most, atheists think more like I do than those who do not.
I personally do not care what anyone thinks or says. All I care is that they do not inflict those views arbitrarily. If someone can produce independently verifiable evidence and through facts and logic sway others to their position, more power to them. But if they demand compliance without proof, then they are dictatorial and should be resisted.
I am sure many will disagree with the following. To date no one has been able to dispute that even one word is not true. I wonder why that is? If someone offered me positive proof of something I would have to change my thinking, no matter how much I disagreed with it originally. That’s called science. When new facts are discovered, science happily adjusts its thinking and knowledge is advance. For example, it was once believed that blood did not circulate but was consumed by the stomach. Better tools (microscopes) revealed capillaries and the circulation of blood. Medical science changed when proof was presented. I would change too if proof were presented. I’m not holding my breath, though.
Most of the problems of the world are, and always have been, caused by religion. For example, Northern Ireland, the Middle East, 9/11, and family planning clinic bombing in the USA. Then there were the crusades, the inquisition, witch burnings, and the dark ages. Get the idea?
Humanity will never truly be free until the black yoke of religion is lifted by the clear light of truth and rational thinking.
Would you quit with the atheist bit? We get it you don’t believe in god. But do you really have to be an ass about something little kids did. It was funny and cute. You’re allowed to believe what you want and i have no problem with that. But your a grown man. Act like it.
Whether or not God, Jesus, or even Big Foot exists may never truly be known, but James Smith João Pessoa, Brazil here is absolute proof that trolls are real!
Way to go James!
You can troll this comment all you want dude, I just stumbled upon these cute little kids’ silly notes and tried to see some sweet comments about them but instead got trollapalooza here.
Man, if you don’t like it then don’t read it, hit the Stumble button on the top left hand of your screen. Sounds like you’re the only one trying to push your agenda on anyone. No body seems to care, in fact, they’re just trying to get you to stfu. Now I’m so annoyed at your ignorance that I’m participating-gah! The troll wins!
And dude, you keep saying you don’t care, but if you really really didn’t care you wouldn’t keep the argument going. You can spout your “knowledge” all day but you still make yourself look like an idiot.
That is all…
This reply is supposed to be directed to James, but for some reason the reply button isn’t on his comment, anyways.
Religion itself isn’t responsible for the things you blame it for, that was orchestrated by cruel people who used other peoples belief in religion as a tool to motivate them into such brutal acts. Things like this have been done in other situations. An excellent example of this is the Holocaust, yes, I realize that was a persecution of the Jews but it wasn’t based on their religion. It was a persecution of the Jewish race as a people rather than a religious group. Denying good aspects of religion is as much pulling the wool over your own eyes as blindly accepting it is. I myself am an Agnostic, (say I’m lazy in my thoughts I dare you). Further more, quoting authors as sources is a fairly questionable action, I can point you to many books written in all seriousness that claim the earth is flat or the center of the universe and other such ridiculous ideas. This does not make them fact. In fact, I believe you and yours as much a problem for humanity as those with intense religious fervor. YOUR NOT HELPING! I quite like this paragraph though, “If they do not believe in gay marriage, divorce, contraception, consuming alcohol, or anything else, What does that matter to me? Nothing until they demand I “respect” their religion and practice the same things and refrain from pointing out they are silly, delusional, and counter-productive.” They demand you refrain from pointing out how silly, delusional and counter-productive it is? Awwh, poor you. Not allowed to voice your opinion about people who you think shouldn’t be allowed to voice their opinions. THAT is dictatorial my friend.
As for Tolerance, I approve of your message but I don’t really approve of your view. This goes for James as well. Technically speaking Atheism is a non-scientific approach, in science we have many theories but most never go past that. String theory is a great example, it’s the scientifically accepted idea but without proof it remains a theory rather than fact. The existence of God is much the same. without scientific proof of the existence of a supreme being an intellectual would disregard it, but without proof that their is no supreme being a true intellectual would, in fact, be forced to accept both possibilities. Science is about finding truth, in the way our universe works, it does this by accepting every view until proof is provided.
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c’est la vie
“but without proof that their is no supreme being a true intellectual would, in fact, be forced to accept both possibilities. ”
There is no such thing as proof of nonexistence. That doesn’t make any sense!
By your own logic, you are forced to admit to the possibility that dragons, fairies, wizards and my magical elf friend, Marvin, whom I just made up, exists. It’s okay though, without proof of nonexistence you’re forced to admit that his existence is possible. Seems, as a true intellectual, you’re forced to admit the possibility of a lot of wrong things. A true intellectual, such as yourself, has to admit that it’s possible your philosophy of “possibility until proof” is flawed.
Do you understand that, in your eyes, calling something “fiction” is unscientific?
Also, your argument isn’t exactly a new one, though you haven’t taken it quite as far as logic would dictate. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_in_a_vat for the full implications of your argument.
I agree with you completely. I just stumbled upon this website and find some man bashing the faith of others just because of a few notes from children. First he goes off on how he doesn’t want people’s faith being jammed down his throat, meanwhile nobody is doing so. It’s honestly idiotic. Oh and Jamess, I hope you understand that whoever read your comments and paid attention to your drivel for 5 seconds of their time will forget about you even faster. You are forcing your radical athiest values down OUR throats. You are merely a jugemental man with too much time on your hands. Do you really know us enough to assume that we are people that you should attack? I happen to agree with some of your values, why can’t you just be civil? You’ll probably respond to this with as much hate as you have to everyone else. I guess some people just cant admit when they’re wrong.
Thank you; I’m still formulating my own opinions and debating skills, and while I am certain that I believe differently than James here, I will try to use “I” instead of “we” in my debates.
I am an Atheist and I respect everyone’s views, but, in retrospect of things, isn’t Atheism technically a religion too?
“Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and moral values.” Wikipedia on religion.
GOD, in my view is an acronym standing for Group.Of.Disciples.
a group of people who believe a common thing. For example, people who are Christians follow the text in the Bible, Jewish believe in the writings of the Tanakh, Muslims in the Qur’an,etc. Atheists have moral values based on science, which Means Atheism is a “Religion”. Now, you might not agree to this which is fine because, like I said, “I respect everyone’s views”, but I am just giving you a different standpoint upon the situation.
Why can’t people just hold their beliefs and allow others to believe what they want? I can understand if someone is trying to force a belief down your throat or belittle others for their beliefs, as James is doing, but other than that where is the love? No matter what you believe happens after you die, we should all try to get along while we are alive. And James, it is you who acts arrogant, dismissive, and an all-around jerk.
DUDE! JAMES! Mad kudos! Seriously, you keeping this trolling up for so long and no ones figured out that you are legitimately trolling 😛 That was great, made my day.
Other people! Don’t feed the troll with your tolerance, it’s what he wants. Ignore him, and he will get confused and go away.
Word up to that.
I have a really hard time taking anything you’re saying seriously because you can’t spell or use proper punctuation.
Exhibit A: “It’s” – I think you meant the possessive form, “its.”
Exhibit B: “you’re not an atheists” True, it’s impossible for one person to be multiple of anything, even atheists.
It is so embarrassing when idiots try to speak on behalf of atheists. No wonder believers don’t take us seriously.
I have a really hard time taking anything you say seriously because you evade the central issues and focus on trivialities such as typos. That is a typical theist tactic, though. When you have no answers or logical replies, deny, delay, and distract. If all of that fails, pretend the issue was never raised and declare “Victory through the power of “…”. (insert name of deity here)
YOu claim to be an atheist? You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.
In my entire life, every time I have been cheated, taken advantage of, or otherwise treated badly, it has been by a “good christian”. Yes, I know that all christians are not like that. I personally know some and count them as friends. We have simply agreed to disagree and value each other for qualities of honesty, courtesy, and kindness. But if you were consistently abused by red-headed people, even though you knew some were good folks, wouldn’t you be a bit wary of red heads?
@James I find it rather amusing then you said this:
“YOu claim to be an atheist? You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.”
Becuase religion really has little to do with the fact if a person is an all around jerk, narrow minded, arrogant, dismissive ect.
YOU chose yourself how you treat others and there are many different influences in your life that will cause you to act as such.
For example, you noted how any time you were “done wrong” was in fact by a christian- which gives you a pretty negative response towards religion itself because that is what you’ve linked these situations with.
when you sit there and group a specific religion to be “arrogant, dissmissive of others, and an all around general jerk” you probally shouldn’t turn around and act the same.
yes, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and practices ect. you say this, yet contridict yourself.
i didnt bother reading through this whole conversation, because i can see that anything that is to be said, you have some long remark to shoot back-in my eyes “pushing your beliefs” ontop of all others.
this is meant to be a cute little snipit into the minds of children and how cute they can be. this shouldnt have to turn into a religious battle.
yes i say to each his own, im not anything that anything you have said is wrong. im simply saying everyone is going to have a different opinion and there comes a point where theres not much point in continueing to push that one side is more right then the other.
Yes, but James, keep in mind, redheads are hot. So you can put up with a little abuse can’t you?
Hey James,
“It’s better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and remove all doubt.”
You should have just left after the first comment.
Emily, you would do well to follow your own advice. YOu give no proof, you just parrot a statement that sounds cute to you without bothering to think if it is applicable. But that’s what theists do. Parrot what they’ve been told and never engage in logical thought.
Also typical of theists, you try to get any dissenters to just shut up. You don’t want to hear it so you want to suppress it. Take your own advice and just remain silent before you look worse than you do now.
I agree, James should have left after his first comment. Actually, he should not have left a comment at all. These are little notes kids are writing to God. Nobody is forcing anything on you as you stated above
“As I see so often, you only read what you want to think, not what is there. I never said I care what others think or believe. I only care when they try to force their beliefs upon me. Theists always do that by trying to pass their delusions into laws for everyone.”
Relax dude. The only reason anyone wants you to shut up is because nobody cares about your argument on this particular site. There was no need for your initial rant and certainly no need for you to continue calling people parrots and what not.
Now, I think those are really funny kids notes. Especially the one from Larry!
this is so cute weather or not you people hate religeon or not. i am not very old and i am not sure to believe in god or not. but no matter what this is just cute
You dug yourself into quite a hole, buddy. I would recommend this, in the nicest way possible: Just stop talking.I personally don’t find this evil or wrong, it’s just little kids,their funny letters,and their different ways of thinking(or at least how i interpret it).
However, I am very impressed with how much you have written in these comments. A lot of words,is all I can say about that. And maybe you shouldn’t rant about the evils of religion on the internet.Try finding people who will agree with you and rant to them or else all you will get is an endless debate. Let’s face it, just because you say these things,people will probably not change their minds, and vice versa(they certainly have not changed your mind).
Have a nice day!
Yep, another “just shut up” person pretending “It’s for your own good”.
Maybe you shouldn’t tell other people what to do. Are you now the internet Nazi with power over everyone? I doubt that.
If you were had read and understood what I have posted, you would have noticed I have said that “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.”
The only one I have hope of reaching are those who already have started to question what they have been told. “True believers” will never question anything. Religion has always been sheltered from criticism. That is stopping. Maybe someday religions will be required to be responsible for paying their own taxes, be truly qualified to counsel others, required to have teaching credentials to work with children, and all of the other things everyone else must do but religions get a free ride.
I couldn’t care less about the endless argument. It’s amusing to see how they are all the same thing. Accusations without proof. Attempts to distract from their failures to address the issues by introducing trivial topics such as typos.
Yes, I have pointed out those kind of mistakes in others, but it has been a minor thing “en passant”. I don’t pretend it is the most important issue there.
Seriously, what would be the point of “preaching to the choir”? Only posting where people will agree with you doesn’t make any sense. I do sometimes post a short message of encouragement to people on atheists site. Especially to someone that is just “coming out” as an atheist and is having a difficult time with people. It’s important for them to know that they are not alone.
I had no such support and went through years of discrimination and alienation, even from my own parents. I think of Damon in Louisiana who received even worse for reminding his high school that faculty-led prayer was illegal. He is fortunate to not be physically assaulted. I’ve been there myself. Theists do persecute people for non-belief. Then they try to play the persecution card themselves if anyone dares disagree with them. I’ve seen it on here.
Am I hard-nosed and sometimes obnoxious? Yes, I am. Accommodation does not work with religion. To them accommodation and surrender are the same thing. I will never surrender and I will never back down. Everyone can take that to the bank.
Dude, I’m a 14 year old. Don’t be so mean. I was just suggesting. I know very well that I can’t control people. I WAS SUGGESTING. I didn’t mean to offend you, I WAS SUGGESTING. and of course I didn’t read everything you said in the other comments. I could read a novel in that time.
And I am truly sorry you had a tough time with your parents and with other people. That’s not right for them to do that.I know, even if I did something really bad, my parents would support me, and it’s not right that your parents didn’t support you .
I know people can be annoying and mean and rude, but they can also be pleasant, kind, and polite. And fine, I get it, spread the word, but maybe this web page of little children’s letters to god isn’t the best place.
and you know what? I’m selfish, it’s not “just for your own good”, I don’t like how you’re being mean to people and insulting them and implying that they are stupid and brainwashed.That’s not right.
I’m really sorry you’ve been hurt,badly, but that gives no excuse to whine on the internet, like, well, a 14 year old teenage girl. I love God, but I know better than to try to tell that to people on the internet( great i just did.). Not being face-to-face with the people gives us such stubborness! And we cannot persecute you on the internet, unless we decide to find out where you live and go after you, but only whackjobs would do that.
There are mentally ill(or overzealous) people everywhere, whether they be muslim, christian, or atheisist, and they will do whatever is possible to prove their beliefs and punish those who don’t. Just because you have met people who persecute you for your beliefs doesn’t mean that everyone will. I have friends, best friends, from all walks of life, but i wouldn’t have them if I acted like this to them, if I implyed that they were stupid and brainwashed. They are kind good people and that’s all that matters.Once again, have a nice day.
I know you’re probably going to defend yourself again, because I admit I did say some things I probably shouldn’t but I just couldn’t stand how you were treating them. I wish you wouldn’t be so quick to judge. I know I’m making this personal, but you made this personal too. I hope someday that you’ll be happy. Maybe you should talk to someone about the anger you have. It helps me. I don’t think I’m going to comment again.
@Passive,Aggressive,Assertive
You do well with your words at your age and you show patience that many here have not, even though the words may offend you just as much. Keep that quality, it will serve you well.
Nobody will ever want to hear that they are brainwashed. The terrorists who bombed the WTC would not have wanted to hear that nor would they have believed it. Yet it is obvious that they are brainwashed, and it is further obvious that the results were disastrous.
You must understand, if his posting of his opinion on this website is offensive, then he can claim the very same of you. From his standpoint, your refutation of what he believes should be just as offensive as his refutation of your beliefs is to you.
Another thing, do you think your parents would support you if you told them you were atheist? It would be an interesting experiment to try out. I was unpleasantly surprised by parents reaction.
@Passive.
You Go Girl.
James, aren’t you doing exactly what you criticize religion for? Firstly, you are shoving atheism down people’s throats in the way that you comment and respond. Clearly this website has religious themes, if that bothers you then why visit it. Also, the humor is deeply rooted in the innocence of children. What they have written isn’t a sign of brain washing, it is a sign of a lack of knowledge. As adults they will inevitably get to a point where they will question their views and either follow your belief system or they will seriously consider their faith and return to it without the blind faith they had before (hopefully they will stop to think at least). Secondly, you portray a blind hatred for religion and historically that is what has led to the evil acts that religion has carried out. I agree with you that religious morals (like about gay marriage and abortion) should not be enforced by the law and should be an individuals right to choose, however aren’t there certain morals that we should all follow (i.e., do not kill). The problem with trying to separate a religious moral perspective from the law entirely is that for ages people have utilized religion as a guide for what is right and wrong.
I completely agree that people should not try to shove religion down other peoples throats. Sometimes us theist believe that we are sharing something wonderful (to us) with the world. I agree that sometimes that is most definitely not the case. But perhaps you have been met with so much hostility because you express hostility in your rhetoric? May be you should take a step back and evaluate whether or not you are doing exactly what you dislike about religion. People shouldn’t attack your opinion, but maybe you shouldn’t be so quick to judge either.
Wow take a chill pill. If you havn’t got a chill pill, take a chill strip. Stick it under your tounge, it dissolves: Chilled. I think someone is habouring issues of repressed anger. Have to tried yoga?
I see someone that is so arrogant they think they can tell anyone else how to behave, what to say, think, and do.
I have said repeatedly, what someone chooses to believe makes no difference to me. Only when they try to force those beliefs on my by making them the force of law, is it a problem. In no case have I ever advocated making atheism the law.
When anyone objects to someone else pointing out the fallacies in their beliefs, what they are really doing is suppressing free speech so they can continue to advance their beliefs above common sense.
Am I angry? Yes, I am angry that children are permitted to die of curable diseases so their parents can “pray for them”. I am angry when religions do not pay their share of axes and that their followers are permitted to be excused from taxes they give to those religions. That increases the burden on the rest of us.
I am angry when religions force their views into law and restrict the legitimate activities of others because they don’t agree with them.
I am angry when people are discriminated against because of the beliefs, lack of beliefs, sexual orientation, or skin color.
I am angry when, to promote their religion, lies are told, truth denied, and rational thought forbidden.
I am angry when family planning clinics are bombed and doctors murdered because some religious zealot thinks “God told him to do it.”
It it’s wrong to be angry over those things, I’d like a rational explanation of why that is.
I don’t expect to hear that from you.
@james
If you could have any theist say what you want them to say with out going against what they believe what would it be. Because a lot of what your doing is bashing other people’s statements and intelligence and it seems to me that if you said “I agree” with this or that people would agree with what you have to say more often. From a neutral standpoint you do seem to come off as a little…. Maybe a lot radical and if people see you become less radical they will be more likely to agree with you. I see it all the time as a debater in high school. I write this with the intention of helping your public reception so please don’t bash me. As a catholic we are called to LOVE others and thats what I’m trying to do. Don’t take it the wrong way as I could see myself doing if I was in your shoes. Last thing, please answer the first question I’m very curious
I am a 16 year old girl, I am a christian. and James I do not think it is wrong to be angry over things. I am a person who can be somewhat obnoxious myself, and i am a person who can get quite angry over things, trivial or not. Not to long ago, I was a child myself (I’m still one sometimes 🙂 ) blatantly accepting the religion my parents had. I have been challenged over the years with abuse problems from peers (but who hasn’t) It wasn’t until I had suicide thoughts that I realized I had issues…I knew it was wrong for my religion to do so. now, I get my strength from God. i do not have proof of anything, unless you take the fact that I know in my heart that what I think my religion is, I believe that to be true, with all my heart :). I am sorry you have had a bad past, and glad you have friends now who accept you. I don’t think it matters if you think differently than others who share you religion or no religion, or if you think differently than people who do not share their religion with you. If you can look past the religion you believe to be objectionable or look past the fact that some people have tried to force their religion on you, you might find that there are some people who can accept you for who you are and not for the religion you pose to have (this is not really directed at you James, and I am not trying to offend anyone, it’s just that I have an opinion on this topic that I would like heard…I’m not trying to force this on anyone, you can read it if you want) Sorry to offend anyone! :/
Sorry same girl here, but I would just like to say to James specifically, I understand that you have said you do not care what other people believe in, only when they try to force it on you…maybe if you tried to understand-understand not accept- their religion, they will graciously extend the same to you!
Brazilian dude sounds like a queer to me. Happy Birthday America!
I was expecting another unoriginal, sophomoric, sexually-oriented insult from the brain-damaged. Thanks for not disappointing me. 🙂
Tom and Steve? Are you a couple? LMAO!
James, I’m tired of seeing you on websites Stumbleupon brings me to. If I have to read one more comment about your hateful take on life, I’m spamming everything you type. Why don’t you get a job, maybe a friend who’s willing to put up with you even if you have to go so far as to pay them, and please go away. That is all.
Tell us all, who is it that’s making you read them?
You don’t know a damn thing about me. Nor do you know anything about my outlook on life.
You admit you are going to be a spammer. Are you proud of that? Do you think that will win you friends?
I don’t need a job, I am successfully retired form several careers. I have more friends that you will ever have.
I’ll tell you what. Let me fly you here.
Let’s see how brave you are when you have skin in the game? You are a coward and an admitted spammer. To admit being a spammer on the internet is either an act of great courage, even hiding behind a fake name, or incredible stupidity. I already know you have no courage except to tell people to shut up when hiding behind you keyboard. So come on, confront me, asshole. I will love it.
Dear James.
You sir, are an idiot.
Not very respectfully,
Also an Atheist, but not an asshole.
Your post proves that, if you are really an atheists, that ignorant, senseless replies are not the exclusive property of theists.
Yes, you are an asshole.
Like the rest of the people with moronic replies, you ignore the issues and do not even try to disprove one word I have posted. That’s the evidence that you are a fool, an idiot, and an asshole.
You receive no respect because you have earned none. You have earned contempt and derision. You have plenty of that from me and any other thinking person.
He doesn’t represent our views at all. I love these posts… they are the innocence of children.
“He doesn’t represent OUR views…”? I was not aware that you had been authorized to speak for anyone else, much less whomever “our views” might be. And I was called arrogant for expressing only my views. I see I have much to learn about being arrogant.
Today James ignored the valuable lesson of minding his own fucking business. You don’t believe in religion, meaning none of this actually matters to you so why even care what other people believe. Either they made a wrong decision or they didn’t. But what do you care. And maybe some less than appropriate actions have taken place due to religion. Again what do you care? So let them be happy and get off your high horse. Now see this is where youre going to point out my hypocrisy in that Im yelling at you. See thing is i am religious and feel as though something does happen, so other peoples lives, the ones annoying do matter to me because i believe something will eventually happen to them. Aint the religious excuse grand????
@Stumblin When were you appointed to be a Web Nazi to tell everyone else what to do? Take your own advice and mind your own business.
If you didn’t have a huge comprehension deficit, you would have noted that I have said many times, what others believe is not important to me. It’s when they try to pass those belief into law and restrict my freedom of speech thought, and action that it matters. Unfortunately that’s exactly what religion, all religions do. It’s what I see here and everywhere.
Yes, the religious excuse is grand. It saves you from having to think. That’s clearly way too much trouble for you. Or perhaps it’s simply outside your capabilities?
Admitting you’re religious is the confessing that you have never had an independent thought about it in your life. I don’t care about that. Just keep your beliefs out of the voting booth and on here, STFU. That’s what you’re telling me. When you do that, you give the right to others to do it to you. Even better, is it OK if I vote separation of church and state into the law? Oh wait, the founding fathers already did that. Maybe you haven’t heard of the Constitution? I recommend it as reading material.
I also recommend reading the bible. Read dispassionately, it is the best antidote to christianity available. It’s far better for that than even Dawkins or Hitchins.
Hey guys,
First off I’d like to apologize for being such a cocky, overgeneralizing, fifth-grade drama queen for the past few weeks. It all started off when I tried to confuse the innocence of a child with dramatic terms like ‘evil Christian theist arrogant brainwashing blah blah blah I’m a whinny bitch’. Then I went on to pretend a majority of atheists are as big of douchebags as I am by citing authors who do NOT share the same attitude. I try to say religion is all about genocide and hate even though those things are more human nature and I, the atheist, am the only one spreading animosity on this site that was meant to be a jovial list.
So again, I apologize for being a fallacious and ignorant person riddled with self-loathing and contempt and immaturity. I will probably go pretend I’m the better man and hate you all. and play with my tiny weiner.
To the cowardly asshole that posted under my name. You hide behind a fake, stolen ID to say things that only show what an ignorant jerk you are.
Do you really think your stupid comments fooled anyone but yourself? If you do, you are even more stupid than you sound.
You are the only person on here that I would love to meet face-to-face. You would either apologize or have a life-changing experience. You are the only coward here that has actually made me angry.
BTW, you semi-literate imbecile. Learn how to make paragraphs. You’re making theists look bad. I know plenty that are intelligent, well-educated, and are not afraid to use their own names. You will never fit any of those categories, will you?
James no one was pushing religion down your throat. You found this website and decided to comment. This whole discussion is pointless and in the end everyone will still disagree.
Who cares: You are not correct. I have religion forced at me all the time and people on here have tried it, too. Just read the ones that say, “I’ll pray for you” or “I hope you find Jesus” or “Read the Bible”.
Agreed, it is pointless to try to reason with people that have rejected reason, truth, and rational thinking in favor of a delusional belief in a non-existent deity. That doesn’t mean anyone has to surrender their right of free speech or to not respond when people address you.
Religion is pushed upon people every day and in many ways. Religious people make every attempt to stifle dissenting statements as they have done on here. Whenever an atheist group puts up a billboard or a sign on the side of a bust with something relatively innocuous such as “Good without God? Millions are” they do everything possible to force those statements to be removed. If an atheist group tried the same thing with their proselytizing, imagine the outrage.
Keep in mind that not one person has proven anything I have posted is not true. They have just been outraged that I said it. That should tell anyone a lot about what is really happening.
James…I’m just going say it this way. You seem like the type of person that needs a lot attention so you act like a grade A douche bag and you think that you are the best thing since sliced bread. You may have a high IQ (that’s just a guess) but act like you have the personality of a mix between a cast member of Jersey shore and a used condom. You take something that’s supposed to be funny then try shoving your views down others peoples throats(that’s actually kinda funny, yet sad, because you bitch and complain when “the evil christans” speak there minds) like anyones gives a flying fuck who you are or what crap you want to spew from your dirty asshole you call a mouth. Btw! Guess what!?!? I won’t be returning to this website to read what ever half assed rebuttal you might come up with. So enjoy responding to no one 😀
James… I was not saying that you do not get religion get pushed down your throat in general, but you choose to read this site and you choose to react. I completely agree that “Christians” would throw a fit if an atheist billboard were put up, but being a christian I can say that I do not agree with all the so called “Christian” advertisements. The main point is that you just agreed that this discussion is pointless so why respond to every one who disagrees with you. You absolutely have freedom of speech, one of the many virtues of our country, another is freedom of religion or lack there of, meaning I should not prosecute you for your beliefs nor should you prosecute me for mine.
How can you say that she can’t speak for theists beliefs when you have been arrogantly making blanket generalizations about the behaviors and tendencies of an entire group of people; most likely due to a few bad experiences with trying to be converted, which happens to plenty of people! You were saying that someone was “acting like a Theist.” That kind of ignorance is disgusting–placing those who believe in G-d at a lower place then you and assuming that they are all redneck, ignorant, uneducated buffoons just because they’ve given themselves over to the whole “G-d” thing.
Do you realize that by so fiercely arguing your atheism and putting others down for holding different beliefs or for being “lazy atheists,” you are doing exactly what you claim to despise about religion–trying to force yours down people’s throats, claiming your belief is “the truth” when the fact remains that nobody can possibly know the truth until death comes, at which point they will no longer be able to communicate that truth with the living world (according to my beliefs, which do not include communication with the dead)? Some religions claim it is the believer’s duty to try to convert others, which is where things get uncomfortable, as I believe we should realize the truth is unknowable, and we should therefore believe what we may but understand when others believe differently. And I am dumbfounded by the fact that you chose a website with children’s letters to start this argument. Children have many choices made for them by their parents, and they can choose to learn about other things when they are older, and neither they nor their parents should be criticized for following the trend of making religion a part of the family values. It’s like criticizing both the parents and children for what haircut the 5-year-old has or for the diet of the household. If a child finds it doesn’t suit them later on in life, it is their choice to learn about other theories or to come up with their own. I’m sure you had a similar choice in your lifetime, though if your parents did force atheism upon you, I don’t see how your argument works at all. Hating on religion, in my opinion, is as detrimental to a peaceful world as religions hating other religions is.
Well, I’m definitely not gonna come back here at any time and read any following comments, but I do want to get into the discussion a little.
It’s pretty ridiculous that James is such a dumb Troll that he’s spent what is clearly HOURS on this simple post meant to be humorous debating something that I bet very few of us even give a shit about. I, for one, stopped reading his comments pretty early on, not worth my time at all, I have better things to do than truly go through this worthless troll’s comments.
Believe what you want, and feel free to express those views, but I’m pretty certain damn near everyone who’s read these comments just thinks you’re a FUCKING TOOL. Call me immature or whatever you will, but seriously, you’re wasting your time fighting a battle nobody cares about.
James, we all have our beliefs, and are certainly entitled to them, but you’re just such a dick about yours that nobody’s going to take you seriously. If you want to make a point, try not being a douche, but that seems pretty hard for you. At least you made this page even more entertaining than the mildly funny letters for which it was made.
Again, I’ll never be back here, so feel free to waste your time responding, or don’t, but just know that I, in the very least (and probably a number of others here) just think you’re a GIANT DOUCHE.
🙂 Have a good one, troll.
why do people think this is written by children? these are old jokes that someone wrote down and took pictures of, I have gotten a few of these in chain mails so it is more of an adults way of fooling others into thinking that innocent kids are behind them
well if your atheist then why are you reading children s letters to god just so you can go around announcing that your atheist is that what atheism is all about going around and criticizing other peoples beliefs and belittling them then grow up and find a group were all they do is complain all day you’ll fit right in
“well if your atheist then why are you reading children s letters to god just so you can go around announcing that your atheist”
I was sent here from StumbleUpon, and I happened to notice James’s comment.
“is that what atheism is all about going around and criticizing other peoples beliefs and belittling them”
Nope; I just happen to have religious friends who choose to live by the good parts of faith, and are good people. I didn’t appreciate having my friends insulted and called “brainwashed”, and I decided to comment in emotional retaliation to that, out of loyalty to my friends.
“grow up and find a group were all they do is complain all day you’ll fit right in”
Think of all the ways in which that argument could be used. A person finds out a friend of theirs is suicidal? Oh, go slit your wrists in the corner, you crybaby. Women’s rights? Yeah, sure. Go complain about it somewhere else…the kitchen, perhaps. “Complaining” about intolerance (in this case, a person lashing out against an entire group of people with whom he has only has a certain kind of contact) tends to lead towards positive change. In my first example, a person speaking out against the intolerance of the “slit your wrists in the corner” remark, might save the suicidal person’s life. In my second example…well, women’s rights have sprouted entirely from a person “complaining” about injustice.
You cannot catagorize and sort people based on their beliefs, whether they are christian, muslim, atheist or anything else, everyone deserves to be respected and have the right to their opinions. These children are not being brainwashed into believeing lies. That God is the truth to those Christians, and who are you to decide how other parents raise their children?
Julia, I’m a christian. But I just want to say thank you for being respectful! unlike some people….
Can science alone provide humanity with a universal morality for all to strive for?
That’s ridiculous. You are applying the province of philosophy to science. But that is the normal tactic of theists, distract, deny, and distort. Then change the rules if they start to look bad. Religious morality is an oxymoron.
YOu can find a better answer on my blog: http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/08/02/ethics/
Morality for religion is mostly condemn, threaten, or kill those who do not do as you demand.
That is exactly what I am trying to apply thought to; if the only truth one knows is “what is” or science, than how can one appropriately apply those truths to how they should think or act without devolving? It seems that you derive some sort of belief system from somewhere other than pure science based on your comments.
I like your thoughts in your blog about the flat tax.
well it seems quite obvious, you attain your beliefs through the experience of life. This is from my point of view a much better way of attaining beliefs (I assume you mean morality) than the writings of 2000 year old desert nomads, which if you read all of the scripture seem to have allot more things we generally find unacceptable in todays world than the obvious good. such as its completely sexist throughout, condones stoning and tells you to live in fear however it also includes do not kill. Its clear it was used as a social control method, and todays social control method is law, so religion is effectively irrelevant. Perhaps we should think as a species, instead of such factions and humanity would be better off.
Oh James, God bless.
You are arrogant and offensive. What if a Satan-worshiper said to you, “I’ll sacrifice a couple of babies to Lord Satan for you”? How would you like that?
But being arrogant and offensive are two things christians are very good at doing. Remember, when you are like that, you give others the right to be the same to you. Oops, christians don’t believe that, either. After all, the golden rule is just a cute fable, isn’t it? What I find so disturbing is how christians so rarely behave like they claim to be. Thank you for providing yet another example of this for me. But really, I have enough of those already.
The difference being that christians believe in satan, yet you do not believe in god.
See, if you had kids, and you put pictures of them doing something funny on the internet, for a blog, because you are proud of them, and somebody posts “Isn’t it horrible that these kids are doing something funny, clearly they are being bought up wrong!”
would you be mad? would you consider them to be “Shoving their beliefs down your throat”
Now, if somebody were to say “Have a nice day”, is that offensive? Even if you don’t believe that their words will have any effect? because to an atheist, that is effectively the meaning behind “god bless”.
Thanks, btw, I enjoy these debates.
Cam.
You are brilliant!
Katie I mean
“But being arrogant and offensive are two things christians are very good at doing.”?????
You’ve been doing a better job at this than all the theists on here, and fellow atheists as well.
James, you are arrogant and offensive. I have never sacrificed babies to my lord and savior Lucifer. Don’t over-generalized my religion!
*trololololol*
Katie, I thought that was very kind of you.
James, are you just trolling? I mean, seriously? Listen, I’m happy for you in the fact that you are so excited about defending your beliefs! Good for you! But, how in the world did this post get to this heated of a conversation?
Satanist, ahahaha! This may be my new favorite troll.
And Atheists? I want you to know, my God loves you. And don’t worry! You won’t burn in Hell. God would much rather say “Told you so you little shit! Get on in here!” and let you frolic in the fields of paradise for eternity!
Bless your heart.
Katie, you love being obnoxious and arrogant don’t you? Thanks for confirming what total jerks christians love to be. That’s why I hold people like you in derision and contempt.
You must enjoy looking like a total moron, you keep coming back for more. Does it give you a cheap thrill to look like the jerk you are?
Does it give you a cheap thrill to look like the jerk you are?
omgwow! I was gonna ask you the same thing!
Blessings of Thor upon you, Katie. Understand that although you do not believe in Thor, he believes in you and loves you so much! I pray that one day you will be led by his mighty hammer away from false gods and into his thunderous presence.
@James,
The best part of your arrogance is assuming that just because Katie wrote “god bless” she is a Christian. She could easily be a Jew or a Muslim. This comment just proves how arrogant some people can be behind the veil of a computer.
“But that is the normal tactic of theists, distract, deny, and distort. ”
just a note, that is EXACTLY what Dawkins does.
For anyone who actually knows their faith, upon reading Dawkins, you’d know that he has totally missed the point, and arguing against something that even Christians don’t believe in. lol. It’s like, we don’t believe that, what are you talking about?
A quick aside, I think you made a little typo in your ID. Shouldn’t it say “Bemused”?
Perhaps you can give some specific examples of Dawkins using “deny, delay, distract”?
What are you saying he argues against something christians don’t believe in? Again, please give examples. Maybe it’s god? christians don’t believe in god or jesus?
Maybe if you gave specific examples, you’d have some credibility. As it is, you are amusing while being confused.
Yes, as a matter of fact it can. Working together tends to make weak species stronger, if the build of that particular species isn’t tough enough to take on the world on its own. A school of fish working together can make a larger fish go away. Humans have taken that concept of pack survival and have taken it to the next level of “morality”.
For instance, sometime in history, a person (in whatever stage of evolution they happened to believe in; yes, I do go along with evolution, as it makes a lot more sense than the alternatives out there) must have realized that if anyone in the pack kills or steals from another member, they get cast out and are left to die on their own. Morality has sprung from the knowledge of this, and the nature of humans to stick together. Also, in the case of a family, it must have occurred to someone that a human baby is a very delicate thing, compared to other animal babies. I mean, colts just get out, get up, and walk. Babies…well, you get the deal. Therefore, for the good of the pack, it is not a good thing for either parent to desert their child, and the idea of parenting was born.
So, in case you decide to go with “tl;dr”: To answer your question, no.
Whoops…I mean “yes”, for that last word there. *facepalm at self* I stand by what I said for everything else.
It only takes one person too make something this innocent into a giant mess.
It only rakes one religion to turn the world into a giant mess. I simply adore the way so many want to suppress free speech when it doesn’t say what the want to hear.
That’s why my tag line in emails is< "If freedom means anything at all, it is the liberty to tell others what they do not want to hear."
Theists consistently hate this idea. But hate and intolerance are the two cornerstones of most religions.
SO I bid this sad, sad site of delusional christians and their apologists adieu. I have made my point that, once again, theists are not nice people when they are challenged about their sick beliefs. I never expected anything else from people that will brainwash their own children and the children of everyone else into a demented, false set of beliefs with no verifiable evidence. It's no wonder children have to learn to lie. They have such great examples thrust upon them.
Freedom of speech: you have the right to say what you want, and we have the right to call you a douche when we think you’re being a douche.
“That’s why my tag line in emails is< "If freedom means anything at all, it is the liberty to tell others what they do not want to hear."
huh…well freedom is nice. Freedom of speech is lovely. I like it, I'm an American. I use it on a daily basis to tell people to shove it, to explain the way I feel, to express the best I can, without worry, what I mean to say without being patronized.
You say "I have religion forced at me all the time…" well sir, you live Brazil; according to brazil.gov, Roman Catholics make up over 74% of the country. The percentage make perfect sense to anyone that's been to Brazil; in Brazil, there isn't much else to do. If you'd like to live somewhere where it's not being "forced at you" might I suggest Sweden; Sweden's population is made of 85% non-religious folk.
I met a kid once in high school. He was a vegetarian, a label reader, a "hipster" but above all else he was an atheist. He hated people of all religions. He claimed religion was brainwashing people in believing there was something there that wasn't. He talked daily about how stupid people were–believing in something they couldn't prove. As easy as it would be to beat the crap out of him, verbally and/or physically, I didn't.
You see I'm a Christian in the actual sense of thew meaning–to be Christ-like. And as much as I'd like to say I know exactly what it means to be Christ-like I don't. However I do know it means to understand. So try to understand I did.
I did my research to find out why he acted the way he did. Why he hated God so much. I spent the night at his house, expecting to see what could learn from his parents. As I spent the night I was greeted by his grandparents. I'm sure you see where I'm going and others will too.
You see, his parents died in a car accident when he was fourteen. A car accident he escaped with but minor busing and a broken rib. It was after this I started to look at him in a new light. He didn't hate the idea of God, he hated the idea of a God that would take his parents and leave him behind.
So, here I decided to do the same; I did my research. I know this is a little personal, but if you're going to post hatred on a site about children then attack others I think it's safe to say you find nothing sacred.
James–
I'm sorry about your wife. It wasn't your fault. You can keep thinking poisoned thoughts about how God didn't save her; how you prayed and prayed to cure her cancer but no treatment worked. How she died too early. You both saved and saved and saved to take your trip around the world only to have her get sick part of the way though and spend the rest of the money trying to save her.
I understand. You blame God. But James you have to understand, God loved her too. God does have a higher plan and you will see her again. If you want to spend your life being bitter go for it. But being bitter isn't what she would have wanted.
I know you'll probably come back to say I'm lying–trying to hide your pain, trying to get others to hate just like you do and I'm sorry for that. Just realize God does love you, even if you don't love him back.
with everlasting sorrow,
Roth
You may not be a liar, but you are attempting to project what may be your own experience on me to justify your own delusions. Whether that experience is true or not, I can’t say. But it does sound suspiciously like similar stories I have been told before by theists.
What wife? I have never mentioned any wife on here.
Furthermore, I have been an atheist since I was 13, when I learned to think for myself. You should try it.
Blame god? Hate god? That is also ridiculous. How can you hate something that has never existed? Do environmentalists hate Paul Bunyan for cutting down all those trees? You theists always try the “Hate god” nonsense. No idea it too absurd for you reject, is it?
Is it any wonder I find theists silly, stubbornly ignorant, and regard all religion with derision and contempt? Theists put forth the most incredible, outrageous statements and expect everyone to accept them without proof as you accept your religion without proof. If you asked for proof, there would be no religion.
Belief without proof is called “faith”. To quote Mark Twain, “Faith is believing what you know ain’t true.”
I will admit that I have what must be a character flaw. I have never dealt well with stupidity at any time. When I encounter willful stupidity such as is required for religion, I find that especially unacceptable. A person cannot help it if he was born with less than normal intelligence. But to deliberately discard intelligence in favor of ignorance is to disdain the gifts you claim your god has given you.
Look at all of the replies here that have accused me of different things without even offering and example, far less proof. Look at the people that have chastised me for being rude and obnoxious and have not given me credit for my replies that have been kind and gentle. How many do you think have bothered to learn any more about me by reading my blog or looking at the videos I have made for myself and others. Is that the actions of christian tolerance, kindness, and understanding?
What I have seen here is vicious lies and accusations. How many have said I have not spoken the truth about anything but gave no examples nor any proof of that? If I have been difficult, it is simply a reflection of how others act on here. That’s how I am, a reflection of those around me. Perhaps these “good christians” should examine their own behavior. But they will not do that any more than they will bother to learn more about me. Either one might wreck their cherished beliefs.
One of the Universal truths I have on my blog is, “Man’s most cherished possessions are his illusions. He will surrender his property, family, even his life before his illusions.” Nothing I have read on here has altered that concept. Nor have a read anything that improves my opinion of theists.
You don’t really offer any “proof” either. You just call the opposing party stupid and belittle their ideas. “You may not be a liar, but you are attempting to project what may be your own experience on me to justify your own delusions.” ” I have never dealt well with stupidity at any time. When I encounter willful stupidity such as is required for religion, I find that especially unacceptable.” And saying definitively that G-d does not exist is not logically possible. There are very few things that can be considered facts. The existence of a deity is probably at the top of the list. There are plenty theists and atheists all over the world who question their beliefs of G-d and of everything else. I know I have, and I’ve met plenty of people who do. How can you say that you are so sure of yourself and that you know the absolute, impossible to combat truth when almost everyone else in the world has uncertainties?
“It only rakes one religion to turn the world into a giant mess.”
False. If there were only one religion, there would be a lot fewer wars over which one was the true one. (;
That said, how can you accuse Theists of brainwashing their children by teaching them what they believe? Will you not teach your own children what you believe? Or will you bite your tongue every time they have a question that your view-point provides an answer to and just let them stumble upon some type of understanding of the world eventually? I highly doubt the latter would be the case. Biting one’s tongue has never been one of mankind’s most dominant traits.
In the future, I suggest you look at your own attitude before accusing others of being
arrogant jerks. None of your comments have come off as anything less, which is sad, because perhaps in your normal social life you are absolutely lovely and get on with just about everybody. Too bad all any of us can see is the guy who overreacts to a website and then sits back name-calling and generalizing a group of people he claims does the same to him (I feel like my mom said something about two wrongs…). With great fervor, I might add.
Keep in mind that there is no proving the things in life that cause the big questions, or at least none has come up. There is certainly some very nice evidence, but no smoking guns, as it were. We’re all canaries in a coal mine on these subjects, I’m afraid.
Only one religion is what all theists wish to do. Their problem is, none can produce any evidence that their religion is any more real than the others.
So you admit there have been wars over which religion is “the one true one”? At least we agree on that.
I don’t accuse theists of subjecting their children to brainwashing. I am saying directly that it’s what they do.
For my own children, I would rarely answer any questions directly but encourage them to find their own answers. Admittedly, I often answered, “I don’t know” so they would have to discover things for themselves. But as far as imposing my atheism on them, if they asked “Dad, why don’t you go to a church?” I would answer honestly. “Because I do not accept those beliefs as being true.” If they asked”Why not?” as children do, then it would be “Learn all you can about it, then you tell me.”
Children love to learn and discover things for themselves if they are encouraged to do so and it’s not made a chore.
It wasn’t a matter of biting my tongue, it was a matter of encouraging the development of young minds. Did they sometimes go down the wrong trail and discover they’d been wrong? Sure, often. That was part of the lesson. That they can be wrong and anyone can be wrong. The best part of education is learning where your mistakes are and correcting them.
Again, you assume far too much. I do not accuse, I state the obvious. Just as you are being arrogant in you assumptions.
Yes, there is proving the big questions. Many have been answered and others will be. Will everything eventually be known? That’s possible, but unlikely. What is known is that there is not one atom of evidence for any god at all. It’s unfortunate that some people refuse to admit this. But, as I said elsewhere on here. “Man’s most precious possessions are his illusions. A person will surrender their property, family, and even their life before their illusions.” Good luck with yours.
I apologize if my question came off in an assumptive manner, I meant to do nothing of the sort. I was simply raising an eyebrow, if you take the meaning.
Of course I admit there have been wars fought over religion. But there are wars fought over all kinds of things. I’m quite certain there are plenty of people who have killed other persons for motives that have nothing to do whatsoever with religion. Anything can be twisted into something bad.
Also, there are several theists perfectly capable of raising their children without “brainwashing” them as you say. My parents raised me in much the same manner as you state you’ve raised your own. If I asked a question, my mother answered with “I believe…” My brother and I were taken to church because that is where my parents were on Sundays, and it was cheaper (hard to beat free) than a daycare or a babysitter on a Sunday morning. As soon as we became old enough to stay at home, we were more than welcome to. No brow-beating, no pushing. We even attended *gasp* public school. I am personally still asking myself the big questions. I’m not being lazy when I say I’m unsure what I believe as of yet, I am admitting to still being young and still learning.
I hope I never stop learning, quite frankly.
That said, thank you for wishing me well with my illusions. I also hope I never lose those, as sometimes on a particularly awful or even simply dull day, it’s nice to have somewhere quiet to slip away to.
And you’re right. There is no “proof”. But I haven’t been shown a lot of proof from
other sides either. Note I said I haven’t been shown any, please. I don’t want to be accused of ignoring things again.
I’m not sure if this reply is worth the time, since you seem to have made up your mind that what I’m saying is “Repent, heathen!” But I’m really not. But please, the broad-sweeping generalizations are unnecessary. I am sorry for the people you have met who have tried to shove things down your throat. I guess I was trying to get out a “They’re not all bad” message and wasn’t very clear about it and didn’t do a very good job. I hope my example in this post will serve me better.
If you’d like to share any proof with me, I’d be more than happy to see it. Most people just tell me that it exists and don’t go any further. I’ve no problem saying I’m left a bit ignorant. Any links or suggestions of valuable reads would be welcomed (:
@ James
Please reply to this
@Samantha this is beautifully written and leaves no room for argument. You do a great job on this
only takes one fool to not notice that this is fake lol
Is it so bad to believe in something when your growing up? Instead of complaining just be thankful that children get a chance to believe in something and learn. Not every child gets a chance to learn about religion or faith. If you consider trying to give children a chance to learn about their own faith, then maybe you need to re learn what what the term “brain washing” really means. These letters to God have nothing involving “brain washing”.
First, it’s “you’re” not “your”.
Children learn about their own faith? What faith? DO you mean the one imposed upon them by their parents and others? Children are born innocent and without delusions.
If you were born somewhere else, you might be a Muslim, Shintoist, Jew, Hindu, or anything. Your faith is no more than an accident of birth and your own unwillingness to face the truth.
Those letters DO reflect the brainwashing (it’s one word) they have already received in their lives. Face fact, I know you are not willing to about your religion, but, “Beliefs, no matter how sincerely held, do not alter facts.” Like it or not, the truth is still the truth.
Don’t forget: atheism is also a belief passed down from parent to child. It is impossible to prove or disprove logically an entity that (if it exists) transcends the natural laws of the universe. An atheist will use logic to justify what they already believe, as will a theist.
Atheism is not a belief. It is a rational response to observed facts. Beliefs are opinions held without any supporting facts. Like your belief that you are intelligent.
My atheism was certainly not passed down from my parents. It was something I arrived at after reading the bible front to back several times and noticing all the contradictions, impossibilities, and outright lies.
As a result of my atheism, I endured years of threats, groundings, and abuse, verbal and even physical. Most of it from my parents, although they never abused me physically, mentally, it was barely endurable.
It isn’t what I “believe”. It’s what I know and is supported by all available evidence. Not much logic is required, just a willingness to accept verifiable facts.
The bible really has nothing to do with this. The bible cannot neither prove nor disprove god. The only god whose existence it concerns is the judeo-christian idea of one. Even if the bible cannot possibly be a book written by god given to israel on mount sinai, it is still possible that there exist a god. Whether or not one choses to believe in it is their own choice, because no logic in the whole world can definitively disprove the existence of a define being because, as i’ve said and you haven’t countered, you can’t use logic to prove or disprove an entity that is not trapped by it.
L, logic would be lost upon you. Your only interest is in being as obnoxious as possible. I’ll give you this, you’re very good at it.
I have asked for any proof of any god so many times and have been ignored or referred to the circular logic of a “holy book”.
You are right, the babble cannot possible be written by any god. Even a mediocre deity would do a better job than that collection of myths, lies, and impossibilities.
BTW, it should be “can neither prove or disprove god.” But why would it try to intentionally disprove the god it is supposed to promote? Oh well, I suppose that is only more of what passes for logic with you.
“Atheism is not a belief. It is a rational response to observed facts. Beliefs are opinions held without any supporting facts.”
If atheism is not a belief, what facts support/prove it?
The facts lead to agnosticism. Anything else is a belief, whether it is the belief that 0, 1, or many god(s) exist. There are no supporting facts for theism OR atheism.
Does this sound familiar mr. James:
“I have a really hard time taking anything you say seriously because you evade the central issues and focus on trivialities such as typos. That is a typical theist tactic, though. When you have no answers or logical replies, deny, delay, and distract. If all of that fails, pretend the issue was never raised and declare “Victory through the power of “…”. (insert name of deity here)”
What a hypocrite, calling someone out on something as “trivial” as typos?
Thank you for bringing it to his attention! He keeps doing that. Driving me crazy that he contradicted himself so badly! lol
He was criticizing that person for ONLY focusing on trivialities. The person attacked his grammar, called him an idiot, and then offered nothing else.
Also, can you guess which comments he hasn’t responded to? 😉
He does the same thing on his blog. Ignores the ones that points out his flaws and the ones asking of him what he is asking of everyone else. Instead of “deny, delay, and distract.” It should be Attack, insult, and ignore.”
This really has been a fun read! I’ve found the comments far more entertaining then the original page. lol
Apparently brainwashed: Tell me one instance on my blog where I have ignored any comment where I have not responded. I have deleted a very few when there was nothing to which to respond. When there was nothing but attacks kike “Faggot”, “Asshole” and other one- or two- word insults, there is nothing to say.
“Attack, insult, and ignore. That’s exactly what you have done in your post. It must feel good doing that behind the safety of the internet. Almost as good as revealing yourself to be a total jerk?
Did you not just criticize “theists” for attacking typos instead of addressing the real issues at hand?
Like so many others on here, you understand only what you want to understand.
What I criticized one person for was posting about nothing but typos. As I explained several times to him and others, is, when I mention typos at all, it is only in passing, not as the entire theme of the post. I have never denied that I make them myself. When you enter text quickly and do not always take the time to edit before clicking “Post Comment”, things will slip through.
Most often, I ignore typos and grammatical errors. If I commented on every error I saw, I would have no time for anything else. Similarly, if I carefully edited everything I posted, I would be devoting more time than I have for this.
While on the subject, it seems that mostly theists see and comprehend only what they wish to understand. I’d have to take a more detailed survey to state that as a certainty. Nonetheless, when I consider that, to believe in a deity, one must believe only what supports that view and to reject any facts or logic that does not, it seems to be a probable hypothesis that is the case. A strict examination of sufficient posts, here and elsewhere might promote that hypothesis to a theory.
That is also a demonstration of the difference in the difference between hypothesis and theory in the scientific method. Many theists do not understand this so they make statements like, “Evolution is just a theory.” no realizing they are revealing more about their ignorance than they are supporting a creationist view.
James, weren’t you saying earlier how it is ridiculous to point out typos?
No Kate, I was not. Please take more care in reading and comprehending.
What I said was, to devote an entire post to only typos is nothing more than a way to avoid genuine issues when you have nothing intelligent to say.
I also said that, when I mention them, it is an aside, not the point of the entire post. That’s what I said in the very post you are criticizing. What part of it was too difficult for you to understand? All of it?
I believe I understood the whole thing, thank you.
My point is, you make the typo issue the first part of your statement, clearly making it a point to prove that whomever it was was ignorant to begin with, thus making your argument seem more valid.
Also, the initial comment about the typos was a girl simply pointing out that you seem ignorant and are representing Atheists in a bad light, which you also made another poster seem ignorant with your immediate attack on their typing.
By the way, I am curious of your evidence that supports the idea that God is not real. And I am interested in knowing if you think that telling children about Santa and the Tooth Fairy is also brainwashing. No, I do not want this to be a debate between the two of us, I am genuinely interested to hear your views on this, as I have honestly never asked an Atheist this before.
I say we stop replying to what James is saying. He is obviously deranged and this is just fun for his boring life. Save your thoughts for someone competent.
Save thoughts for someone competent? Like you? Then say something that is rational and not so obviously willfully ignorant.
You want to shut me up. That’s the usual theist response to anything they cannot answer, “Just shut up! I can’t hear you, La lala lalala!”
Accusing me of being “deranged” is really an intelligent, cogent argument. You have so much proof. Yet, neither you not anyone else has shown that even one word I have posted is not correct. All you can do is try to discredit me with transparent attempt like “deranged.” If you think that will fool anyone, then maybe the deranged label belongs on you.
Hey James I like how you are trying to use big words to seem intelligent, your not fooling anyone on this comment page I hope you see that. You are the only one on here who is attacking everyone else and the only one who acts that you know everything. I think your very well deserved of the “deranged” label I have given you so wear it proudly and accept it. Your way too easy to see through, get a new act.
Man, these theists seem to have a lot of “usual responses.” What have I learned about James? That his usual response is to claim that everything anyone does is some evil tactic.
I sense a lack of vocabulary on your part sir.
I have to repeat the same things. Very few on here are capable of understanding the same concept when it is phrased differently. It only confuses them.
Where have I said anything was an “evil tactic”? I have said “usual tactic” if it is evil, perhaps you are seeing it even more clearly than I. Thank you for that.
Lack of vocabulary? I sense a lack of true intellectual development, educational experience, and a prevalence of ostentatious prevarication with you.
you are a piece of shit… thats all.
Oohhhh, Andrew, that is so smart, so cutting, so wise. Why don’t you add “fuck you” to it so your superior intellect is inescapable to all?
The way it is, you sound like a typical internet coward, hiding behind his keyboard to say things that you would never dare say face-to-face.
Look who’s talking.
(referring to ” hiding behind his keyboard to say things that you would never dare say face-to-face.” of course)
The difference is, use my real name and place of residence. Furthermore, if you, or anyone else wants to confront me personally, I’ll pay your way here. The we shall see how brave you are.
Like everyone here, when they think I am no longer watching becomes very brave and starts posting unproven lies about me and irrelevant statements that have nothing to do with the issues.
How typical of theists to be smug, self-congratulatory, and silly when they think they are safe from rebuttal.
I repeat, not one person has proven anything I have posted is wrong. No one has even given an example of things they claim are wrong, much less provided proof.
If you are a rational person, that indicates intellectual and ethical cowardice. That comes as no surprise.
SO many here think because they or someone says something it is true. Like “you have not told the truth about anything”. But no examples are given. But theists must accept statements as being true with no sup[porting evidence. That’s the basis of all religion. Then, they can be “supported” by the usual circular reasoning. How pathetic you all have shown yourselves to be.
Now I can walk away because I still have my integrity. That’s something few of you can claim. You know I’ve made you look like fools. I repeat. Not one person on here, I’m looking right at you Kaitlyn, has proven a single word I have posted has been wrong. You can claim you have, but that doesn’t make it true. What makes it true is specific examples with independently verifiable evidence. None of that has been forthcoming.
So adios, it’s been amusing, but I have more important things to do.
It does not matter whether or not you use your real name or place of residence. For one thing, internet security is a very fragile thing, and often times it is recommended that people use alias names when posting comments on sites such as this one. Maybe you didn’t notice, but I’ve made several posts on multiple comments you’ve made. Yet you chose to respond to the shortest one without addressing any of the points I have brought up.
“But theists must accept statements as being true with no sup[porting evidence. That’s the basis of all religion. Then, they can be “supported” by the usual circular reasoning.”
So do atheists. It is impossible for anyone to empirically disprove G-d, because his existence (if he does indeed exist) is one that transcends the natural laws (as i have stated before). As I have also stated, because of this, the decision whether or not to believe in G-d is an emotional one, not a logical one. There are plenty of valid reasons on both sides for the way people believe the way they do.
I’ve tried not to be rude, a courtesy that you clearly have not tried to honor (through statements such as ” You know I’ve made you look like fools. I repeat. ” and many others). As I’m fairly certain I’ve said on another post, it is very difficult to believe your claims that you are not trying to convince anyone of anything, or cause any anger when you patronize any and all responses that you get. The fact that this is the only response of mine you chose to respond to shows that you are a coward. I would appreciate if you would respond to all of my other, more coherent responses; otherwise I will continue thinking that I am right (a conclusion you probably won’t be able to handle.)
“It is impossible for anyone to empirically disprove G-d”
Empirically disprove doesn’t make any sense. There are an infinite number of things disproven, when something is proven true. The disproof is in the proof, as they say.
“because his existence (if he does indeed exist) is one that transcends the natural laws”
Right….How do you know this? Are you so sure that your interpretation of natural laws is perfect?
“As I have also stated, because of this, the decision whether or not to believe in G-d is an emotional one, not a logical one.”
The decision to believe is indeed emotional. Disbelief, however, involves logic and is the default. Babies are born “without belief in god” (atheism). If you don’t automatically believe everything you hear, then disbelief is your default.
Since when did we trust our emotions to give us truth? This why we have standards to weed out things like confirmation bias in our scientific studies.
There are more than 1 billion Muslim people in the world, all of them using their emotions and determining that their Allah is the one who exists. In your eyes, their emotions are leading them falsely, as are the emotions of the atheists and every other religion than your prescribed one. Suddenly, emotions don’t seem too reliable a tool.
“There are plenty of valid reasons on both sides for the way people believe the way they do.”
There are valid reasons for vague and unspecific theistic beliefs, such as agnostic theism, deism or just a simple belief that something other than the universe exists.
There are far more reasons against trying to describe or name what that “something” is.
Oh L, you poor put-upon person. YOu are distressed because I do not choose to reply to every one of your ramblings. I don’t even see all of them nor have tome to read them. I do have a life other than deciphering the convoluted maundering from your keyboard.
Tell you what, I’ll extend the offer of a free trip here to you. Then we’ll see who is the coward. Be sure to write out your statements in advance and practice them so you don’t become confused as you do on here.
Then you will have plenty of time to consider your mistakes after our “chat”.
Babies are born without belief in god(s) (agnosticism). This is neither the belief in the non-existence of god(s) (atheism), or the belief in the existence of god(s) (theism).
Agnosticism refers to the belief that knowledge about gods cannot be known. Do you think that really applies to babies?
One can be an agnostic theist (one who believes but admits that his belief cannot truly be known)
Similarly, one can be agnostic atheist (One who admits that you cannot be certain if a god does/doesn’t exist, but rates the probability of this god existing as extremely low)
Atheism is defined by the merriam-webster dictionary as:
a : a disbelief in the existence of deity
b : the doctrine that there is no deity
Now, why would these be listed as differing definitions, if they actually mean the same thing (which is what you claim)?
Disbelief encompasses more than one opinion. If you simply do not accept the claims of a religion because you find there is insufficient evidence, but would change your mind were evidence presented, then you are STILL an atheist.
Let me put it this way:
A christian given the statement “God exists” would rate the statement as true.
An atheist, however, when given the statement “God does not exist” is free to answer either True OR False.
They can claim that they know God doesn’t exist, or they can claim they don’t know, which necessitates a “False” answer. Not believing in God is NOT NOT NOT the same as believing in no God.
Why doesnt someone shoot him so he can grow into a tree or whatever he thinks is going to happen?
This is blatant ignorance. Anyone who thinks it is religion causing all of these conflicts obviously has no grasp on human nature. Since the dawn of time, humans have fought against each other for various reasons: blood feuds, territorial claims, and fight for food supply to name a few. Many of the wars blamed on “religion” are actually primarily caused by land feuds. I’ll admit, it’s true that there are some religious extremists that do twist religion selfishly and use it as an excuse for violence towards their enemies; but do you think that they’ll just go away if religion fades? People will always find a reason to hate each other. The violent tendencies of man are a genetic part imbibed in them as a part of the fight for survival and survival instinct.
Yes, I am finding reasons to hate you that have nothing to do with religion.
Even though you sometimes make rational statements, you manage to ruin them by being an obnoxious jerk.
James-
My beliefs do not matter.
What matters is that, while some have attacked you, unfairly at times, some have tried to ask you, kindly, if you would please not attack an entire religion because of some individuals, or smaller groups. If men with mustaches had offended you, would you besmirch and verbally assault any human being with facial hair? That isn’t fair to the rest of the religion.
No, not every Christian behaves as they are taught, and not all have researched their beliefs. But please don’t say that no one has, because you don’t know them; what they choose to believe is their choice, the same as it is yours. Perhaps they HAVE looked as WHY they believe as they do; read up on history or the Bible (not necessarily a faultless source, so don’t attack me), or researched other religions or a way of life without religion at all. The fact of the matter is, you have no right to attack an entire group of people simply because it is not your manner of thinking.
I admire that you asked your children to go and discover what they think; my parents did the same thing, and they are both theists. I was NEVER forced to go to church, pressured to do anything with religion, and always encouraged to ask any questions about things that I did not understand. Atheist homes are not the only homes in which questions are allowed; I was raised by a Roman Catholic and a Protestant, and I am free still to be whatever I choose.
I am sorry that some people on here aren’t more accepting of your views. I think that they are your own opinion, and you have as much right to voice it as you would like. I think that the people that got on here just to call you a “douche” acted without class or manners, and should think before they speak (or type). However, I also believe that you calling people “obnoxious jerks” and unintelligent, brainwashed, and other names makes you look just as foolish, no matter how legitimate your argument may be. I’m not hoping you’ll change your views; they are yours as much as your name, your body, your thoughts. I only hope that you can be more accepting, not necessarily that you accept their views, but hopefully that you can accept them as people with their own thoughts, whether they are yours or not. Just because you don’t agree with a group of people does not give you the right to besmirch them and make the entire concept of theists out to be villains or illogical tacticians. That isn’t fair to anyone.
James-
for your previous offer of paying someone’s way down to Brazil, I would love to take you up on that offer 🙂 haha… kidding, sort of. Although I really would enjoy visiting Brazil sometime. I also think it would be interesting to talk to you in person.
It seems like you have really spent a lot of time and effort here on this website. I’m not saying that as an insult.
I’ll be honest, I was brought up in a Christian home. That’s not to say I haven’t had my share of doubts. I’m currently attempting to read through the Bible, you are right, it is very contradictory. But overall, I would say events in my life have confirmed my belief in God. Most of these events had nothing to do with attending Church or reading the Bible.
You are absolutely right that religion has led to many problems across the world. The thing is, believing in God really doesn’t have that much to do with organized religion. You can say I’m wrong, but, like you’re rational response to observed facts, i have observed certain truths which have led me to believe there is a God. These “observed facts” did not take place in a religious setting. Most of them were personal experiences.
You ask for examples, here is just one: I was hit by a car while biking. Call me a moron for not wearing a helmet but I wasn’t, anyway, I was hit by a car going around 50 MPH, the driver only stopped the car after I managed to smash her windshield with my body before I flew to the ground further down the road. By the grace of God, (or chance, you’re call) I landed within inches of pavement which I could have easily smashed my head on, breaking my neck. After dragging myself to the grass, the adrenaline rush masking the pain momentarily, 3 nurses and doctors rushed over. They just happened to be driving past right after the accident. Within minutes an ambulance arrived and I was sent to the hospital. To the astonishment of those at the hospital, I didn’t have any broken bones. There was not a single scratch on my face. All of this might not sound like much to you, but I believe that God, or angels or something was looking out for me that day. You can blame it on scientific probability if you would like, that’s fine by me.
Overall, I think there is one thing we can accomplish together. I’m assuming from most of your writings that you feel the world would benefit by ridding itself of religion. In a way, I agree. The problem with religion is the generalizations of it all. The problems we have seen, like the many horrible genocides, were the result of attempts to universalize a given belief system. If we can recognize the fact that each person perceives things differently, and accept the fact that this leads to variations in beliefs the world could be so different.
Kelly, thank you for your nice response. I appreciate a well-written, polite note.
About your accident, what a coincidence! On April 28th this year, I was also hit by a car. I was out for a walk and about to cross a street. I saw a car approaching with its left turn signal on and obviously slowing down quickly. I assumed (always a BAD idea) that it was going to turn. I stepped into the street and was struck in my left leg by the car and knocked to the street, hitting my head and back. I was stunned more than I realized at the time so, with some help, walked about a block back home. Do I think it was god that kept me from being hurt worse? Not at all. Nor do I see any evidence that your survival was due to supernatural intervention.
I have to think of this. At any time, there are about 27,000 children around the world dying of starvation and malnutrition. No god does anything about that. Isn’t it a bit arrogant to assume a deity would suspend the laws of physics specifically for you and yet allow all those children to die horrible deaths?
One of the things religion teaches is that yes, exactly that will happen if you believe the “right” faith and pray enough. God will also ensure victory for your sports team if you pray before the game, even though the other team is doing the same. Clearly, a sporting contest is more worthy of divine intervention than starving children.
Yes, your good fortune was the result of nothing more than being a bit lucky that time. I have personally known people in worse bike accidents that were not even scratched and hardly bruised.
I have a friend in Arizona that took a very slight tumble off his bike and would have been likely killed if not for his helmet. The helmet had some impressive cracks in it that would have been his skull had he not been wearing it. I do suspect that he was riding a bit faster than he admitted, but I don’t “know” that. What I do know of the laws of physics says it probably took more energy to shatter the helmet than a low-speed tumble could have provided.
There might have been flaws in the helmet, he might have hit in precisely the wrong position, there could have been a rock that he hit, or myriad other possibilities. Did god smash his helmet as an object lesson to him? Hardly likely. He was wearing the helmet and is an experienced bicyclist. He was working at a bike shop at the time, assembling and repairing racing bikes.
As I pointed out in my blog entry, “Flying Pharaohs” (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/08/04/84/) it’s easy to assign a supernatural explanation to anything we do not understand. That doesn’t make the supernatural true or even possible.
Thank you again for your post. It’s refreshing to read one that isn’t full of “You’re wrong”, “You have no proof”, or “you make typos, so you must be wrong.” The last is so laughable because that’s all they can think of? To me, that says more about their mental processes than I am sure they would like me to know. 😀
So James, will you really pay my way to Brazil?
Yes, I will. But you will have to be prepared to back up your insults and stupidity with your skin. I am and I am not a misogynistic jerk that thinks women should be treated as second-class citizens, too weak and trembling to defend themselves.
I have taught martial arts to many women and I never permitted them to be treated any differently than any other student. They had to work just as hard and pass the same tests as anyone else. So why should the be regarded as something less than the men?
My position was I had students of different sizes, ages, and levels. When they left the dressing rooms and lined up for class, they were all students. Nothing less.
I don’t think I ever insulted you, nor displayed stupidity. I was simply asking if I could come visit you in Brazil! So would you like to start making plans for you to buy my plane ticket. I’m working two jobs and am trying to get ahead at my university since I am triple majoring and triple minoring so I’m in summer school until the end of the month. I hope we can work something out!
Do us all a favor James, pull that stick out of your ass and find innocent children adorable like everyone else on the planet.
Sincerley, Get over it.
You are quite correct. Indoctrinating innocent children into a life wasted on lies and devotion to the non-existent should be a crime.
I respect your ideas and opinions. I do think that some things that people have posted on here were only to create controversy and just be jerks. We all need to respect each others opinions, though. I am not going to sit here and tell you that you are wrong or any other people that have commented…it isn’t my place to do so. What I will say is…some people are just out looking to pick a fight and have no respect for others. I admit that when people do have this motive I usually get offended and argue to no end. As I have seen on this website particularly, with most people as mentioned above it doesn’t get me anywhere, it only fuels my anger. I just wanted to post and say it is good to question what other people believe and for others to do the same to what I believe, but it must be done in a manner that is respectful in order to get anywhere, gain any knowledge, prove a point, etc.
Koliver: I agree about being respectful but unfortunately, there are far too many people on this site that regard respect and politeness as being weakness. If you read my posts carefully, you will notice that I generally respond to people in the same way that they treat me. Those, like you and Kaitlyn for example, that conduct themselves like civilized people receive polite replies. Those that do not get the back of my hand, metaphorically speaking. Yes, I have noted when people have been ignorant or stupid. If they don;t like that, smarten up.
As I have said before on here and elsewhere, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.”
Sadly, there are many theists, certainly not all, that react to any questioning or challenge to their beliefs with hostility and anger. When they do, I have no reservations about returning it.
At the start, I sated simple facts. There is no god and brainwashing children into believing a lie is abuse. It teaches them to stop questioning what they are told. That produces good little robots for the church and the government to control.
Elsewhere, I have stated that the purpose of religions is to allow one relatively small group of people to control the thoughts, speech and actions of a larger group. If we examine the history of religions, how they have been founded upon lies, promoted lies and exerted control over every aspect of believer’s lives, it becomes obvious.
One question, out of context I know. I noticed you always type KOliver. The capital “O” seems to be intentional. Is it? I personally have a problem with two initial capitals because of nerve damage in my left hand, the one I normally use on the shift key. As a result, it often doesn’t move fast enough and I type things like YOu by mistake. Curiously, someone here made an issue of that as if it were relevant. But, if they have no logical statements or facts that pertain to the issue, I supposed attempting distraction with irrelevancies is the best we can expect from them. 😉
Thanks again for your thoughtful, honest, courteous posts. It’s refreshing to see and enjoyable to reply to them.
To reply to some of the other things in your earlier post…
It is unfortunate that one belief or opinion can be distorted and tainted by individuals who don’t truly understand what they claim to believe. I think that is what causes so much tension and hatred between two opposing parties. I don’t want to attack any position that I have not taken the time to study and understand thoroughly. Just simply looking up a few things on the internet and flipping through a few books isn’t enough for me to tell someone that their views are not credible.
I was recently a student in a Reasoning and Critical Thinking class at the university I attend and I learned a great deal from my professor about arguments. I try to be mindful of what I learned and utilize that information whenever I am in a dispute. Many people don’t understand that they need to support their ideas with credible evidence and can’t just tell someone they disagree with opposing views on the grounds that the views are “stupid” or other faulty reasoning.
I love being ale to engage in thoughtful and intellectual debates that are not degrading to either party involved. Any other form of debate is usually unhelpful and doesn’t get anyone to the point they want to make.
I understand your frustrations. It is difficult to show respect to anyone that doesn’t show it to you first or in at all in return.
Yes, I didn’t want to put my first name. It is hard to read and pronounce correctly. So I just listen my first initial and last name.
Thanks for that reply. I appreciate it and understand why you do it. I suspected it was something you do deliberately because it is so consistent and it doesn’t appear anywhere else.
Good luck with your studies. Reasoning and critical thinking are important skills for anyone in any field. Well, maybe not theology but most other things, certainly.
lololololol it’s cute little letters to God from kids. we get it you’re an atheist. would you get this pissed over cute little letters to Santa from kids? it should all be the same to you right?
I think this is so cute to see what children have to say. But then I see all the ADULTS bantering back an forth about grammar, spelling, bad punctuation, anger meanness WOW. Sometimes I think people look for others to argue with to make themselves feel smarter and worthy of some unknown gift of winning the battle of wits! It’s sad and if you’re an atheist, what pray tell are you doing on this site….is it to spread your anger and negativity? This is a free country, free to choose free to speak free to be. BUT If your only purpose is to spread negative and unKIND feelings everywhere you go, well by all means Shut up and stay home. No one forces you to be here you CHOOSE to be here your INVITED to be here which is a KINDNESS!! Please try to spread that instead of harsh unkind words, you can be whatever you want to be and people may raise there children to believe what they want. When they grow up if they choose different well that’s there choice!
Try spreading Kindness and acceptance and maybe just maybe this world can be a better place for all our children no matter what they Believe!!JMO
Again, another net nazi telling me to “shut up” if I can’t say what she wants to hear.
No one forced you to read anything, nor did anyone but your own over-inflated ego force you to reply. You chose to here and you’re (not your) bot invited, it is an open and free site for anyone.
Children will rarely choose what they believe after they have been brainwashed from birth through adulthood. You’re proof of that.
Also remember that, when you assume the right to tell others what to do, you grant the same right to them. So don’t be surprised if someone tells you to shut up and go away.
I do spread kindness and nice words when others start the same with me. If you had read my posts to people like Kaitlyn and KOliver, you would see that.
It’s with smart-ass people like you that I will jump salty. With me, you reap what you sow.
Your a dick james plain and simple
Wow, another super-intelligent, highly-original reply. Did you think of that all by yourself or did someone help you with the spelling and typing?
Do you often make comments to people like that to their face? I think not or someone would have ripped your face off by now.
BTW, the next time you get help making comments, try to find someone that knows the difference between “your” and “you’re”. They person you used this time, is making you look like an under-acheiving fourth grade punk.
Oops, I clicked Post Comment too quickly. That should be “under-achieving”. It’s “i” before “e” except after “c” or when sounded as “a” as in Neighbor and Weigh.
No charge for the English lesson.
Yeah, James, God or no God, we’re all in this together, and being an asshole through the anonymity of this little website’s comments is getting you and your cause for the decimation of religion NOWHERE, okay?
Nick, I am sure you know more about being an asshole than I do. But I am hardly anonymous here.
Your opinion is as worthless to me as you are to the rest of humanity. No matter, I am sure it’s worth enough to you for both of us.
They are just children, all children view every aspect of the world like this, and even without religion they still learn to lie.
I agree. But parents are most often the ones that teach children to lie. Lying to them about religion, Santa Claus, and the Easter Bunny doesn’t help.
Hey man I would just like to say that I am a Christian, and I do not take offense to what you believe. It really isn’t that important and just because some does something under the name of so and so whether it be a deity or another person does not mean that they have the go ahead from that deity or person and I believe that religion has messed a lot of stuff up.(this is where my Christian comes out, just a heads up.) Jesus himself tried to show the religious teachers and Pharisees that what they were doing was wrong. I believe that there are many people that chose the religion of Christianity and take only that and only do the minimum as they see it, and then I believe that there are people who chose the faith Christ and help people. I see it in all areas and backgrounds of life whether someone chooses a religion or not, they have a choice, whether to be a jerk to others and whether to be kind and a neighbor to others. I do believe that there is a God and that Jesus came down and died for everyone’s sins not just mine or the “I am holy because I was raised in the church” but everyone’s but I also believe that we need to help others the bible says that true pure religion in the eyes of God is helping the orphans and widows. Obviously not all or many religions do that but it starts with the heart of the people. And so sir I apologize for any hurt that you have dealt by people of the “Christian faith” (whether I have the right to apologize for all “Christians” I do not care it is done) and I hope that you live a successful life. I also would like to point out the fact that I do think and that “religion” does not cloud my eyes as it does for so many others. I believe that religion is mostly traditions and are not really that great for the entire human race.
Thanks for your reply.
First I would like to remind you that I am not really anti-christian but anti-religion, all religions. So don’t take it personally.
Next, I do not have “beliefs”. That’s something theists have a problem understanding. Atheism is not a “belief” it is a world view based upon facts. Faith is a belief because it is based upon something with no supporting facts and many facts that dispute it.
I suspect that you would enjoy my blog post “Does It Matter If Jesus Existed?” (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/10/17/does-it-matter-if-jesus-existed/) Where I plainly state that the message is more important than the reality.
I also agree that religion is traditions and many of them are not good and do not lead to good results.
Thank you for your comment about my life. I do have a successful life. I live in the best climate in the world, have social and financial security, and have had several fulfilling and rewarding careers as a technical writer, martial arts instructor, sailor, and business owner.
Now, I am mostly retired and enjoying excellent health and good friends.
Although no one can prove there is a god, you can not prove there is not. So both sides require lenience in their views to understand that there are many different possibilities to the world we live in and that we will likely never know the answer. The point is not to prove either side is right or wrong, but to live together in tolerance and respect.
“You cannot prove there is not”? That’s nothing more than another lie spread be theists. The absence of any evidence alone is proof for most except the most deluded.
SO I ask, do you believe in Zeus, Aphrodite, Loki, or any of the other gods? If not, why not? Prove they do not exist.
Where is your god? If one exists, why doesn’t he show himself? (or herself, sorry, Aphrodite) At least offer undeniable evidence such as actually doing something obvious and undeniable. It doesn’t happen, never has, never will. If you wish to discuss specific gods, I am ready to demonstrate similar non-existence of them, too. Are you willing to disprove any of the others?
Live together in tolerance and respect? Considering that most theists are the most intolerant and disrespectful people in the world, you’re preaching to the wrong choir.
What’s ironic is how religion demands respect when they have done nothing to earn it. As I said elsewhere, when respect is demanded, it is an admission that it isn’t deserved, only desired.
It’s interesting you assumed I have a god. I did not state that I am on either side only that I respect both for what they are because we can not really know the answer. There are going to be disrespectful and intolerant people regardless of whatever beliefs they may have. However, I feel that despite my own beliefs I must be tolerant and respectful of others because if I do not behave that way, how can I expect others to behave that way towards me? I say this in respect to all forms of gods including those you have listed above not only to a Christian god. I also respect those who do not believe any of these gods exist and to those who are still unsure which side they take. I also find it interesting that you insist on generalizing theists as the most intolerant and disrespectful people when you are not willing to give them any tolerance or respect. I don’t believe that the point is to respect and tolerate religion, but to respect and tolerate people. When people stop trying to prove that they are right and others are wrong and start giving basic respect to everyone including those who are different from themselves, then we will live in a much more peaceful world.
It’s interesting how everything is about you. I speak in general terms and use “you” in the generic sense but you leap to the conclusion that it must be only for yourself. Get over it, it is not.
I am not generalizing that theists are intolerant and disrespectful. I am stating it as a fact. I grew up in the USA in the 50s and have a lot of experience with christians. So I do know what I am talking about.
Tell me, how many atheists have told someone they are doomed to eternal punishment for not believing as they do? How many atheists have bombed medical clinics or murdered doctors because they perform abortions?
How many atheists have shunned, abused, or murdered people for their beliefs? When have atheists tried to pass laws to force everyone to engage in atheist practices?
I admit I have avoided doing business with companies that have the little fish in the adds or are overtly religious. That’s simple self-protection. I know that not every person that is a devout believer in some religion is a dishonest. But I have been cheated enough by “good god-fearing folks” enough that I am certainly extra cautious about them.
I totally agree with you about respect and tolerance. I wonder when the Christians, Muslims and Jews are going to start doing that? I’m not holding my breath.
I am 13 years old and was never introduced to God by my family. I never went to church as a child. My family are christians but not active ones. Yet, somehow, i still found a way to believe in and love God. I pray every night because God talks to me in little things every day. I’m not saying, you can’t believe what you want, go ahead, don’t listen to people who are yelling at you for believing what you do. However, i do disagree. I love God, i don’t fear him. He helps me in my daily life. I don’t want to shove my religion down your throat, but please don’t shove yours down ours.
First, I am sorry that you have fallen into the delusional lies of religion. Curiously, I was 13 when I came to the realization that all religion was fake and meant for nothing more than to allow one small group of people to control the thoughts, actions, and speech of a larger group. So maybe there is hope for you, yet.
God does not talk to you. That is another mental process called “talking to yourself”.
One more i. I do not have a religion. “Atheism is a religion” is one more lie spread by theists. Atheism is not a “belief” either. If atheism is a religion, then not playing baseball is a sport and not collecting seashells is a hobby. Get it?
No one has said that you personally are “shoving religion down my throat”. But that is what theists do in many ways. If you look around you with clear thinking and an open mind, you will see evidence of it every day. Laws pushing religious beliefs, public money used to promote religion, religion permitted special privileges such as no taxes, and freedom from criticism and questioning. The list could go on for a long time.
When have I shoved my knowledge (not beliefs) on anyone? Have I said you MUST become atheist or suffer an eternity of torture? Have I tried to pass any laws gibing atheists special privileges such as religion enjoys? If you think carefully about it and read what has actually been said, you will see that everything I have posted is the truth.
The evidence of that is no one has been able to show that it is not true. Many have complained, as you are doing. Many have told me to shut up because free speech and critical thinking are fatal to religion. But furnish independently verifiable proof that anything I have said is not true? Not one person has done that. Most simply dodge the question and pretend it was never asked. That’s much easier than thinking.
It doesn’t matter what sort of religion or non-religion you subscribe to. The person by the preposed name of James Smith is trolling. Just let it stop, he’ll enjoy being the smartest person here, and will continue on to troll other religious posts.
Gah, you’re just as bad as the freaking fundie trolls on the atheist sties.
while i agree with you on this front, this is neither the time nor place. i find this as amusing and cute as i do quaint.
I am a troll.
*troll grin*
Posting under the name of another is a certain sign of an asshole that needs to be banned from ever using a computer again. What a cowardly little worm you show yourself to be.
These are very cute. I love the innocence of children.
Hey James, thanks for all the yummy comments.
These made me smile so much I had to read them twice 🙂
I too am directing this toward James.
You say you don’t like it when Theists try to force their views upon you. I have seen none of that by anyone here except you.
You came to a website that had some cute little sayings by children and attacked the blog and it’s content with YOUR views and you’re doing it to the others here also. You are NOT allowing them the same freedom you claim to believe in which is to believe the way they want.
I’m a Christian and proud of it and I never force my views on anyone but I will be praying for you for both wisdom and tolerance as those are things you’re surely lacking.
He’s complaining because it’s EXTREMELY unlikely that those children came to the idea of God on their own and through their own mental reasoning. Their parents inflicted their views on the child. The child has neither the mental capacity nor the confidence to argue even if they do feel what they’re being told is wrong.
Indoctrination (in my eyes, and likely James’ based on his posts) is child abuse, pure and simple.
Child abuse? This is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard.
Religion is the dumbest thing and yes, brainwashing children IS child abuse. You may not like it, but facts are facts whether you or anyone likes them or not.
Child abuse? It is our job as parents to teach our children while they are young what is right and what it wrong. My views are that the christian way is right so i will teach my children that. It is then my child’s responsibility to test those views for him/her self when he is old enough to make an educated decision. Not teaching and educating my children is neglect and wrong.
Just as i am sure you will teach your children your views if you have not and by your reasoning not teaching them about God is child abuse..have you thought of that?
“It is then my child’s responsibility to test those views for him/her self when he is old enough to make an educated decision. ”
So you admit a child’s mind is not intellectually capable of questioning your views? Meaning that the child has no choice but to accept your view as fact or incur your disapproval?
You said it yourself, children aren’t capable of making the educated reasoning, so you could tell them ANYTHING and they would believe you.
Personally, I don’t think it’s a good idea to tell a child about a God who does not judge others based on the totality of their actions, but rather by what they profess to believe. I spent many nights as a child in tears grieving for family members and people who were “burning in hell” for simply not believing.
Mr Brent Beach, It seems that if we went by your views, everything we teach our children would be some form of “indoctrination.” Should we let them roam free, doing whatever their little hearts desire? You admit that a child is not intellectually capable of making an educated decision about what is right and wrong, and you think that they should be given no direction? What would civilization be like in 100 years?
First of all, I’d like to state that I don’t think it’s possible to raise a child without “giving direction” so I doubt I could be asserting that. Now, I’m not against presenting information to a child, quite the opposite. It’s when people snap at their child for questioning the existence of God, or scaring them with tales of burning agony in a lake of fire, gnashing of teeth and so forth that I call it child abuse.
It took me 18 years to realize that I didn’t need to be afraid of hell anymore. It took me 18 years to realize that a just god would not hold it against me that I did not believe in him. How I wish the idea had never been told to me.
How afraid I was, just a boy, picturing his mother burning in a lake of fire for not going to church on Sunday, picturing his sister’s burning flesh screaming for help while I resided up in heaven, because I had chosen the right path. I remember thinking: maybe better to be in hell with my family, than in heaven with God. Any god that would take one of my wonderful family member’s to hell for some finite crime or for something like not believing, is no god I wish to worship nor be with.
Wow, I don’t know what kind of terrible person told you things like that when yuo were a child but, I do agree, it was horrible to say anything like that to a child. My father is a pastor and always told us that heaven is a wonderful place where all the troubles of the world are forgotten. When someone died, we never assumed they were going to hell because of what they believed at the time of death. we simply prayed for them. You never know what a person believed when they were younger, and I was taught that salvation is an eternal thing, never to be lost by how you change your mind later in life.
I also noticed in an earlier post that you mentioned that you were taught that God judges people based on what they believe rather than how they lived their lives. But there is still a judgement day, where everyone answers for everything they have ever done, good or bad. Belief in Jesus Christ gets you a seat in heaven, that’s true, but even the ones that make it there have to answer for their actions. The sins may be payed for, but it doesn’t mean you are off the hook.
I swear that I am not trying to preach to you, I just want you to see that the horrible things that were told to you as a child does not apply to all Christian families, or any other religion for that matter. Children who are scared into believing in God things tend to grow up skeptical about religion in general, and hateful towards people who “walk the path of righteousness” I guess you could say. So I do agree with you, that children should never be snapped at or punished for questioning anything they are told, instead people should sit their children down and explain to them why they believe what they believe and never ever use it to scare them.
No one ever told me my mom was going to hell, it was my thought. They told me what it took to get into heaven, and my mother did not fit those criteria so I “knew” she was going to hell. I began examining every person I knew by these criteria to determine if they were going to hell. I cried for all of them, even the possibility was too much for me to handle.
I definitely don’t think that my experience and reaction is reflective of the majority, but I do believe that what I was told WAS reflective of what most people were told.
My parents (nor the pastor involved) had no way of knowing that I would react that way, as I’m sure they told it to me the same way they would’ve told anyone. However, I did react badly and I hope to keep my future child from suffering similarly.
If I were to teach my child about Christianity, I would omit the necessity of belief to get into heaven as I’ve never found that to be a just rule. People often are unable to choose what they believe. For example, people from the middle east suffer ENORMOUS social pressure to stay Muslim, and because there are so few dissenters, the fact that everyone around them believes reinforces the belief all the more! These people have no chance of accepting Jesus, and an all-loving god would not begrudge them because of their place of birth.
In my eyes, being a good person should be the only requirement for a seat in heaven.
Thank you for your reply! I’m happy to know that there are those who will be more careful in what they tell their children. I can tell that you really read what I wrote and thought about it too, which is honestly the most I could ask for. Thank you!
We may disagree on what to believe but I can tell you genuinely care, which is so valuable and so little seen; So, I’m satisfied!
I don’t mean to offend any Muslims when I say this, but I completely agree on that point. That is one culture where people are sucked in as children and I imagine there would be a lot of pressure from their family all the way up to the government to stay with it. I myself have no problem with Islam, but the way the Middle Eastern countries go about enforcing the faith is terrible. There is no choice, and without a choice how can their truely be any faith?
I’m glad we were able to have this discussion Brent B. It’s nice to be able to air your opinions without being judged or attacked for them. 🙂
Abuse? Parents “indoctrinating” their children is actually just parents passing on what they believe to be true moral values to their children. Religion is a big part of peoples’ lives, and it needs to be addressed in every household. When a parent tells a child anything, they usually believe it. This applies to religious and atheist households alike. That doesn’t mean that this will hold. There are plenty of children who were raised in religious households that become skeptical of the institution and of the beliefs, and subsequently renounce their faith and claim themselves to be atheists. There are also those who were raised in atheistic households who later discover “G-d” and can sometimes become devoutly religious. Asking a parent not to teach a child about G-d if they believe in him is like asking them not to teach children not to steal; it’s nearly impossible for a child to find their own set of morals and beliefs without being guided by their parents.
Tell me exactly how I have been “forcing my views” on anyone? Have I demanded that anyone do as I say? Have I insisted upon passing my views into law? For that matter have I said that anyone here has been forcing their views on me?
Wwat I have said is that theists do these things consistently and that brainwashing of children is child abuse. Yes it is. Theists don’t think it is because it is their sickness being forced on children. If I demanded that their children were thoroughly indoctrinated into worshiping Ra, Zeus, or Aphrodite, they would be demanding my head. But, being hypocrites is as ingrained in theists as is delusional belief in a god.
Yes, I have thought about what my children believe and I taught them to think for themselves and believe what the evidence and rational thinking led them to believe. I taught them to question everything, including what I told them. I hope that is at least part of the reason they are happy and well-adjusted today.
You teach children christianity? Have you thought about whether that is something true? If you actually read the bible, as I have, and thought about what you have been taught in an objective manner, you might reconsider your decisions ans beliefs. I personally don’t care what you believe as long as you are not one of those trying to vote your religion and force those beliefs upon me.
Dee, you’re a liar. Yo DO force your beliefs on others and you are doing it here. You are essentially telling me to shut up. That’s typical of christians. Free speech is only for them so they can jam the christian lie into everyone without others being permitted rebuttal or criticism of christian ravings. But then, “hypocrite” and “christian” are semantically equal.
Finally, those may be “cute children’s sayings” to some. But to rational people they are evidence of brainwashing and child abuse as much as if they were complaining of “bad touch”. I wouldn’t expect theists to understand that any more than they understand truth and rational thinking.
James….By your reasoning it’s child abuse to teach a child that their parents will always love them because as we all know some will disown their children. It’s child abuse to teach a child to dream because dreams don’t always come true and they get shattered. It’s child abuse to teach a child to hope because in this world there is no hope.
You call everyone here arrogant, ignorant and stupid when they disagree with you yet you are do nothing but repeat the same arguments over and over.
You are here not to force your beliefs on others but to stir up a heated discussion and debate and doing it poorly in my opinion and YES this is my opinion just as your spouting and rinse repeat tactics are yours.
That’s the nice thing about a free and open internet. Anyone can express their opinion. Even when it is as illogical, uninformed, and ignorant as yours.
If I repeat the arguments, it’s because people of limited intellects are unable to grasp the point on a single explanation.
I am NOT here to stir up anything but to simply express my opinion. I do respond to people when they reply. First of all, it would be rude to ignore people, no? Second, I reply in a similar manner to those addressing me. If they are polite and rational, so am I. If they are rude and arrogant, I have no problem stating that. What many mistake for insults are nothing more than statements of observed fact. If anyone doesn’t like the statements, change the facts that led to them.
Yes, it’s child abuse to brainwash children into mythical beliefs. You ignored my example of what if someone were indoctrinating them into something else. Ignoring statements you can’t or don’t want to answer is am easy way of convincing yourself you have made a point when you have done nothing at all.
Om nom nom, was hoping to get fed twice from one person.
@hungrytroll That’s exactly the type of intelligent, well-thought out, rational comment I expected. Just another internet moron thinking he’s clever but really being a half-wit.
I love the way so many avoid replying to my questions and direct statements except to say they don’t like them. No reason, that would require thinking and maybe even (gasp!) research for facts (omigawd, facts!)
That’s how people get to believe that “god did it” for everything. It’s far easier than thinking and trying to understand truths. I call that being an intellectual and ethical coward. I see it every day.
You people have become boring. YOu aren’t even original enough to think up decent insults, much less be entertaining with your nonsense. I’m outa here. All of you ego-challenged people that need the last word to feel like a real person, have at it. I’ve had enough amusement from the back peddling and weak excuses.
“statements of observed fact.” It is impossible for you to say that teaching children about G-d is brainwashing and call it fact. Facts are pieces of knowledge that cannot be disproved through logic (i.e. the sky is blue, the sun sets in the west, rises in the east.) The classification of something as “brainwashing” is completely subjective. The issue of brainwashing is an ethical one, and almost all ethics are subjective, even within a society. One example is assisted suicide: some believe that it is the patients’ choice what to do with their lives, some people say it is wrong to take someone in such an unnatural fashion. Call the debate logical all you want, but there are clearly visible emotional motives hidden under the arguments on both sides. If the human race was purely logical, then everyone would come to the same conclusions and there would be no strife. Alas, that’s not the case.
L, Brainwashing is an established fact and the techniques are well-know. Let’s examine some.
The same information is repeated many times.
The information is not permitted to be questioned.
It most be repeated by rote many times by the subject.
Peer pressure is applied to make the subject conform.
Do any of these sound familiar? It’s exactly how children are indoctrinated into religion. So brainwashing is a fact. You may not like it, but it’s still a fact.
True the human race isn’t logical. You demonstrate that well enough to satisfy me on that point.
James, just a quick question. Yes, brainwashing is real, but let’s review the facts.
The same information is repeated many times.
Is that like you saying that theists are typical, illogical, abusing children along the way?
The information is not permitted to be questioned.
When people present arguments, you simply state “a typical Christian dodge…” or whatever, and just feed it back into a negative state of mind.
It must be repeated by rote several times.
Most people on here have said the same thing over and over against your arguments…
WAIT! I’ve got it!
You’re trying to brainwash people into further believing in their religion!! Got it. Makes WAY more sense now!
Exactly, Dee…I didn’t see anyone forcing opinions on anyone either.
Cute post! Kids can be so cute : )
Wow, totally wasted a few mins of my life reading all those silly back and forth comments…anyhow, I LOVE the original post! Very cute!!
This is so cute! Love kids 🙂
I love these! They’re so cute!!
The 2nd kid is so right even if there isnt a “god”, we live forever.
haha.. those are cute. I love kids and how their little minds work 😉 so innocent! Thanks for sharing.
I thought this was really cute and then unfortunately I started reading the comments. @ James, there are some things that you should just keep to yourself. You’re not making any friends here.
Keep to myself? In other words, I don’t like what you’re saying, so just shut up. You have no coherent replies, so proof that I am wrong, so it’s just shut up! How typical of those with no intellectual capacity to debate. Freedom of speech is only for those that agree with your delusions?
What makes you think I am interested in making friends with anyone on here? I have plenty of friends that are not delusional jerks that demand agreement or silence.
You have an opinion, that’s great. I never said that you were right nor wrong. I just think the way that you approached the subject and have basically called everyone who has tried to explain their point of view to you a moron. And sorry, what delusions? I just find it unfortunate that you have taken something that was meant to put a smile on someone’s face and I can’t speak for everyone else, but you definitely ruined it for me.
Who has tried to explain their point of view? Not one. What most have said is “Shut UP! We can’t reply logically with facts, so just shut up!”
The delusions, as I have very plainly indicated, OK, maybe not plainly enough for you, are religious beliefs. If people were espousing that kind of nonsense on any other subject but religion, they would be shut away where they could receive treatment. But religion has been sheltered from criticism for so long that most people accept any insanity as being reasonable.
I’m sorry if I ruined anything for you unless it is your belief in religion. Then I did you a favor.
Tell me. what evil person forced you to read any of it? Did they have a weapon? A gun, knife, club, or just use the threat of physical violence? No matter what method they used, you have legal recourse. If they made you sit in front of a computer to read when you wished to leave, that is technically kidnapping on most jurisdictions. YOu don’t have to accept that klnd of thing, have them arrested!
Everyone wants you to shut up because every one of your posts starts with an insult. No, you’re not getting your point across because everyone just finds you to be rude and ignorant.
Jessica, clearly, you only read what you want to read. Every one of my posts do not start with an insult. Try reading some again, not hoping to see something you don;t like. Also, what you view as insults are no more than simple statements of observed facts.
If I am rude and ignorant, what are those that tell me to shut up? Or those that say I am a piece of shit? How about the person that posted under my name? But maybe you have two standards here? One for me, and a far more generous one for those that you like. I have the same standard for everyone. Those that reply in a polite, rational manner get the same treatment from me. Perhaps you have heard of the concept “Do unto others…”?
I don’t expect theists to understand my point. As Dr. House said, “If you could reason with theists, there wouldn’t be any theists.” Or another thing I understand is that, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.” That doesn’t mean I will denied the right of freedom of speech. Nor does it mean you have to reply or even read my posts. All of that is your choice. It’s called “free will”. Maybe you have heard of that, too? I know it’s a slippery subject for many religions but it does exist and you are exercising it now.
Try thinking about it.
Please excuse any typos here. I have a dog on my lap because he is terrified of fireworks and people are setting firecrackers off here right now.
The dog cant hear the fireworks, because you have already talked it’s ear off 😀
Sure, you have the right to say whatever you want. There is, however, something of an unwritten code about which things should be said when. When this unwritten laws are breached, the perpetrator has to face the consequences.
(If you claim to be ignorant to this, think about something for a second: if an overweight person asks you if they are fat, would you say yes? Or would you keep your mouth shut to avoid offending them? I think that is one of the dangers of the internet: people become too honest for their own good because of the lack of immediate retribution. An example of this is all the new suicides stemming from cyberbullying)
Hey James, if you’re still reading I’d just like to say…I love you. Let God fill your heart and maybe it will grow three sizes by Christmas. Or not. ‘Cause really, God can’t do that (maybe heart edema or something could). However, I do love you because you were able to prove that DFTT (Don’t Feed The Troll) is still not a universally accepted comment policy, something which I have been pondering for weeks.
You say you’re out of here, but please don’t leave. For the sake of internet comment sections everywhere, come back so we can contain your, er, “unique views” here and avoid contaminating other sites. For our children, the same children who wrote these letters to God, please come back 🙂
Teehee, apparently, you have a comprehension deficit. I’ll type slowly so you can understand. There is no god.
DO you mean the same innocent children that were born without their minds being contaminated with the lies and sickness of religion?
You don;t love me and you don’t love anyone else. YOu are far too arrogant in your own “faith”. All you wish to do is prevent disagreement and contain those who are able to prove their points when they disagree with you.
Hey James baby, found your comments elsewhere
http://www.geekfill.com/2011/05/24/the-best-zombie-tattoo-ever-pic/
Why didn’t you listen to my advice dear? I told you not to contaminate other places…though to be fair you commented there earlier. And yeah, I am an arrogant bastard (guess that makes us a perfect pair), but not b/c of God/god. I’m arrogant because I know who and what I’m dealing with…a person hunched over their computer typing away negative remarks sites they stumbleupon hoping to get some angry replies. Not from me though, I’m fine just throwing any websites you comment in this here thread for a good laugh when I’m bored. 😉
I may owe you an apology. Apparently, I have said something that led you to think I care about what you think. If I did, I am sorry, I never meant to give you that impression. The thoughts of a total fool like you are never significant to me.
You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.
As always, you ignore the real issues because you have no rational reply. Instead you make pathetic attempts to distract from your own failings by introducing non-applicable items.
Doesn’t it bother you at all that you show up as a hopeless mental defective every time you post? Maybe not, you keep doing it.
You miss me?
You don’t need to apologize, just imagining the sound of your haggard whimpering as you beg mother for five more minutes on the computer to write to dear old Teehee is enough apology from me. But, *sigh*, fine I’ll play the game once:
“You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.”
Not true, I’d reveal myself to be a worthless moron no matter who you are! Honesty is the best policy.
“Instead you make pathetic attempts to distract from your own failings by introducing non-applicable items.”
Lol, you spelled pathetic wrong. It’s spelled j-a-m-e-s.
“…as a hopeless mental defective”
Well now, I like the sound of that. I will now and forever more be: Hopeless Mental Defective Man! (cue fanfare, but not too much or else cuts off the announcer saying my name. But it has to be just enough or…actually lets move on) You may address me as Mr. HMD Man. Sir. Yes that’s better, Mr. HMD Man Sir. I shall not wear a cape, since Edna from The Incredibles made it quite clear that is a baaad thing to do. But no tights either, because that’s frackking ridiculous. I mean, Superman was cool but I’d rather be light and airy down there when flying at supersonic speeds around the world, amiright?. What jobs shall I do? Maybe you can help me? I don’t have many superpowers, or really any talents (recall my awesome superhero name), but I’ve got a big heart. I will stand on the roofs of houses and scream down useless advice to the passerby. I will also ghost people and make farting noises behind them. Who am I? I’m the hero you don’t deserve, and definitely don’t need. I am…Mr. Hopeless Mental Defective Man. Sir. Gonna take a while to get used to that title 🙂
Before you told everyone “to stop reading for what isn’t there” or “looking at what isn’t there” or however you nonsensically wrote it. So, when one girl said you were rude and just insulted everyone and you denied it.. thought i’d just tally up your lovely comments for you here.
I may owe you an apology. Apparently, I have said something that led you to think I care about what you think.
Doesn’t it bother you at all that you show up as a hopeless mental defective every time you post?
You do not know whom you are dealing with at all. If you did you would not continually reveal yourself to be a worthless moron.
You behave like a typical theist; arrogant, dismissive of others, and a general all-around jerk.
Fuck it, too many in here. Just stop– everyone has a religion and passes it down to their own kids. Later in life when they’re older, they have the free will to continue to believe in what they’ve been taught or find a new religion or decide to believe in nothing. Either way, it doesn’t concern any of us posting on here.
I maintain my appreciation for little Larry’s letter.
I never said I didn’t insult people. I said I made simple statements of obvious facts. That these may be seen as insults are not my problem. Apparently, it is OK with you that people insult me, but you are such a two-faced jerk that you don’t like anything I do.
Everyone does not have a religion. There have always been people that have been rational thinkers. The founding fathers of the USA are some that come to mind. Despite the constant lie christians tell that the USA was “founded on christian principles by the the christian founding fathers,” it isn’t true. They can tell that lie all they want. It is still a lie.
Also, not everyone is able to overcome the brainwashing they had as children. If they could, religion would have died out long ago. But if, it makes you feel better to believe your nonsense, go ahead. Just stop voting it into laws and stop expecting taxpayer support. All religions should pay their share of taxes like any other business and stop freeloading on everyone else.
Again, just because some moron like you says something, that doesn’t make it true.
Yes, that is an insult, but it is also a fact. You are a moron and shouldn’t be permitted around rational people. There are institutions for mental defectives such as yourself.
Well that’s not very nice. I actually never insulted you sir and I am certainly not a moron. You don’t even know if I’m atheist or Christian or Jewish or anything else. No, not everyone has a religion you’re right. Everyone has something they believe in though, like you don’t believe in anything religious, that’s still believing something. That comment was really all it took for you to assume that I need to be in a mental hospital, huh? Like most of the other commenters on here? Geez, you’re a fiesty one aren’t ya.
Here’s another mistake you make: you assume that religious people are all completely irrational. But look at Einstein. He was probably one of the most influential physicists and mathematicians, yet he believed in G-d. Your statement “Everyone does not have a religion. There have always been people that have been rational thinkers.” is what i was referring to, in case you’re going to pull the “you’ve got no evidence” argument. Also, the founding fathers, though they may have not been christians, at least some of them are said to be deists. Here’s an example of a website describing Thomas Jefferson’s Deism: http://www.nobeliefs.com/jefferson.htm. He believed in a G-d, yet he was still very rational.
Here are also some einstein quotes, in case you’re interested. http://www.spaceandmotion.com/albert-einstein-god-religion-theology.htm
I love you James. So does Jesus.
You do not. There is no jesus and never was. I have demonstrated that here several times and not one person has shown that I am wrong or denied that what I said was not true.
You don’t love me, you simply spout a lie because it sounds good in the fantasy world of your beliefs.
Do you love Satan? If you believe your religion, Satan is also one of your god’s creation and “the most beloved of the angels”. Then is he not as worthy of you love as any other creation? Just because he “fell from grace” is that a reason to not love him? If you apply that bit of hypocrisy, how can you love anything not of your faith?
The obvious answer, given the observed behavior of christians, is you do not. It is only another cover-up for your genuine feelings.
It is much easier to live with the delusions than the truth. It’s hard to admit to your real feelings, but a lot more honest.
One more thing, what you said is very offensive to me. But offending people has never worried theists.
How about if I were a devil worshiper and said I would “sacrifice a couple of babies to Lord Satan for you”? Would you be offended?
“Jesus loves you” and “I’ll pray for you” is equally offensive. If you want to do something for me, do something that works; send money. “One pair of hands working is more effective that a million clasped in prayer.”
I’m sorry it offended you, but I speak what I believe, just like you.
Also, I do love Lucifer. I believe Lucifer’s fallen grace is symbolic of people and the evil that does reside with us. No, I am not a Satanist, I just believe that even the most broken of creatures deserves to be loved.
You don’t have to believe in Jesus! That’s okay. If you live your life differently, believe differently, speak differently, that’s totally chill! And if you wanted to sacrifice babies, that’s your own doing. I’m not saying I would kill anything, so I don’t see how that is really a logical analogy, but sacrificing babies would probably lead to some legal trouble for you and I don’t think you’d care to much for that.
Oh and you can’t judge how I feel. Like you told several other posters, you don’t know me. :).
I know you don’t care if you offended me. After all, you have the only possible truth on your side, don’t you?
You give a lot of lip service to love, but I am certain you never gave loving Lucifer (Bringer of light) a thought until I mentioned it.
Like most theists, you seem to be incapable of understanding the difference between “beliefs” and facts. Beliefs are a viewpoint with no supporting evidence. Facts are items with independently verifiable evidence. Gravity is a fact. You can drop a rock on your foot and it will fall every time with the identical, predictable acceleration. Jesus is a belief. There is no supporting evidence. Not one contemporary account of a jesus character exists. The first mention of any jesus is in the gospel of Mark, written from 40 to 100 years later, depending upon which biblical scholar you believe.
The Romans never mention anyone like jesus. Someone that was supposed to have such influence, socially, politically, and religiously, performed miracles, and was tried and executed had not one word recorded about him. That’s rather strange when you think about how well they kept records of everything else of note. Look up Attis, Horus, and Mithra. Then you will see how the jesus myth was “borrowed” to be used to bolster a new religion with old fables.
I thought the site was about cute letters written to god from children that make you giggle why does someone have resort to bible bashing? =\ Its adorable and you are killing it =\
If I am killing religion and the child abuse of brainwashing children, then I am making the world a better place. Furthermore, I am doing it without hiding behind a fake ID.
Exactly what have you ever done that you can point to with pride?
“Making the world a better place.” you know damned well that no matter what you type on here, no one will leave this website with their opinions changed in the slightest. Starting arguments and infuriating honest, good people who are just looking for a laugh is hardly an improvement. And how the hell do you know what people have or have not done? You can’t judge a person’s achievements by comments they post! You say that you stick to logic, but you’re being as insulting as the next guy.
Yes, I am being insulting to you. But you have earned it, deserve t and I am not one to cheat you out of it.
If you wish to make the world a better place you can improve the average IQ of the human race and the general ethical standards of the world. Go jump off a cliff.
I see now, we have all earned it while you are completely immune to blame and have been completely rational all this time.
Insulting my IQ does nothing to help your point because it is not a point, it is just an immature jibe at my intellect, which i am comfortable with. I would retort with a similar insult, but it seems like everything you hear that does not line up exactly with your beliefs must be written by someone inferior, and therefore warrants none of your time.
I stopped reading this for a while, and realized how absolutely ridiculous this discussion is. Reply as you may, you can even tell yourself that you’ve won out with your amazing, god-like intellect and have put us sheeple in our place for all i care. I will be deleting any reply emails I get. Good riddance.
L, insulting your IQ is almost impossible to avoid. It IS the point. I am sure you are “comfortable” with it, you must hear it a lot.
I hear many things that do not line up with my thinking. Kaitlyn, for example. The difference is, I respect her as an honest, sincere person. even if I do not agree with her on many points, that doesn’t mean that she is inferior, it means we see things differently.
If you had been reading my post, you would have noticed I have other religious friends, not all christian, that I mentioned on different occasions.
If I never gain hear from someone as mean-spirited and ignorant as you, it will improve my life. There are others on here that I enjoy discussions with. You are not one of them. Please go away, far away.
oh quit it with the ‘not hiding behind a fake ID’ you’re still on the computer nimrod. you’re still behind the computer like everyone else posting on here, congratulations for putting your smiling face and name. who cares
Apparently, you are still seeing only what you want to see. No surprise there, at all. I did plainly state that anyone that wishes to stop hiding and confront me face-to-face, I’ll pay there way here. Then we shall see who is hiding and who is not.
I especially extend this offer to you. What’s your excuse now?
Come on down and talk to me like you do on here. I’ll still be smiling.
What else are you saying there was to see with that comment?? I never commented on your insane offers to fly someone to Brazil, just that you retort a lot with ‘you’re hiding behind a computer.’ Sure, I’ll come to Brazil then, would you like to discuss my trip? You look pleasant enough, I’d like to have a little chat about God and no God. I appreciate your special offer to me! Let me know when is good for you, in all seriousness. I have some vacation days I would like to use. I still maintain that I am not particularly offensive, so I’d probably still call you a nimrod in person sir. Which is fair since you called me a moron previously. 🙂 Let me know!
All you have to do is send me your information via my blog or Yahoo Messenger (slrman420) and I will buy you a ticket here.
You talk to me in person the way you do in here and you will have a “life changing experience”. Do not expect me to be so stupid as to send you a ticket that you can cash in and keep the money. It will be an electronic booking only refundable to me.
Again, you cannot comprehend accurately what you read. I didn’t call you a moron, I said you WERE a moron. That you cannot comprehend the difference demonstrates the accuracy of my statement.
Also, you are the one that made an issue of typos. Or did you conveniently forget that, too? I know I have pointed out such errors in others, but it was always in passing, not the entire point of my post. But you must not be able to understand that, either.
Were a moron, are a moron, whatever dude. You are still harping on things like that. I also never made an issue of typos myself, so not sure where you’re going with that one. You also previously said “what’s my excuse now?” implying I previously had an excuse, which I didn’t, so what were you referring to dear sir? So please don’t try and be nitpicky with me about tenses and whatnot. I also did not infer that typos were the point of your post, just that you made the point itself at one point. Geez, touchy aren’t we.
Regardless, what information do you need from me? I am fine posting it here. I have no desire to contact you privately and having you be rude on another platform, so let me know what info you need and book me that ticket! I do however, think you are stupid to make such an offer to a random stranger on the internet. I could be a crazy person. Or someone trying to get a free vacation and never come to meet you. Or as you said, cash in on a ticket. Can’t wait to see you in Brazil! I expect a return ticket as well, obviously.
PS I have seen you mention this “life changing experience” multiple times so far. What are you referring to mister? Please do explain so I know what I am getting myself into, thanks!
I will need your real name, address, telephone, passport number, and departure city. You will need a Brazilian Visa. That’s $100 for Americans. I cannot pay that for you, but I will reimburse you.
The ticket will be one way, but do not worry. Your return flight will be taken care of either by the airlines or the consulate, whichever is the current agreement regarding deportations. After your fine is paid you are not likely to be held any longer by Brazilian authorities. At least that has been the case before.
I am not concerned about you never coming, I can then get a refund on the ticket. YOu have no intention of coming anyway. The life-changing experience will be what happens after you talk to me in person the way you have on here. Your life will be different. Your thinking, walking, talking, and appearance will all change. YOu will not be the first.
If you were half as smart as you think you are, you’d find out who you’re messing with. I’ve given places where you can find out who and what I am, but most don’t want to know. Better to maintain your illusions than to expose yourself to the truth.
YOu also are the one that made a big deal out of typos. So your own posts show that you are a liar. If not, you are so far in your own delusions, you are unable to separate them from reality.
Yes yes, you’re a big health buff who knows martial arts. That is quite impressive, United Fighting Arts Federation? Nicely done sir. I’m not messing with you, simply engaging in some good old conversation. I still have not been all that disrespectful mister, especially considering some of the nastier comments on here directed towards you. So is that supposed to be a threat sir? And assuming I’d be deported hm? You are the strangest person sir. And yes, I’m assuming most people do not go researching people they are butting heads with on a public forum such as this.
Again, just for clarification good sir, I did not make any big deals out of typos you have made, although they were plenty for being somewhat of a journalist. I called you out once simply on criticizing someone else for them after berating another who previously corrected you. I am truly offended you have confused me with other posters :/ So no, I am not a liar and I am not delusional 🙂
Speaking of which, what delusions do you speak of sir? Again, we have not really argued anything over atheism or theism. I was expecting to fly out there to have some pleasant conversation over Brazil or your work for IBM.
” I didn’t call you a moron, I said you WERE a moron.” What the hell does that mean? I see no difference. If you say there is one, please explain it.
@L To quote Louis Armstrong, “If you don’t know, can’t nobody tell you.” I’m sorry for your problem, but all you are doing is confirming what I said.
@ Stumbled Yes, you did make a big deal out of typos. YOu had two entire posts devoted to nothing else. That you think otherwise is a delusion of yours. That’s what I meant by that.
No, we will not have a pleasant conversation here or anywhere else. Your focus is upon making me look bad by pointing out typos and evading the issues. Why should anyone expect to have a pleasant conversation with someone who only want to do that?
When non-citizens here are arrested, deportation follows after they have paid any fines or other penalties. Many countries are like that.
No matter, we both know you never had any intention of coming anyway.
“entire posts” make it sound as if I wrote novels, however, they were not. So get over it. It’s cool, I’ve been sarcastic this entire time, if that little gem went over your head. My focus was never to make you look bad. It was to point out some hypocrisy on your end. I’m not avoiding any issues at hand, because I never got involved in that to begin with. And you’re assuming I’d be arrested, that itself is a little ignorant yourself sir. And fuck no I never had any intention of visiting you. I’d have to be as crazy as you are sir! You will probably respond with some retort you think is clever or right and call me a moron yet again, but I vote that you step out of your mom’s house for a breath of fresh air! Adios senor! I hope one day when you die, and you decompose in the ground and help a tree grow, they print the bible on your pages! 🙂 Thanks Dane cook for that routine.
@sutmbled No, “Entire posts” does not sound like a novel. It means exactly what it says. A post with no other subject but one. But to you, things mean what you want them to mean, don’t they?
I understand sarcasm much better than you. “Sarcasm is a natural reaction to stupidity.”
Exactly what hypocrisy were you pointing out? Or is that another accusation without proof? You will define anything as being what you want, no matter what the facts, so let’s hear your definition of anything I have said as being hypocritical.
Assuming you would be arrested is not ignorant of me. It is based upon experience with the one other person that actually showed up. You really know very little of me and what I am here. Maybe you saw the movie “Fast and Furious V”? Vin Diesel had a line in there to Dwayne Johnson. “You’re a long way from home. This is Brazil!” It’s my home and I know how it works here.
Yes, you would be arrested, charged with assault, jailed and fined. I knew from the start you never had any intention of visiting me. I recognize internet bullies and cowards when I see them.
YOu call me crazy but complain that I insult people? That’s really crazy, but no worse than I expected from you.
Leave my family out of this, you arrogant piece of shit! My parents are both deceased and you even mentioning them is insulting and rude.
When you die, there will be an increase in the average intelligence level of humanity and a bog lean in the decency level. Go hide now, little boy. Or as W.C. Fields said, “Go away kid, you bother me.”
Your argument is that of many of the 7 year olds at the camp at which i volunteer: they pretend to know something, and if another child asks them what it is they retort “if you don’t know, i’m not gonna tell you!!” upon further investigation, they are revealed to have no idea what they’re talking about. Congratulations, you are about as mature as a 7 year old.
Well look at you making assumptions! As I said before, I was all for some pleasantries in Brazil. You can’t base all future experiences based on one previous Sir Angry. So yes, you have to admit, it’s pretty baseless to assume and forewarn against being arrested. I congratulate you on your quality taste in movies, I myself have never indulged in the fine Fast and Furious series, but if someone of your caliber saw them, well they must be excellent! Dude, I’ve already spelled out for you some little hypocritical moments of yours in previous posts. I’m not rewriting any because you’re too lazy to go back and read.
I’m actually a girl. Yet another wrong assumption. Baha, I love this make the troll angry page! I heard moms jerk trolls off after they make them sandwhiches, must be a sweet deal over there in Brazil!!! Ciao bambino!
@James LOL God made you an idiot
And if there were god, it made you an arrogant coward that hides behind a false ID to insult others and not bother to back up your claims with any evidence. But then, that’s what religion is about, isn’t it?
I don’t ask that you pay my way to Brazil. I do however ask for your home address and phone number. I can pay my own way.
Done deal.
Contact me either on my blog http://www.slrman.wordpress.com or Yahoo Meesenger (Slrman420) and I will give them to you.
My cell is (83) 8721-2630 The country code is 55.
So now what? Going to send the Texas Rangers after me?
ROFLMAO. Jasmine talked big, but when I came through, she became strangely silent. I was expecting a visit or at least a phone call. But noooooooooooooooo. 😀
ROFLMAO OMG LOLLLLLZZZZZ BFF4EVA LMAO!!!!
of course no one wants to visit a crabby old man in brazil!!!!!
Or, like you, is so terrified there is no way you’ll come within a hundred miles of someone that is your superior mentally, physically, end ethically. Given those criteria include just about everyone, you must live in a cave somewhere.
This “crabby old man” would love to see you confront me in person. We both know what the condition of your pants would be afterwards. Even the TSA would decline to search you. LMAO
But James, when I said we should arrange for me to come visit you, you never responded either….
YOu have everything you need to respond, my Yahoo Messenger ID, my cell phone, my blog, what do you want? If you can’t figure anything out from all of that, you shouldn’t be traveling alone anyway.
Then there is the visa for Brazil. They have standards and if you can’t figure out what to do from all of that, I doubt they would allow you in the country anyway.
If no-one else takes that ticket, I will, there’s not much chance of my actually meeting up with you as there are so many gorgeous friendly people that your offer of intellectual conversation about the existence of a God and purpose of religion may seem a little boring…
Also, how much spare time do you have? You seem to be spending a lot of time writing here…why not go for a walk and appreciate things outside of what you and others believe. I manage to get by without it ever crossing my mind.
FYI, I do walk every day. It’s part of my daily exercise routine. I do more each day than you probably do in a week.
When you are doing 1,000 push ups every week as I do, then you can make your snide little comments about “go for a walk”.
Yes, there are plenty of friendly, gorgeous people here.
I didn’t offer any intellectual conversation about the existence of god. There is no god so how can there be an intellectual conversation about it?
Believers reject any evidence or logical statements to the contrary and do not want to discuss, but to lecture.
I offered people an opportunity to talk to my face in the same insulting, outrageous terms they do on here. You will note that the same number of people have accepted that offer as there are that have proven that anything I have said is not true. (Hint, it’s a digit between 1 and -1)
One more thing, theists have beliefs. That’s accepting something with no supporting evidence and in spite of contrary evidence. It’s also called “faith”. I have knowledge gained from examining facts and independently verifiable evidence. That is nothing like beliefs. Not to worry, many people have a problem understanding the difference; mostly those with a lot of beliefs.
I am a religous person. I go to temple, I am a Bat Mitzvah. However, I do not believe in G-d. I interperate the torah as a story book filled with lessons I can use in everyday life. I believe in peace. I except other religions and do not try to convert others. I belive what i believe and pray the way i pray for me. James, you should believe what you believe for yourself. Dont try to change others minds because in all acuality, their beliefs doesnt change your life. Life how you want to live, but don’t try and make others cator to youre beliefs.
Good for you, Sarah. How refreshing to hear from someone that is honest and rational.
But, if you don’t believe in god, to who or what do you pray?
You say I should not try to change minds? But that’s what all theist do, proselytize constantly and try to pass their beliefs into law and force them upon others. All I do is point out the fallacies in religion and the flawed thinking of those who support it. For that, I am vilified, threatened, and told to “shut up”. Yep, that’s really religious love, tolerance, and kindness. Not to worry, I am accustomed to that as well and none ever responding with facts and verifiable evidence.
“point out the fallacies in religion and the flawed thinking of those who support it.” That is EXACTLY how debating works: you point out the flaws of an idea and show them to the opponent in the effort to change their mind. You can no longer say that you are not trying to change minds.
I think it’s wrong to associate crimes and evils in the world with religion. If religion did not exist, the crimes would continue. PEOPLE do bad things, religion does not act on its own. People may use religion’s name to justify themselves, but that doesn’t mean all religious people are that way.
And I was taken to church and taught the bible as a child, yet I am not religious today. The basic principles of religions are appealing to teach your child. It can’t be wrong to want your child to treat others well, to not lie or steal or cheat, which is what most religions teach. Whether they want to continue that faith when they’re older is up to them.
I have a lot of issues with Christianity, but I think it’s wrong to bash other things just because you don’t share that view.
Bad people do bad things. Some of them just happen to call themselves Christians. Christians cannot be blamed for the faults of society.
Good people will do good things. Bad people will do bad things. But for good people to do bad things takes religion. All you have to do is think about it. DO you think people would have bombed family planing clinics without religion? DO you think people would allow their own children to die of curable diseases if not for religion? Those are only two examples, but please think about it.
Yes, religion can be blamed for the things it causes people to do. Like it or not, that’s a fact.
I mean, some of those are just moral issues, not necessarily religious ones. I don’t think that conservative views stem only from religion. And those are extreme cases; I don’t think it’s fair to write off religion based on a small percentage of extremists. That’s like saying all Muslims are Al Qaeda or whatever.
I agree that many of these are moral issues. But religion claims to be the only source of morals. If you grant them that, then they are responsible for all moral issues. If the do not claim the moral high ground, then they must agree that one can “be good without god”. They can’t have it both ways. But they try that anyway.
I do not write off religion because of the extremists. I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly. Despite the number of times even I have personally challenged anyone to provide proof of any religion, not one person has ever done so. I am only one man. Imagine the countless others who have asked for verifiable proof and have been ignored.
No, not all muslims are Al Qaeda. But how many have stepped forward to denounce it?
“proven repeatedly”? oh, do tell!
Yes, proven repeatedly. That’s why I said you ARE a moron. I rest my case. Thank you for once again, proving it for me.
Forgive me, i was referring to this quote: ” I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly.” Prove that one for me, if you are so damn sure it’s true.
Forgive me, i was referring to this quote: ” I write religion off because it is all a lie. None of it is true. That has been proven repeatedly.” Prove that one for me, if you are so damn sure it’s true.
I think that this is adorable. That it is sweet to think that kids can still have something to believe in. To think that these people believe that all the world is not cruel. Whether you believe in God or not, these people do and they trust in Him to make everything better. Don’t steer them to believe that the world is cruel and then we die. Whether there is a God or not, there’s more to life that cruel people.
We could teach children to believe in love, honesty, kindness, fairness in dealing with others, and helping those less fortunate. That would be a lot better than lying to them about what does not and never has, existed. The things I named do exist and have real value to everyone.
Who said to steer children to believe the world is cruel? Not I. Maybe someone who tells them they must obey some arbitrary and contradictory rules set down thousands of years ago or be condemned to an eternity of torture and agony. That sounds pretty cruel to me. Why teach them fear and trembling when hope and love are so much better?
Believing in a G-d does not mean believing in a rule book that he supposedly wrote a few thousand years ago. There are plenty of deists, who simply believe that the world could not have been created without some sort of omniscient force driving it. And just the use of the word G-d doesn’t mean that a person is a devout catholic. When someone says something mildly stupid, do you not sometimes say “oh my god” just because that’s the expletive you hear others using?
Adorsble posts, I enjoyed them 🙂
James, it is unfortunate that your ego blinds you from inapporopriate approach you have taken to innocent pictures. Do you yourself and everyone else a favor and put all of your opinions into a book. Write it all down, let the ignorance flow. Then those people in the world, who actually care what you think, can indulge all they want.
It is unfortunate that you project your own over-active ego on others. Do yourself a favor and stop reading. No one is forcing you to do so.
I could take the same tactic as so many on here have with me and tell you to just shut up. But I am not like that.
FYI, I am working on another book. Called “Conversations with Christians.” I’ll probably include a few of the things from this thread. Not just the hateful ones but the thoughtful, considerate ones, too. I know there are many, like you, that would prefer to demonize me and make me out to be a despicable person, but I am fair and honest. That’s a lot more than I can say for many on here.
James, as a fellow atheist that has tried to encourage theists to question religion, it is not worth the effort. Ignorant people cannot be changed, it just makes people hate you for no reason other than you disagree with them. However, I applaud you for your efforts.
This is directed at James, but there was no reply button so hopefully he checks this.
I’ll be open and honest and say that I am a Christian. And reading through what you have said, I feel that your opinion of Christian’s is based solely on how you have been treated by some “Christians” in the past. I understand that you disagree with our beliefs, and that is perfectly fine, you are entitled to your beliefs as we are entitled to ours. Obviously I can’t speak for those Christians that hurt you, but I promise that there are Christians out there who are grieving for you that you have had such awful experiences with “us”.
That being said, you have to realize that it is not CHRISTIANITY that is evil. If you have read through the Bible as you have said you have, (especially the words of Jesus) you will see that His teachings are about being kind to the grieving, brokenhearted, the widowed, the poor, etc. You cannot blame the fundamentals of the faith for the mistakes of those who supposedly follow it. People are by nature, greedy, power hungry, and selfish. Whether they claim to have the Holy Spirit in them or whether they think that the idea of the Holy Spirit is laughable. You have made a lot of generalizations about “theists” and innumerable logical fallacies. Although you claim to be looking for an intellectual conversation, you have not even ONE TIME defended YOUR beliefs. All you have done is insult and attack people who believe differently than you do. I am not saying that people on here have not done the same to you, that’s the thing about this all, no matter what side you’re on, there will always be people who do not behave the way they ought to. I’m sorry for that, and I’m sorry (in advance) if anything I say offends you, because I do not want to do that. I just want to defend my beliefs. Take it as you will.
Firstly, you mentioned the great evils of the church, such as the crusades and witch burning and the sort. Yes, that is evil, and terrible. As has been said numerous times however, that was not the problem of the beliefs of Christianity, that was the sin of the imperfect humans who got too big for their britches. But even the Bible has things to say about the hypocrites of the church (Romans 2:24 – The name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you).
I will be honest about the sins of Christianity– First we have The Crusades, Anti-Semitism in the Christian Era (perhaps the biggest proof that it is nothing to do with the faith of Christianity and everything to do with those claiming it), the Inquisition, the wars of religion, Salem witchcraft trials, many televangelists (who prey on people who are having weak moments), and social evils in general. When you add up all of those deaths caused by people claiming Christianity, you get about 17 million lives within the past 2,000 years. Yes, that is an unbelievably awful amount, but rather than looking at it as men doing evil BECAUSE of Christianity, you have to look at it as in SPITE of their Christianity.
Since I have been open about the sins of the church, I feel that I now have the right to do a comparison. Obviously if I went into more detail, I could write a whole book. So I’m just going to give names and numbers. Mao killed about 72 million people from 1948-1976, Stalin killed about 40 million, Hitler is responsible for 15 million (not including the deaths from the war in general), and then if you throw in other killings from atheistic or totalitarian states as a result of atheistic ideology, you get a number of more than 130 million in the 20th Century alone. So, if atheistic ideology has killed over 113 million more people in 100 years than “Christians” have in the past 2,000, I feel that it is either time to start being just as hard on yourself as you are on Christians, or leave the Christians’ past in the past.
People who claim to be Christians are by NO MEANS perfect. I know that there are some who get on their high-horse and claim to be all knowing and that they do know wrong and that they are perfect, but that is not what BIBLICAL Christianity is about. If anything, Biblical Christianity is acknowledging just how depraved we truly are and how there is no way that we can be anywhere near perfect, but that for some reason God loves us enough to do something about it. I’m not saying that Christians believe that we become perfect after being saved, I’m just saying that we believe that we are forgiven for it and we should try to not sin anymore.
Those are my beliefs, and honestly I absolutely love theological debates… I can definitely (intellectually) keep up with any atheist, using my own thoughts, science, and history. But I figure that keeping on one subject was enough for this response.
But as I have said, I do not believe that I am perfect, I do things wrong almost every day, I lie, I’ve stolen, I’ve hated, I’ve gossiped. All of that is wrong, I am not under any delusions that because I call myself a Christian, I am perfect and don’t do anything wrong, because I DEFINITELY do. But I’m just saying that it’s not CHRISTIANITY that is at fault for my failures, it’s my own. The church is full of hypocrites, I have met many and every time I sin, I am one. But atheists are too. That’s what we are asking YOU to acknowledge.
This is just a suggestion, since you have read the Bible, I’m assuming you are not against Christian literature. And since you’ve said that you like to consider honestly every argument that is presented, I think you should read the book “What if Jesus Had Never Been Born?” by D. James Kennedy and Jerry Newcombe. I read it like, 3 years ago and if I remember correctly, it’s just dealing with everything that you have said is wrong in the church from a brutally honest point of view, I think you would appreciate that because I think you feel that Christians like to brush their failures under the rug, this book doesn’t do that. I don’t remember if it’s the type of book to try and convert, honestly that’s not my goal, I just want you to read a book on Christianity that is honest ABOUT Christianity. So yeah, that’s my suggestion!!! I hope you have a great day and I hope I didn’t say anything to offend you. I just wanted to defend CHRISTIANITY (but not the sins of Christians). =)
Well said. Thank you.
Sure, you’re using the “No true Scotsman..” argument. Then you admit that people do bad things in the name of religion. I hope you realize that most of them would not consider you a “true christian” either.
A book that is honest about christianity. That’s exactly what I have been doing all my life. Christianity is indefensible. It is founded upon lies and hs been continuing to lie to this day. Here’s some reading for you. Look up Horus, Attis, and Mithra. You’ll see where the jesus myth was taken from. Also, think of this. There is not one contemporary account of any Jesus.
The first mention of any jesus character is in the Gospel of Mark. That was written from 40 to 100 years after the “facts”, depending on which scholar you believe. Isn’t it strange that the Romans, who otherwise kept excellent records, make no mention of someone who was supposed to have has such an effect politically and socially, performed miracles, fed the multitudes, and all of that?
It’s as if no one ever hear of George Washington unto the late 1800 when a biographer suddenly came up with a life story about a colonial who defeated the most powerful nation on earth and became the first leader of a new nation under an new political system. Think about it.
Actually, Jesus is mentioned in Gen 1:26 when God is saying to His son to make mankind in their own image. I believe you had said He had said that to Adam in an earlier post, however, he was created in Gen 1:27. So God was talking to his son, Jesus Christ. The first time people remember the actual name of Jesus being written in the Bible is in the book of Matthew 🙂
This debate is about the existence of G-d in general, not whether or not he sent his only son to pay for our sins.
By the way, Hitler was a Christian and used his religion (Catholic) as part of the foundation for his hatred of Jews. That Stalin/Hitler/Pol Pot arguments is a very tired christian argument. None of these people did what they did because they were atheists (if they really were) but because they were intent upon suppressing what they regarded as threats to their power. Hmm, that’s what I see on here with all the “just shut up” people. They want to suppress me because the view me as a threat to the power of their beliefs to delude people.
So they call me troll, and much worse. Maybe Stalin et al learned their methods from theists?
First of all, I am definitely not (or at least wasn’t at the time) one of the “just shut up” people. I was very interested in having an intellectual conversation with you, but you have just shot that in the foot by being rude and condescending although you had no reason to be.
Second of all, those people that I listed were secular humanists, and the theology of secular humanism is, you guessed it, atheism. I am just going to say now that, I personally find you to be the single most irritating human being I have ever encountered. I would be more than willing to have this discussion with you, but you are so arrogant that you feel that you are 100% correct and everyone else is just out to get you. That is not the case, most of the people here would probably be perfectly willing to talk with you, because unlike you, most people enjoy having stimulating conversations. But you are so arrogant and rude that you think you are right and the rest of the world is wrong (and although what you said about other atheists is somewhat true, I’m pretty sure that even they would be embarrassed by you). And also, if you would have READ what I wrote, you would see that I was, in fact, disproving what you said. So maybe if you “read what was there instead of what you wanted to see” you would have seen that. But I guess that was too much to ask. With that being said, I am going to argue my point with as much love as I can possibly dig up from the depths of my heart… and just leave this. Because I am pretty sure this is the most futile discussion I have ever witnessed or been a part of.
Ok, so about what you said about Jesus. Even though most HONEST scholars now-a-days do not deny the existence of a man named Jesus (where the debate comes in is what Jesus actually was), I will present you with a link (although, I’m not convinced you would read it), because I’m not going to waste as much time as I did yesterday writing something out that will go in one ear and out the other.
http://www.gotquestions.org/did-Jesus-exist.html
So, as you can see, the MAN Jesus definitely did exist. I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you can be open enough to look at history as it was. Given that Jesus ministry was only 3 years long and was extremely centralized (he had a very small place of ministry), it seems very odd that over 2,000 years later, the biggest religion (with 2.1 million, followed by Islam with 1.5), and still has not been disproven. I know that you will say that it has been, but honest historians, archaeologists, and scientists have been able to go to the middle east and do actual research in the places of the Bible, and have found that the Bible is actually amazingly accurate to history. In fact, Christianity has been the starting point of many discoveries. I won’t even get into that because the list goes on and on and I feel like it would be a waste of time with you. But do you not find it interesting that all of those Christians that existed in the time of Jesus were willing to die, painful, excruciating deaths… for someone who supposedly didn’t exist? Or the fact that history has been split in two… because of someone who didn’t exist? I think it is very foolish and dishonest to have yourself so deceived that you can’t even admit that Jesus was real. To me, you are doing exactly what you are accusing Christians of, hiding your face from the truth. I’m not even asking you to admit that He was the Son of God, I’m just saying, have enough integrity to admit that the MAN was real.
And with that all being said, even if you don’t want to admit that any of the above is true, you can at least have the intellectual honesty to admit that Christianity (true Christianity that is) has had an amazing, POSITIVE impact on the world, dare I say it? Scientifically. Here’s why I can give the credit to Christians, because I know that you will deny it if I don’t… you probably even will once I do… but oh well.
Science obviously originated with the Greeks, who were trying to find an answer to their questions that did not include God. But they never came up with anything like modern science. The reason modern science did not develop with the Hebrews was because the natural world was simply there to give praise to the Creator. It could not have come into existence with the Arabs because of Islam. Although they had Aristotle’s writings (which were quite scientific), Arabs never created any real science because of the fatalism dominating Islam… it would be pointless because ‘all things are unchangeable.’ Modern science could also not come from the animists of Africa or anywhere because they would not have experimented on the natural world. It couldn’t have come from the Buddhists or Hinduism because they believe the physical world is unreal and there would be no reason to learn anything about something that’s not real. So, that leaves Christianity to introduce modern science in the 16th century. The reason Christians would have been willing to do anything is because we believe that God is a rational God who would create a rational creation.
And before you say anything about how the Catholic church treated Galileo, they issued a public apology for their censure of him. So. Don’t even go there.
Anyway, here is a list of all the things the Christians contributed to science, so that you can at least give us SOME credit where credit is due.
Antiseptic surgery, Joseph Lister
Bacteriology, Louis Pasteur
Calculus, Isaac Newton
Celestial Mechanics, Johannes Kepler
Chemistry, Robert Boyle
Comparative anatomy, Georges Cuvier
Computer Science, Charles Babbage
Dimensional Analysis, Lord Rayleigh
Dynamics, Isaac Newton
Electronics, John Ambrose Flemming
Electrodynamics, James Clerk Maxwell
Electromagnetics, Michael Faraday
Energetics, Lord Kelvin
Entomology of Living Insects, Henri Fabre
Field Theory, Michael Faraday
Fluid Mechanics, George Stokes
Galactic Astronomy, Sir William Herschel
Gas Dynamics, Robert Boyle
Genetics, Gregor Mendel
Glacial Geology, Louis Agassiz
Gynecology, James Simpson
Hydrography, Matthew Maury
Hydrostatics, Blaise Pascal
Ichthyology, Louis Agassiz
Isotopic Chemistry, William Ramsey
Model Analysis, Lord Rayleigh
Natural History, John Ray
Non-Euclidean Geometry, Bernard Riemann
Oceanography, Matthew Maury
Optical Mineralogy, David Brewster
So yeah, there’s a list. I got that from the book I recommended that you read… but you had a sassy comeback, proving to me that you really are not willing to do anything that you’ve told us “spoon-fed Christians” to do. You are the epitome of a spoon-fed person. Think for yourself. Once you have read the books and actually looked at the history, science, archaeology, etc. THEN you can sass at the Christians for being ignorant. Because you are honestly the most unwilling, ignorant person I have ever come across. And don’t say that I am a “just shut up” person, because I would have loved to have a civil conversation with you. You are the cause of everyone’s poor attitude at you. I don’t hate you for “speaking the truth” because you haven’t even SPOKEN a word of truth. You’ve spoken insults and what you want to believe. I am not intimidated by you…just extraordinarily irritated.
First, I never said YOU were one of the “just shut up” people. You take umbrage where none was given. But perhaps you know your own inner thinking better than I do?
Next, to not make a post as long as yours, let me cover a couple of things. Just because the bible is accurate on some well-known historical points doesn’t mean it is truthful about everything. I could tell you a long involved fish story and state it took place on a lake known to exist and from a make and model of boat with a specific motor. Al of those things could be true but it wouldn’t prove I was even there, have ever fished, or that anything else was true.
I can show that the important parts of the bible are not only untrue but impossible. The fable of Noah’s ark comes to mind. Just for a sample, there is no way a craft of that size could hold the millions of animals needed to have “two of everything”. Nor has any wood vessel of that size been built that did not fail with the first reasonable sized waves it met. Then, the provable fact that there is not enough water on the planet to cover the entire earth and drown every living being. But people believe that nonsense without considering if it were possible.
Finally, the fact that some people that were at least nominally christian have done some good things means what? That they did these because they were christians? Not hardly. But christians like to believe that atheists do bad things because they are atheists even though there is no evidence to support that. It’s just another convenient lie for the religion.
I haven’t spoken any truth? The reason you think I am irritating is because I have spoken the truth and neither you nor anyone else has proven that I have not.
You don’t want a civil conversation, you want to preach.
As far as everyone’s attitude, it is what I expected. Theists always become angry and hostile when anyone dares question or criticize their cherished delusions. I always am amused by this and think of the Bard. “Methinks they doth protest too much.” Exactly as you are doing.
DO I hate religion? No, it it too ridiculous to hate. DO I hate the things I see being done in the name of religion? Any rational person would. Children being allowed to die from curable diseases so they can be “Prayed to health”. People being murdered for doing things “against god”. Hate being preached because of someone sexual orientation, or lack of beliefs. All of those are done because of religion.
As has been said, “Good people will do good things and bad people will do bad things. For good people to do bad things takes religion.”
James, first of all, I really do want to apologize for everything that I have said that has been offensive to you. It was wrong, and although you do not believe in my God, I do and I believe I am supposed to act according to His character which is Love. I haven’t and for that I am sorry. Please don’t say anything offensive or anything about me being delusional. Just because you believe something to be fact does not mean that you have to say it out loud.
As much as it pains me, I decided that it would be best for me not to even bother responding to what you said. Not because I could not defend my beliefs or give logical, verifiable, well thought out answers, but because I have read through your comments enough to realize that I will never be able to persuade you, and you will never be able to persuade me. That’s really the only reason I didn’t. If you knew anything about me, you would know that I can have these discussions for hours and hours and hours with people who disagree with me. I honestly feel though, there is much more here than just your atheism. I don’t know what it is and I’m not trying to get it out of you. Feel free to keep your past to yourself (if you want to share it, that’s ok too, I just want you to know that I’m not trying to force you).
I truly wish that you could hear my tone of voice when I say this, because text always makes things seem much worse than they were ever meant to be… but honestly, this is the most sincere, heartfelt apology I think I will ever make. I am sorry for the things I’ve said. I know I said that already, but I truly am. I’m sorry that you have been so mistreated by people claiming to be Christians, if I remember correctly, you said something about physical abuse. That is wrong and awful and I’m so sorry you had to go through that. If atheists beat me up or yelled at me or called me horrific names, I am pretty sure I would feel the exact same way towards them as you do towards us.
I’m really trying to word everything in a way that does not give any offense, or set you off on something, because that is truly not my intention. I thought when you were saying things about how you wanted a discussion that you actually wanted a discussion. I believe (this is me truly saying my beliefs, not trying to be antagonistic) that a discussion between two people who disagree is each person taking their turn and discussing the inconsistencies in each other’s logic. I would have been very willing to ponder the things that you were saying. All that I asked was for the same in return.
You make blanket statements about “theists” and how they do not think for themselves and how you cannot reason someone out of a conclusion they did not come to using reason… but you know nothing about how ANY of these Christians came to their beliefs. You definitely don’t know mine, and I’m offended by your statement. The reason I started studying worldview stuff so adamantly 4-5 years ago is because I was not only questioning Christianity but the existence of God in general. I was very open to both sides of the argument, and Christianity is the conclusion I came to. I am not the only Christian like that, there are MANY of us. I wish I could remember his name, but there’s a very famous Christian preacher who was a devout atheist who made his life’s goal to disprove the existence of God, and during his research he became a Christian. So, perfectly logical people can be Christians too.
I’m not saying that perfectly logical people will never be atheists either, I’m just saying that you cannot assume that you know everything about every theist in existence.
The problem with this is that you cannot prove or disprove God’s existence. The thing about science is that for the scientific method to work (hypothesis, theory, law) you have to be able to do experiments and repeat things. Neither side can do that for the claims on the existence of God. So really, (technically) both places are in the hypothesis stage. I’m not just saying atheistic views, even Christian views. Everyone has the same data, it’s just the lens you look at it through. That’s all.
Anyway, I’m not going to comment again, because as I’ve said, this is useless because I am as devoted to my beliefs as you are to yours. That’s fine with me, nothing I can say will change your mind, and I don’t want to. You can live your life believing what you believe. That’s fine with me. All I ask is that you practice some kindness when dealing with people. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
Honestly though, I really do genuinely believe that you have good intentions… you’re just aren’t executing them correctly.
I honestly hope that you have a really great day and that everything is well with you. I also hope you believe that I mean that and not just saying it to be a brat… because I’m not. =)
Another thing James, honestly, I was very excited about this. Worldview stuff is my passion and I have spent the past 4-5 years studying it in great depth and I legitimately love to engage in these sorts of conversations. My current attitude towards you has nothing to do with your beliefs and my not being prepared or having an answer for the things that you say, and everything to do with YOUR attitude and your unwillingness to converse. Honestly… you have said nothing that was true, you have been exceptionally hypocritical (you complain about Christians shoving their beliefs down your throat…what have you been doing this entire time?), You have insulted our intelligence to no end, and so far, I have only seen people do that to you in retaliation for the cruel things you have said to them. You have used many logical fallacies (rather than just saying that you disagree with Christianity, you call it rude names and insult it to the very core). You have given no reasons why you believe what YOU believe and why people shouldn’t believe what they do.
I feel that if you want to have some integrity, and have people really consider what you say, you need to give real points, not talking points. you’re like a politician. You have what you want to say, and nothing anyone else wants to say can get you off of it. You need to engage in what is actually being said. You’ll find that maybe these people aren’t as idiotic as you think.
It is perfectly fine for you to disagree, and no one is saying that you need to change your beliefs, just change your method of coming at it! You get insulted and offended when people say things harshly, but that is all you have done. Expecting to be treated any differently is very hypocritical. Even Jesus was brought to anger. No Christian is anything like Jesus, but if He even got angry, obviously us sinners will be even more swiftly brought to anger.
You’re allowed to have your thoughts and you’re allowed to express them, no one is telling you to shut up. People just want you to be civil when you present your arguments. Seriously… I have a stack of books taller than my bed sitting next to me because I wanted to have this conversation, I didn’t want you to shut up. I wanted to have a civil debate. You were uncivil. That was YOU. I didn’t react correctly in my last comment… you made me very very angry. I’m still angry at you. But I should not have insulted you, that was rude and I apologize. Please forgive me. But my point about YOUR attitude and YOUR way of reacting to the things people say still stands. Please reread everything that you have said. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for how you handled things.
I agree with you friend with everything. It’ll all be okay in the end so do not fret. 🙂
So according to your logic, if a group of atheists started killing people in the name of no God, you would start to believe in a God to do the opposite of them?
How is that logic by me? It is your own delusions at work again. I am amazed that even you can be that stupid. Yes, that IS an insult. One you richly deserve.
I prefer to kill in the name of no Thor.
Actually, hitler is more often pegged as a social darwinist, not a fanatical christian.
Maybe you feel better saying that, but it simply is not true. Many quotations from Hitler show him to be a devout christian. One of his stated purposes was to eliminate eliminate atheism.
By his own edict, school prayer was required every day. Your “social darwinist” is just another theist lie. It is also a rather silly lie as it is so obviously untrue. But being silly or obviously untrue doesn’t seem to bother you, does it?
Please back up your claims? Because Hitler got rid of the Bibles and replaced them with Mein Kampf. If you can back up your claims, that’s fine, but you can’t just say things that are not true and then expect people to believe them. If they ARE true, then you can back them up no problem, and must do so if you want people to believe you. =)
Kaitlyn, here are some direct quotations from Hitler. He never “got rid of the bibles and replaced them with Mein Kampf” Saying things that aren’t true without backing them up? That is exactly what you did with that statement.
Here’s some of Der Fuher’s own words, for you.
“My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them.”
-Hitler in a speech on April 12, 1922.
Hitler made similar remarks in his book, “Mein Kampf”, which was written when he was young. So he must have changed his mind and lost sight of his faith later, right?
“The National Government will regard it as its first and foremost duty to revive in the nation the spirit of unity and co-operation. It will preserve and defend those basic principles on which our nation has been built. It regards Christianity as the foundation of our national morality, and the family as the basis of national life.”
No, that isn’t from a modern day, Republican speech; that’s what Hitler said in a statement in 1933.
And even more surprising was the Nazi banned book list; Darwin’s “On the Origins of Species” and any book deemed to support evolution it were on it.
“The most marvelous proof of the superiority of Man, which puts man ahead of the animals, is the fact that he understands that there must be a Creator.”
“Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith.”
– from a speech Hitler gave on April 26, 1933.
Did I mention that school prayer was mandatory under the Nazis? If I wanted to commit the logical fallacy of guilt by association comparing Hitler’s beliefs in a Christian nation, family values, creationism, and school prayer to America’s modern Religious Right, this would be an ideal opportunity for it. But that would bring me down to their level. Oops. Guess I already drew the parallels. Oh well.
In his own words, Hitler was a devout Christian and he was a Creationist.
“For it was by the Will of God that men were made of a certain bodily shape, were given their natures and their faculties.”
– Hitler in his book “Mein Kampf”
So why aren’t we told about Hitler’s enthusiasm for Jesus in America? After all, it’s common knowledge in Europe. Funny how there’s little to no mention of Hitler’s religious beliefs in the average school curriculum or documentary, while we learn at length about Hitler’s other beliefs.
Economics and politics played huge roles in the Nazis coming to power. But so did religion. Anyone who denies or ignores that fact is enabling a repeat.
Finally, the faithful might argue that Hitler was not a real Christian. Although the average German, will readily tell you that Hitler was. And given Hitler’s statements, I think it’s safe to assume he would argue that he most certainly was a Christian, and that’s the important aspect. Because whether Hitler was a Christian in someone view or according to their definition is beside the point; the point is that, as someone who believed in a god, Hitler was not an atheist.
Need more? I have plenty.
All of these are quotes from Adolf Hitler:
Night of 11th-12th July, 1941:
National Socialism and religion cannot exist together…. The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity’s illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity…. Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things.
10th October, 1941, midday:
Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure.
14th October, 1941, midday:
The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death…. When understanding of the universe has become widespread… Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity…. Christianity has reached the peak of absurdity…. And that’s why someday its structure will collapse…. …the only way to get rid of Christianity is to allow it to die little by little…. Christianity the liar…. We’ll see to it that the Churches cannot spread abroad teachings in conflict with the interests of the State.
19th October, 1941, night:
The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity.
21st October, 1941, midday:
Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism, the destroyer…. The decisive falsification of Jesus’ doctrine was the work of St.Paul. He gave himself to this work… for the purposes of personal exploitation…. Didn’t the world see, carried on right into the Middle Ages, the same old system of martyrs, tortures, faggots? Of old, it was in the name of Christianity. Today, it’s in the name of Bolshevism. Yesterday the instigator was Saul: the instigator today, Mardochai. Saul was changed into St.Paul, and Mardochai into Karl Marx. By exterminating this pest, we shall do humanity a service of which our soldiers can have no idea.
13th December, 1941, midnight:
Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imagine nothing more senseless, nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery…. …. When all is said, we have no reason to wish that the Italians and Spaniards should free themselves from the drug of Christianity. Let’s be the only people who are immunised against the disease.
14th December, 1941, midday:
Kerrl, with noblest of intentions, wanted to attempt a synthesis between National Socialism and Christianity. I don’t believe the thing’s possible, and I see the obstacle in Christianity itself…. Pure Christianity– the Christianity of the catacombs– is concerned with translating Christian doctrine into facts. It leads quite simply to the annihilation of mankind. It is merely whole-hearted Bolshevism, under a tinsel of metaphysics.
9th April, 1942, dinner:
There is something very unhealthy about Christianity
27th February, 1942, midday:
It would always be disagreeable for me to go down to posterity as a man who made concessions in this field. I realize that man, in his imperfection, can commit innumerable errors– but to devote myself deliberately to errors, that is something I cannot do. I shall never come personally to terms with the Christian lie. Our epoch Uin the next 200 yearse will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity…. My regret will have been that I couldn’t… behold .
So, I guess he was a man of contradictions.
actually, Hitler was ANTI catholic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%27s_religious_views
and tried to endorse his own version of a white Jesus…..
LOL. I am more amused at how this conversation continues, if you skim through the monster of a comments page, I think all readers and posters got the message of this discussion long ago….except for one
Oohh, Wikipedia. Such a reliable source of information!
Hitler was a Catholic and had the support of the Catholic church. I even have a picture of of a group of cardinals and other church officials giving the Nazi salute. Adolph’s henchman, Mussolini, was the one that made the deal establishing the Vatican as a separate state in return for church support.
FYI, the reason there are a lot of “official catholics” in Brazil and other places is the church refuses to take anyone off their roles without a specific written request. Even if a person has not taken any part in the religion for decades, they are still counted as being “catholic”. They would list Dawkins and Hitchins as catholics under that policy.
On the other hand, they will excommunicate a doctor for performing an abortion to save the life of a mother. The mother will also be excommunicated. This has happened even if the fetus was clearly a danger to the mother and unlikely to live in any case. Nothing like choosing death over life, is there?
IN that particular case it was even more silly because, with the mother alive, she can have had more children to be turned into good little catholics. Very clever, these priests.
You can also check out my reply to Kaitlyn, above this. But maybe you wish to create your own facts. That’s really what faith is all about. Anyone is entitled to their own beliefs. But not to their own facts. Think about that, if you care for some mental exercise.
You need to check my reply to your reply. I’m definitely not denying that he said those things, just don’t deny that he said the quotes that I have either. Like I said, a man of contradictions.
Kaitlyn, I do not deny your quotes, either. You point out that Hitler was inconsistent, contradictory, and a hypocrite. Do you need any further proof that he was christian? Those three items certainly do it for me.
See? That’s the kind of thing that is unnecessary. Just because someone is hypocritical or inconsistent does NOT mean that they are a Christian. I know some Christians are, but assuming that someone is a Christian just because of that is a logical fallacy. It’s like saying “All dogs are mammals, therefore all mammals are dogs.” It does not work. And I promise, no Christian is saying that Christianity needs to be abolished unless they’re not really a Christian.
Kaitlyn. Growing up in the 50’s, I have probably been exposed to more christians than you. Even though I have friends that are christians, some quite good friends and close relatives, I have never known one that was not inconsistent, contradictory, and hypocritical. Not one, not ever.
I am certain that somewhere, there are some that are not. But we have to go with the evidence. If every person you met in your entire life with green eyes was a liar and a thief, even though you knew there must be some that were not, how would you feel about green eyes? You you be suspicious of them until proven otherwise?
“Not really a christian” that’s the “No true Scotsman” argument again. How many people do you think would consider you, “Not a real christian” because you didn’t agree with them on a particular point? I am sure that the members of the Westboro Baptist church would look upon you with disdain as not being a “real christian”. Maybe you feel the same about them?
Your “All dogs are mammals…” statement is the circular reasoning I see far too often. I based my comment upon observed evidence, not circular reasoning. I even agree that there must be exceptions. But I still have to go with the percentages, as I am sure you also do. That’s only good sense. Would you download a file on your computer from a source unknown to you, given the frequency of virus attacks? I doubt you would even though you know that some must not me malware, but the odds are not in the favor of that, are they?
These are adorable. The comments that follow are hilarious. I don’t see any harm in keeping religious views to ourselves and just enjoying these “letters.” Keep the debates to the websites created for that reason and off here.
Oh good, another “shut up” person. If christians kept their views to themselves and didn’t vote them into laws for everyone, there would be no problem. But they do and they want to demand respect and freedom from criticism, taxes, and everything else. So they will have to expect people to protest anywhere and any time they like. You don’t have to read it, you know.
You are generalizing Christians here and just a couple paragraphs up you were angry about someone generalizing Atheists. Throughout all these posts you have only proven yourself to be a hypocrite the exact quality you seem to despise so much in “most Christians” you meet. Unfortunately you are so blinded by your closed mind and arrogance you can’t admit it. One day I believe you will stand before your maker and be corrected and humbled and extremely saddened for your mistaken beliefs.
She actually didn’t tell you to shut up, she just told everyone to argue in an arena where it is welcomed and encouraged, not on a little kid notes’ site.
I don’t know if “Mr. James long name” can possibly be serious, but it seems to me like he is trolling. I really hope that a fellow atheist isn’t really being this much of a jerk to everyone on this site. And James, if you aren’t trolling, and I’m sure you’ll read my comment, please just calm down.
Thank you for this. Some people have nothing better to do I suppose. And yes, we are all idiotic, humorless, unwitty, ignorant, bible-thumping morons in your mind James, but that’s okay with me.
Ihateyou. Oh yes, a fine christian sentiment. Exactly what I expect. You are not “idiotic, humorless, unwitty, ignorant, bible-thumping morons” only in my mind, posts like yours prove it.
Yes, I have other things to do but this doesn’t take much time. Post like yours are so simple-minded, replying doesn’t require much in the way of time or mental effort.
Mr. James I am sorry that you feel that religion and God had been forced down your throat. But please don’t force atheism down another persons. Thank you for your time. 🙂
How have I been “Forcing atheism on anyone? By pointing out the fallacies of religion? Is there something about the truth that disturbs you? Keep in mind that not one word I have posted has been shown to be untrue. Yes, some have said it I wasn’t right, but they offered no one bit of proof.
I don’t “feel” that religion has been forced upon people. It is a fact. That fact has been demonstrated many time in courts and proven beyond any doubt. That religion has consistently flouted the law, common sense, and even human decency has also been proven. If you, or anyone wants those proofs, I can point you to sites and examples that cannot be denied.
There is a huge difference between feelings and facts. For example, religion is feelings, atheism is facts.
I’ve got to agree with that. Contradictions are everywhere in his argument.
Can’t tell if trolling or just really stupid.
I’m sure you can’t tel if trolling or really stupid. You don’t have the mental agility to do either. Show me a contradiction I have made. Or are you just saying that because you think it sounds good?
If you want to sound good, try writing in complete sentences. You’ll have a bit more credibility if you don’t come across as semi-illiterate.
Lol, you have obviously never heard of a meme.
meme
[meem]
–noun
a cultural item that is transmitted by repetition in a manner analogous to the biological transmission of genes.
“Can’t tell if trolling or just really stupid,” is a reference to a popular meme; you obviously didn’t get the reference.
About the contradictions, I don’t have the time or desire to find them. This pointless and will probably be my last reply.
Automatically attacking the grammar of the person making the argument! Typical theist tactic —– wait. That was James’s comment. Now I know there’s no god!
“Just calm down”? Yes, calm down and allow the bible-thumping, intolerant, religious reich to pass their sick beliefs into law, over ride common sense and human decency. “Calm down” is how every totalitarian system gains a foothold. Only when people have enough courage to stand up and say, “No more!” can outrages be stopped.
I will not back down and I am calm. I haven’t threatened anyone on here nor have I cursed them or used language such as been used to me. I have called them like I see them. When someone makes idiotic statements or tells outright lies, I say so. One of the things I have learned in life is the one thing people hate more than anything else is someone that tells the truth. That is obvious on here as no one person as tried to prove anything I have posted is not true. Instead they whine, moan, and complain. But show proof that I am not right? Nope, not once.
Once again I see you have put the burden of proof onto us (A typical theist tactic). No one on this comment board is responsible for your statements, you are responsible for your own statements and you must back them up. Also, please try to stay away from wild generalizations of religion. I am an atheist in the Bible Belt and I’ve had my fair share of forced beliefs but none of these people have done any forcing here.
Religion has been at the root of many catastrophes and has caused many injustices, as you have so deftly pointed out, but I sincerely doubt that any people on this comment board, either here from stumbleupon or frequenters of this site are the religious extremists that you portray. You act as though you are an honorable crusader, defending your beliefs from militants. Though you may not like to hear this, you seem to be taking out anger that has been pent up elsewhere out on people that have committed no wrongs against you. You also talk like you have been on this site often. If you keep having flame wars with the patrons of this site I have to ask. Why are you still here?
Religion has been used for several reasons. As an “institution” or “system”, it can be used for good or evil. A war fought over religion that ends in countless deaths is one example of the evil that the system of religion can accomplish. (As would be taking advantage of people, like what was happening in the temple that Jesus overthrew, for the Christians out there.) However, religion has accomplished some great things. Christians are the biggest group of people combating sex trafficking all around the world. Christians also pioneered the field of social work.
Religion, then, is simply a tool. We should not be concerned with condemning it (James) and should not place it on a pedestal (many others). Instead, we should be more concerned with simply living a moral life. These children, most likely, were not maliciously brainwashed. Notice how none of these prayers were vengeful or hateful. These kids will probably grow up to affirm and deny some of their various childhood beliefs. They’ll figure life out. Let’s not cheapen the term “child abuse” by extending it to parents trying to instill a sense of right v. wrong.
-Jordan
You guys are seriously funny, and sorry to say James you are the only one on here coming up as an arrogant ass.
And not you? Yes, you. An arrogant ass. YOu ignore anything that doesn’t agree with your pre0conceived ideas. That’s arrogant. You can’t see any comments I have made to anyone agreeing with them, or at least agreeing to disagree. You are unable to recognize that I respond to people in the manner they treat me. But to do otherwise would cause your ideas to crumble. Can’t have that, can we?
Yeah no kidding and this started because a few kids wrote a couple of funny notes that happened to be addressed to God….
Get a life and move on….
Just saw this and it is humorous and expresses the problem exactly.
http://images.piccsy.com/cache/images/19139-32b03b-530-365.jpg
And yes, all religions do force their views upon others. I know none of you like to hear that, but it’s true even if you can truthfully state that you personally have not done that.
For that matter, have I demanded anyone become an atheist? Al I have done is point out the fallacies and shortcomings of religion. If that bothers anyone, maybe instead of attacking the messenger, you do something positive to correct it. But killing the messenger is always easier than fixing the problem, isn’t it?
Now for the good news. This is m y last post here. I have other commitments to friends and family. I have several videos for others to make and some photo editing to do. You can see videos I have made for myself and others at http://www.vimeo.com or http://www.tubewatcher.tv Enter slrman in the search box at the top right on either.
It has been amusing, but sometimes disappointing to see “good christians behave in a vicious, hateful manner. I do have christian friends that are decent, caring, good people that I am happy to know. Too bad so few like that frequent this site.
According to the dictionary, Religion can be defined as:Details of belief as taught or discussed. Therefore Atheism is a religion. So before you get all high and mighty pretending you are religion free, realize you in trying not to have a religion, have one.
What dictionary? Atheism, as I have explained elsewhere on here more than once, is not a belief. Beliefs are held without supporting facts. That’s “faith”. Atheism is based upon evidence that can be independently verified.
If atheism is a religion, then bald is a hair color and not collecting stamps is a hobby.
I hope that the email address on your blog is one for things other than your book! Just in case I’m commenting because I’d really love to start a friendly dialogue with you, you’ll understand once you read my email (I won’t seem so random), but either way James if you could reply if the email on your blog is for buying your book only that way I could find a way to talk (I feel like this forum is a terrible place for discussions at this point).
Sincerely,
Someone who thinks we learn by having dialogues with those we don’t see perfectly eye to eye with
I was raised Roman Catholic, and for a long time was ignorant of beliefs other than my own. I was that way simply because it is the way I grew up. All of my friends were Catholic, all of my family was Catholic, and I went to a Catholic school, so all of my teachers were Catholic. When I got to highschool, there was, in a word, a “clusterfuck” of religion. Muslims, Jews, Agnostics, Hindu(s?), and, Atheists. At first I was just blatantly ignorant to them, “How can someone be so blind to not see the beauty that is God?” was about all I could think.
After a while I became close friends with a few Atheists. Being around them so much, I just got used to other views. It no longer bothered me. I even began to understand why people would have their doubts about religion, or, like you, why people would despise religion. You’re right. It’s done terrible things to the world. It’s also done good, as far as bringing people together in times of need goes, but I can agree that it’s done more good than bad. If you’re still even reading this, I’m going to go ahead and assume that you actually give a shit what I have to say.
These are children.
They are innocent.
In many ways, they cannot fully think for themselves.
Their parents give them a basis of morals and a brief understand of how life works.
But at the end of the day, the decision is up to them.
There is a reason you hate religion. I’m going to take a shot in the dark, and say it’s because your parents tried to shove religion down your throat. They were God-fearing people, and Heaven forbid their son won’t be just like them. They probably even beat you. When you think of religion, you think of your parents. I’m saying parents here, but keep in mind this is just a brief generalization of what I believe (with the little knowledge I have of you) that your childhood was like.
I’ve seen that image before, the one about religion being like a penis. I think it’s pretty hilarious. But can’t you see that you’re doing the same thing here? Just not with religion, but with the lack thereof. You’ve come onto a harmless page, filled with people who were laughing and smiling at the innocence of children, and burnt it all down.
Even if we (I’m speaking on behalf of the Christians in this comment section) are wrong about our religion, why do you care?
Ignorance is bliss.
“But at the end of the day, the decision is up to them.”
Psychology tells us, repeatedly, that this is just not true.
I agree that many Christians are egotistical, self-centered hypocrites. Many are rude, many go about trying to spread their beliefs the wrong way.
You are just as passionately against religion as Christians are for it. You are completely convinced of the non-existence of God. Christians are completely convinced of the existence of God.
Christians are pushy because they truly believe that if you don’t believed, you’ll have an eternity of punishment. It’s essentially compassion for others that drives them, but many go about it the wrong way.
It’s silly to get into semantic gymnastics and grammatical errors in an attempt to ignore the issues at hand. There is only as much evidence of God as a person will allow there to be. If someone sees the beauty of nature as a sign of God, so be it. You, on the other hand, see it as scientific evidence. That’s your belief. And in this country, every one is free to believe as they will.
The rude behavior from both sides is an example of bitterness. That’s not acceptable. How can either side persuade or even enlighten the other in the midst of insults? There’s no debate here or convincing arguments here. This is apparently a contest on who can make the other look like a fool.
Though many of us disagree, we need to keep in mind a mutual respect for each other.
Atheists can try to shove their beliefs onto others, just like a religious person can. This is a lesson we’ve all hopefully learned today.
As much as James can say that he doesn’t care about what other people think, there is no other reason he would post at least a dozen replies in this thread. He’s just trolling.
While I agree with most of what you say, James…this is a post about children writing funny letters to whatever God they believe in. Get over yourself. You’re just as bad as the people who try to cram religion down our throats, and I’m sure to you that’s a horrifying comparison- but it’s true. You act the same way against religion as some Christians act for it- is there really much of a difference?
Although I agree with James 100%, you should probably stop responding to these zealous idiots. Their indoctrinated minds force them to lash out at anyone who disagrees with their views, and that only causes problems.
Here is the problem, and what causes us to “lash out.” It has nothing to do with the fact that you disagree with what we say. Sure, some may do that, but many of us “zealous idiots” can in fact argue very reasonably for our points and are really very willing to have conversations about this stuff. The things that cause anger are the hypocritical statements. “You’re not allowed to stifle my free speech! you’re an idiot! you know nothing! you are a spoon fed Christian with no original thought! HEY! HOW DARE YOU INSULT MY BELIEFS!!! ANY TIME YOU SAY ANYTHING ABOUT GOD YOU ARE FORCING YOUR BELIEFS DOWN MY THROAT!!! wait, did you just say God was real? HOW DARE YOU! teaching your child that God is real is ABUSE! ABUSE I TELL YOU!” But then you turn around and make statements like “God is not real” If you read on here, not once has anyone insulted atheistic beliefs by calling those who believe it “delusional, idiotic, abusive” etc.
That really is the problem. Not the disagreement in beliefs, but the hypocrisy. If you want to believe that, go for it! if you want to defend that, by all means! but as soon as you start getting angry at Christians for believing and defending what THEY believe, that’s where the anger happens because it is not fair. Honestly, read through this all. You’ll see that that is exactly what has been happening. No one has insulted your beliefs straight out, they have merely defended theirs (insults have been thrown in, which was wrong) but all James has done is insult, insult, insult, and insult again.
If saying “God is not real” is offensive to Christians, saying “God is real” is JUST AS OFFENSIVE to atheists.
The problem is, no one said anything about whether the God that these children were writing the letters to was real. The only person who started the insults and offensive comments was James. Sure, people should’ve just left it and not said anything back to him, but this never would have started had he kept his opinion to himself. People would’ve read it, been like “aw that was kinda cute.” and moved on.
I thought the comments on here were the most entertaining part of the blog. Thanks for the laugh. 🙂
It is almost hard to remember that this is just a comment board for some photo’s isn’t it?
LOL…So funny! Kids are so innocent and pure. Love the handwriting of kids, so cute!
Thank you to all parties who helped transform this post into a warzone. Not only has it been an amusing read but it truly illustrates that people of all creeds are capable of being narrow-minded assholes. Recognize the good and evil present in all points of view and extract what wisdom you can from every system of beliefs you encounter. Truly try to educate yourself without looking to prove a point and you will find truth in the most unexpected places. Most importantly stop blowing each other up… anyway I’m done sounding like some kind of new age fortune cookie, have fun everybody!
This is just fantastic. Gold stars for all of you.
James Smith has poor grammar and sentence structure. Just saying.
Just saying? Give some examples, but you don’t have any do you? Justr another internet idiot, is what you are.
“… that permits it to perform it’s evils.”- “it’s” is a contraction of “it is”, while its shows ownership.
“You’re not an atheists”- “atheists” should be in the singular form.
“l;and”- misspelled “land”. nice.
“… it doesn’t matter to me until the insist I do the same.” misspelled “they”. nice.
… or anything else, What does that matter to me?” capitalized “What” in the middle of a sentence.
… and destroying entire civilizations including plants and animals?” plants and animals are not civilizations. a civilization is defined as “the stage of human social development and organization that is considered most advanced.” plants and animals belong to kingdoms of life, and no kingdom has ever been destroyed. nice try buddy.
i could go on, but i got bored. keep on this intellectual crusade of yours under pictures of notes written by children though, i’m sure your driving home your point to all the people who don’t care and just came across this on stumbleupon like me. kudos.
(and i’m aware i don’t capitalize any words. i don’t like to.)
Hey Ryan, how typical of you theists to attempt to distract from questions you cannot answer by introducing irrelevant subjects.
What do typos have to do with the subject at hand? When have I ever said I am a perfect typist? When have I ever said I carefully edit each post? SO you are another person trying very hard to look like a superior intellect by avoiding the genuine questions. But that’s typical, so how can I be surprised?
I can still say that not one point I have made here has been proven to be wrong. Instead, morons like you think by introducing distractions, they can look like winners. All it does is show you know nothing and are determined to stay that way.
How ironic this would come from someone that doesn’t use capitals because “I don’t like to.” In other words, “I am ignorant and like to stay that way.” Congratulations, you have managed that, at least. Never, ever make a typo where I can see it.
“No kingdom has ever been destroyed? Read your bible, you hypocrite. Your god did order entire kingdoms to be destroyed including all of the trees, animals, and every structure. Genocide is a common theme in the babble.
My advice to you comes from Brother Dave Gardner. “Obey the biblical imperative to go forth and multiply thyself.”
buddy, read a biology book. there are six kingdoms of life. and stop masturbating to atheist blogs, there are better things in life. i didn’t say i wanted to argue about your content. i just pointed out you have poor grammar when you’re trying to be all sophisticated. anyone can throw out names of people way smarter than themselves. you’ve got dawkins? fine, i have c.s. lewis. what i don’t have is all day to sit around and argue with you, because i have a job and contribute to society. later gator
Yep, I was right. You ignored the issues and hide behind what wasn’t even brought up. Thank you very much for proving again that I am right about people like you hiding behind irrelevancies and avoiding the genuine issues. In the process, you have also shown that you are an intellectual coward and have no ethics, either. None of that surprises me in the least.
You have C.S. Lewis? Gee, what a towering intellect the fool was. In your position, I’d be embarrassed to even mention him. But nothing is too ignorant to embarrass you, is it? How about the genocide in the bible? You conveniently ignore that.
What about the great flood that killed almost every living thing on the earth, including plants, animals, people insects; anything that couldn’t thrive in fresh water. Or did it rain sea water? No matter, it’s all a fable anyway and so full of contradictions and impossibilities than only the stubbornly stupid could believe it.
Then you start with the sexual insults. Why do all of you people, when cornered result to sophomoric sexual jibes? Is that as far as your mentality has progressed?
BTW, start using capitals so your writing doesn’t look like that of a second grader. Or is that the effect you desire so no one will expect too much from you?
LOL
you conveniently choose to ignore the great gifts God gives us that are talked about in the bible. negative nancy over here. just so you know, because i’m sure you’ve never actually read the bible, the genocides and great floods were consequences of sinners bringing on the wrath of God. would you like to know how it stopped? just a slightly influential figure named Jesus who, even if you think he was delusional, believed himself to be dying for the sinners of the world, us included. so you can call him crazy if you want, he loved you, and as hard as your trying to make it for him, he still does. i won’t lie and say the church hasn’t messed up, the crusades are a bit embarrassing. that’s what happens when the church strays away from christ. which is why lewis was a christian apologist. and i’m sure you haven’t read any of his work either. on the warpath to become the most openminded atheist out there, i think you’ve fallen into the trap of becoming just as ignorant as you accuse me of being, in that you won’t even consider the possibility that God is real. i’ve had doubts before, everyone has. but i still have faith, and believe very much in God. it’s easy to criticize God, but honestly, who is the creation to question the creator? it’s one of the hardest concepts of religion to accept, but if you try, maybe you can open your mind to see it from our point of view, instead of getting all flustered and sarcastic.
BTW, i’m proud of you. hardly three minor grammatical mistakes in the last post. you’ve been spell-checking 😉
James,
First of all I would just like to say that all of these posts are rather unfortunate, particularly the ones from “THE CHRISTIANS”! If anyone on here has claimed to be a Christian and has slandered or demeaned James in anyway, you may want to check yourself, those kinds of things do not seem very “Christian” to me at all.
But anyways…
James the issue I want to address are the horrors committed in the name of Christianity. It is obvious that you are a proponent of Dawkins’ views (referring to religion as some kind of sickness (a pseudo-scientific notion presented in one of his books if I’m not mistaken) and saying, perhaps not verbatim (i haven’t read every post on this thread) but at least strongly implying that the world would be a better place if religion did not exist because then things such as planes flying into buildings wouldn’t happen, I’m referencing 9/11 just to clarify. (another notion presented in one Dawkins’ books).
Now stick with me here James and lets be fair,
but has atheism not been forced upon people in much the same fashion as religion (E.g. The Soviet Union, China) and have not atrocities against humanity (millions upon millions of people killed) been committed by these atheistic regimes? And are not these horrors just as bad (or perhaps worse, perhaps not) than what has been committed in the name of a god?
I hope to read a response and that you are keeping up with this thread, but whether you are or not, all the best.
Believe me. It’s useless. He’ll just grasp onto the “but you say that crimes have been committed by Christians!!”
This is legitimately not to be slander, I feel awful for him that he has had such terrible experiences with Christians. I feel terrible that I insulted him, it wasn’t right.
Kaitlyn, your apology is accepted. Even though we will disagree on the reality of religion, I have to say that, in some ways, you remind me of a christian friend of mine. She’s a very nice woman in Indiana that has had some terrible things in her life. In addition to suffering horribly from Fribomyalgia, (SP?) in less than one year, both her twin sister and her husband passed away. Both had been ill for a long time and I am sure they were both ready to be relieved of the pain.
But that’s not the point. She is a remarkable resilient woman and has purchased a little place in Florida where she can spend the winters close to another family member.
My point is, while she and I disagree on a few things we share a liking for writing, reading, and photography. She also paints a little, something that is well beyond my meager talents. We simply do not get into discussions about some areas. She respects my views enough to understand I have good reasons for them. I respect her need for something to get her through the disasters that have fallen into her life. If contemplating her religions helps her with that, good for her.
As I have said, I have no objection to anyone believing what they wish. I do object with them forcing those things upon others. No one can rationally deny that has happened and is happening. All religions that I have studied attempt to make their beliefs laws for everyone. That’s how creationism is being force-fed to school children in the USA.
One of the things I like most about Brazil is that the intrusion of religion into the running of the country is far less than in the USA.
Then there is the climate, beaches, and people. 🙂
Hmmmm, I agree that it is possible that at least the appearance of atheism has been imposed upon people in some totalitarian regimes. As I have mentioned elsewhere, the reason is apparently because the dictators, under any name, see religion as a threat. Some, like Hitler, used religion to further their aims and improve their control. Others, like the communists, saw religion as a threat to their power and therefore tried to suppress it.
I suspect that, in those cases, there were many “closet theists” as today, there are many “closet atheists” who pretend to be pious for social, political, or financial reasons. Yes, I agree that is as hypocritical as theists praying on Sunday and cheating on their spouses on Monday.
At least I can retain my integrity in that regard. I have never pretended to be anything other than what I am, an atheists since I was 13. I “came out” to my parents when I was sure and paid a heavy price for it for many years afterward. Estrangement from my family, loss of friends, physical abuse, and continual demands that I “change my ways” under threats of eternal damnation if I did not. That was a really loving, tolerant approach, wasn’t it?
I could give many examples of the mental and even physical abuse I have received for my atheism. I am certain that other atheists would not be surprised and many theists would excuse it as “not being typical” or these were not “true christians”. As I mention in my fitness book, excuses are always easier than action.”
http://www.cracked.com/article_15759_10-things-christians-atheists-can-and-must-agree-on_p3.html
Mr. James,
You asked me: “How have I been ‘Forcing atheism on anyone?’ By pointing out the fallacies of religion? Is there something about the truth that disturbs you? Keep in mind that not one word I have posted has been shown to be untrue. Yes, some have said it I wasn’t right, but they offered no one bit of proof.” You are forcing it by say that I am wrong to believe in God and implying that I am stupid and disillusioned because I choose believe in a truth that includes God. I’m not saying that you are wrong to believe what you do but please don’t tear me apart for having different beliefs. I posted the apology not to antagonize you but as a sincere apology. I was taught that as a Christian my job is to only let people know about Christ and his ability to save people from sin but I cannot force them to become a Christian.
That’s the difference between us. You have beliefs. I have facts. You decide your own truths and discard evidence to the contrary.
Your job is NOT to let people know about christ, but to stop evangelizing and maintain your beliefs in a private, quiet manner, as your bible says to do. How many “christians are content to do that? Not many. I know a few, but not many at all.
Mr. James.
My Bible tells me to “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,” Matthew 28:19. It does not say to just sit and be quiet. But it also says “If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town.” Matthew 10:14.
I was not brainwashed as a child and even though both of my parents are ministers, I was raised to make my own decision about my faith.The reason I believe in God is because I feel that the events in my life prove His existence to me. Yes I made the choice to follow Christ but it was not without evidence as you say.
If you follow the quote you gave, then you ARE forcing your beliefs upon others. Only after you have been rejected do you “leave that town” But first you must preach to those who clearly have no interest. Thank you for confirming what I already knew.
One of the trademarks of brainwashing is the person does not know how they have been conditioned. Both of your parents were ministers and neither of them ever suggested that you should learn about the truth of things for yourself? You were never discouraged from questioning what you were told? If you think not, I suggest that your mental conditioning was more effective that you are able to grasp.
Tell me then, what evidence did you have? If anyone could produce evidence of the truth of any religion, I would retract all of my atheists statements and convert on the spot.
Theists have been trying, threatening me with damnation, and doing all they could to make me believe. I am more firmly atheistic now than I was 50 years ago. Take your best shot. But please don’t be offended when I laugh.
BTW, victory over what? Common sense, truth, the law, human decency, free speech, rational thinking? Most of those seem to be fatal to religion.
Mr. James,
By force I meant saying that you will burn in hell for not believing in God. Not once Have I said that. My whole argument has been that you should not force atheism on others by doing exactly what others have done to you.
And, no my parents never discouraged me from asking questions. They answered every question I had and showed me where I could find the answers.
As I said, the evidence I have is proof to me. Stuff that may not mean anything to you but it changed my life. Things that happened to me that to me cannot be explained by science or anything man can offer.
Also, the name I chose has to do with a song I had in my head at the time and is more for internet security than anything.
Again, my argument here is not over religion. I know that you will not receive anything about religion. My argument is over the hypocrisy of your statements. You say that one of your problems with Christians is that they have forced their beliefs on you but you are practically doing the same thing by saying that Christians are all idiots and are choosing to believe lies. All I am asking is that you consider this fact before you go off on Christians.
I never said that you said i would burn in hell, but admit it, you believe it. I have been told that by many christians.
How am I forcing atheism on others? Have I told them they will suffer eternal torment for believing? I have pointed out the fallacies and often outright lies told by theists. But that is being truthful, not forcing anyone to embrace atheism. You cannot force anyone to accept facts. They either will or they will not. Nor have atheist voted atheism into law. What we have tried, with only moderate success, is to prevent theists from making their beliefs the law.
Still, religion mostly gets a free ride on everything from taxes, freedom from regulation, criticism, and questioning, to the use of public money to promote themselves. In places like Australia, they actually receive tax money to teach their beliefs in public schools. Very much like in the USA where laws forcing the teaching of creationism have been passed.
Your parents never discouraged you from asking questions? Did you ever ask, “How do we know all of this stuff is true?” “How do we know what is in the bible is true?” I suspect that, to this day, you have never asked either of those questions.
As the quote goes, “Science asks questions that may never be answered. Religion provides answers that may not be questioned.”
Again, I ask, “What evidence?” I have has so many religious people of every persuasion say the have “evidence’ Not one has ever provided it. If it won’t mean anything to me, perhaps that’s because it isn’t real?
You say “Things that happened to me that to me cannot be explained by science or anything man can offer.” There are many things that cannot yet be explained. It is a major mistake to assume then they must have a supernatural explanation. As I wrote in my blog entry, Flying Pharaohs”, the ancient Egyptians would have thought a simple sailplane was “the work of the gods” because they knew nothing of the laws of aerodynamics.
In many ways, we are hardly more advanced than they so many things that seem mysterious to us, will be child’s play to future generations.
As Author C. Clarke said, “Sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic,”
Again, how is stating that believers are delusional and reject rational thought and the evidence of their own senses forcing atheism on them? If I sate you are bald, and it is a fact, is that forcing a toupee on you?
I am asking that before you vote your beliefs into law, is that the right thing to do? If you think it is, then you are giving others the right to make their beliefs into law. Take a close look at places like Iran and Saudi Arabia. Those are de facto theocracies and there is no freedom of religion there at all.
The “Freedom from religion” and separation of church and state protects your right to your beliefs as well as mine to not believe.
Theists would serve their own cause much better if they stuck to the truth instead of obvious falsehoods, like “This nation was founded upon christian principles.” and “Atheists like Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot committed great evil because they were atheists.” Those statements have been demonstrated so many times to be untrue that repeating them does nothing but destroy the credibility of theists.
Again, how has anything I said been hypocritical? I have pointed out I am not forcing atheism on anyone. In fact I has clearly stated that is impossible. One of ht main problems theists have with credibility is they think, because something is said, it is automatically true with no supporting evidence. But, that is the basis of religion isn’t it? Believe without proof.
Yawn
I cant believe you lot are having a full on debate over something that people shouldnt fight over
In my opinion everyone should believe in what they want to believe, just dont shove it down people’s throats.
Atheists are as much to blame for doing this as religious people.
Chill out guys go live your life how you want not how someone else thinks you should
James,
I would like to start out that I am a Christian. Yes, I have strong beliefs but I will not try to convert people that want no part in Christianity. I am not here to try to get you to stop believing in what you think. I get that you do not believe in the different types of religion, Christianity, Islam, Muslim, Catholicism, etc.. But to say that atheism is not a religion is a lie, to be blunt.
Religion, by definition, is a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with faith. Faith is the principle of “believing without seeing”. These definitions prove that atheism is a religion.
You were not there when the Earth was “created”. You were not there when “Jesus was crucified”. You were not there when the “Bible was written”. Because you were not there, you will never know if these things really happened or not. That is pure faith whether you believe or not.
Yes, you may have facts to back up your faith that there is no “higher power”, but you still have faith as the foundation to your belief. I just wanted to bring this thought up to you so that you could think about it.
Please do not dismiss my point with “You are just another arrogant Christian”. I just wanted to bring up something that may open your eyes to the basis of your belief. Please receive this with an open heart.
Thank you
You make the same arguments that I have seen so many time, but it turns itself on you. No, I was not there and neither were you.
Yes, I have facts and you have none.
No, I do not “have faith”. As you said, I have facts. Faith is professing continued belief is something when there are no facts for it and many against it.
“Just so I could think about it”? That’s how one becomes an atheists, by thinking about it. One remains a theist by refusing to think about it, consider facts, and accept the evidence of their own senses.
My eyes are open. I do not have beliefs, I have fact. Your insistence that atheism is a belief is evidence on arrogant theism. Open your own eyes. “None are so blind as those who refuse to see.”
An open heart? When yours is closed to truth and rational thinking?
I know both of us were not there. So that means that both of us have faith that it either happened or did not.
You have facts that lead your thinking in the direction of atheism. And I have facts that lead mine to Christianity.
Faith is believing in something that you are not 100% certain of. You may have many facts that point toward one direction, but you still were not there. So this leads to your faith to fill in the answer that all your facts build up to.
Contrary to your belief, I do think about the opposing arguments and listen to what “faults” may be in my thinking. I challenge my beliefs by thinking through these problems and it only makes my faith stronger.
My eyes are not closed, and I will not accuse you that yours are closed either. Thank you for proving to me what many atheists have proved to me before. You call me arrogant and close-minded, when I know that in fact I am not “arrogant” for believing in what I do.
You may have facts, but so do I. So either my thinking is not religion/beliefs, or yours is.
You have faith. I have facts. YOu have beliefs. I have hard evidence.
If you think about opposing arguments, you do so with pre-conceived conclusions and ignore anything that points in another direction.
That’s they only way that considering the truth could make your faith stronger.
Yes, you are arrogant because you refuse to consider verifiable evidence or anything that points to your beliefs being wrong or impossible.
Tell me, exactly what “facts” do you have? I will not hold my breath waiting for them. I have asked many theists for their facts and I have never been given even one. Well, there have been some “facts” that were not facts at all, but made-up silliness that is laughable in their face. Independently verifiable facts. Either you have them or you do not.
Atheism is a religion like bald is a hair style
Atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby.
Hey, everyone! Come check it out! I’m not playing football! Not playing football is my favourite sport!
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
I’m not sure why anyone would take the time to argue either for or against religion. I am an atheist with a religious studies degree and in a masters program for religious studies and I still don’t think I have spent as much time arguing Christianity as you James. Though I agree with your religious views let’s be honest we can’t prove there is not a God the same way that theists can’t prove that there is. Why not just let people believe what they want and realize that when a Christian tries to “shove their religion down your throat” that they are coming from a good place because they honestly want to save your soul. Instead of getting offended just respectfully decline.
To the person who put together this blog: This is absolutely adorable.
Thanks 🙂
I’m going to make it apart of my daily routine to read this before I go to bed. This is way better than anything I’ve seen on T.V recently. This could even be on MTV. “The Real World Religion: James versus everyone else.”
I was raised christian, and as I got older I decided to read/learn/think more objectively about the things I was taught whilst growing up.
These notes are from little kids who’s parents bring them up teaching them about God and Christianity I ASSUME.
You know, we lie to kids about Santa Claus, and use other fairy tales to help make their life while they are younger as worry free as possible, to keep their innocence.
Is this a generally fucked up world, and should kids be baby-ed to the point of being wusses.. No.
But this doesn’t necessarily mean all these are children of christian brain-washing parents…and even if so, when they get older .. they can make the choice for themselves what to believe.
This is humorous because you see children referring to what is known to them and assumedly their parents as the creator of ALL LIFE AND EXISTANCE, in an extremely casual manner almost as an equal. Pointing out this innocence/Lack of pre-occupation with the hierarchy of society IS AMUSING. and damnit I think its freaking funny.
To Mr. James… I really do see your point. But I mean come on, I know you dont CARE what other people think of you or your thoughts… but at a certain point…dont YOU just get tired of people ganging up on you and calling YOU a jerk. I agree that 99% of people are a waste of space.. but COME ON MAN. it seems a little immature to me to just not let it GOOO.
We don’t believe in a life after this one, so why spend it arguing and being offended.
Fuck it.
i meant yes, this generally is a fucked up world. its LATE here.
To James:
I didn’t even bother reading the entire conversation, because it seems to me that you continue repeating your same argument over and over again, simply rephrasing it. This page was not intended to shove anything down anyone’s throats. You need to get off your high horse sir, and calm down. You remind me of a middle school girl, with all your drama. You also seem very caught up in generalizations and stereotypes. You cite authors to prove that you are not alone in your beliefs. You make comments such as “a typical theist tactic.” I hate to break it to you, but EVERYONE is different and you can’t change people. If people have different beliefs than you, let them. If they try to shove stuff down your throat, (which, for the record, no one did here) ignore them. Why waste your time arguing when you could be doing something universally productive (like volunteering at a homeless shelter or something). I came across this site on stumbleupon and I thought, “Oh, how cute!” I then saw this long-winded cyclical argument and thought, “Of course, someone always has to take it the wrong way. There’s always the touchy person that absolutely HAS to be right.” That person, sir, is you. What really pissed me off was when you said you didn’t want people telling you that you had to “respect” their beliefs and practice the same ones and be tolerant and whatnot. No on said you had to practice someone’s beliefs but tolerance helps everybody. It was INTOLERANCE, rather than religions that caused events such as 9-11, the Holocaust, and other ones mentioned. Live and let live, it will make EVERYONE happier(: If you respond to this, I probably won’t see, I just hope that you take my advice (which is universally acceptable and applicable to many situations and has nothing to do with religion of any sort) and fuck off.
To every one. I no longer have the time to devote to this page. I have a life and commitments to others.
A few of you have been reasonable people and I think you for that. The rest of you gave been smug, arrogant assholes. If i have repeated myself it’s been because so many of you have a large comprehension deficit and cannot understand anything. Stating the same idea in wildly different ways only confuses your already weak minds.
So to those of you like that. Go fuck yourselves, shitheads. That’s about the only thing you can understand. Too bad none of you had the courage to face me directly. I would have enjoyed seeing you cringe and backpedal in person. What a large group of intellectual, ethical, and physical cowards I have attracted here.
As I leave, please notice the mistletoe attached to my shirt tail.
Don’t be an asshat James.
“Go fuck yourselves, shitheads”
What a wonderful, rational, person you are.
We are arrogant and stupid? Who the hell died and made you god? Seriously. You must walk around in an office somewhere with your head hidden. Does the internet and fighting give you power? Do you feel brave.. I have yet to see you meet anyone in person. Not one person on here was throwing their beliefs down your throat.. they just want you to choke on your words and shut the fuck up, cause you dont know any more than anyone else. If you are billions of years old and were there when the world began, than praise you.. but believe me, I would rather spit on the ground you walk on than think you are an intelligent person. A wise man knows when to speak, an intelligent man knows what he speaks. and you represent neither, so before you start telling people they are stupid and ignorant and mindless retards, look in the mirror, cause you are looking increasing fucking ugly by the second.
I said I wouldn’t reply, bit I’ll make an exception for you.
I have yet to meet anyone here? How convenient is your memory. I’ll make you the same offer I made before. I’ll pay your way here so you can confront me personally. Then we will see who is brave.
Come on, you gutless jerk, show everyone that you are not just another spineless internet hero hiding behind your computer. I’m putting my money where my mouth is, what are you doing besides hiding behind a fake, insulting ID?
Dear James,
I’m sorry that you have this view of religion, but I can assure you that many theists are free thinkers, sure there are plenty of people who seem brainwashed but that can be said of Atheism also, you yourself criticised fellow atheists for it on this.
Anyway thats not what I want to say, what I want to say is that no matter how angry you are at God or religion or whatever God loves you and will always do so. And I love you, it is the principle tenet of my faith, to love thy neighbour. So much love, God bless and I hope you find happieness and comfort in your beliefs or lack thereof.
Angus, you do not “love” me. That’s what you have been taught to say. Also, there is not god to “love” me. Considering how this mythical god has behaved, killing millions of people and condemning them to an eternity of torture foe not other reason than they had never heard of him, I can do without that kind of “love”, thank you.
Finally, as I have said before, but had ignored with other things, how can anyone hate something that has never existed? Do environmentalists hate Paul Bunyan?
I can hate religion, for it has done great harm in the world and has caused me to be personally abused mentally and even physically. After I announced to my parents that I was atheist, I endured four years of threats, demands, and lectures. Even after I left their home the night I graduated high school, I still heard about it every time I saw them. Fortunately for me, I was able to pay my own way in school and afterward, so I stayed away from them with no contact for years. Sadly, these were years when I would have enjoyed being with the a lot, but their insistence on “bringing me back to the fold” kept us apart. Another strike against religion for me.
Please try to understand this. Atheism isn’t a belief, Atheism is a lack of belief in the unprovable. Faith is professing a continued belief in what you, in your heart, know cannot possibly be true.
No James, I know exactly what I said and I meant it, whether or not you accept it is up to you. And also did this God not in fact send his son to earth to die so that we may be saved.
I will agree with you wholeheartedly in the fact that people take faith too far, they put it where it’s not wanted and wave it around as if it makes them better than everyone else, but I would say those people aren’t truly Christian (or whatever faith they claim as their own).
I’m sorry that you had such troubles due to your stance, that again is not true religion, religion should not be used that way, if someone rejects it that is their choice, we were given the ability to choose and it is our God given right to do so.
And I am well aware of what Atheism is, it is a complete lack of belief in anything that cannot be proven beyond doubt. But as for faith, I know in my heart it is true that is why I profess it and continue to believe it. It is like the feeling of love, you cannot really explain it, it is different for everyone, some people don’t believe in it but in your heart you know it to be true.
No James, I know exactly what I said and I meant it, whether or not you accept it is up to you. And also did this God not in fact send his son to earth to die so that we may be saved.
I will agree with you wholeheartedly in the fact that people take faith too far, they put it where it’s not wanted and wave it around as if it makes them better than everyone else, but I would say those people aren’t truly Christian (or whatever faith they claim as their own).
I’m sorry that you had such troubles due to your stance, that again is not true religion, religion should not be used that way, if someone rejects it that is their choice, we were given the ability to choose and it is our God given right to do so.
And I am well aware of what Atheism is, it is a complete lack of belief in anything that cannot be proven beyond doubt. But as for faith, I know in my heart it is true that is why I profess it and continue to believe it. It is like the feeling of love, you cannot really explain it, it is different for everyone, some people don’t believe in it but in your heart you know it to be true.
Don’t worry. Just because Atheism is your belief, it won’t make Jesus love you any less.
If you were able to comprehend what I have posted, you would not say that atheism is a belief. But perhaps the concept is too difficult for you to understand?
You would also know that there is no Jesus and never was. I have directed people to look up Horus, Attis, and Mithra to learn how the jesus myth was created by stealing things from earlier myths.
I’m sure you don;t want to know because your fragile little belief system might come falling down.
You have beliefs that are based upon faith. Faith is accepting myths with no verifying evidence.
I have knowledge. That knowledge is based upon facts, evidence, and rational thinking. All of those must be dismissed to have beliefs and faith.
James, you need to lay off the steroids or whatever you are taking that is making you so angry. I would not be surprised if you wind up with high blood pressure and health problems because you are clearly so full of hate.
I agree with your opinions however you are coming off as a pretentious a**. I know how you feel and how frustrating it is to deal with people who are so clearly not behaving rationally and worse try to enforce laws based on their beliefs. However, these posts your making are not doing a damn about anything. Why don’t you get a life?! Get out there and make a change in the real world. Stop b*tching and moaning here because your too scared to go out there and take a risk. Or maybe your not scared, maybe you just have way to much time for a grown man and prefer to spend all of your time ranting on random websites.
Oh, and your responses are really getting old. I can practically quote what your going to say to me in response to this right now.
“Your such a moron hiding behind your computer you coward. Why don’t you come over here and tell that to my face? Stop forcing your opinions on me. I can do and say what I want! Whaaaah”
Seriously, it’s getting old. If your going to respond to this, come up with something new or I will be forced to leave out of sheer boredom from your predictable cut and paste responses
Bahaha a life and commitments… looks like they ran short cause you’re back already!
Here’s a big surprise for you. It’s the weekend. I am entitled to take some time off to amuse myself by showing what a stupid fool you are.
I am really becoming sad that you will not come to see me, though. I could have so much fun with you. I would be smiling even more than in my picture.
No, that’s not a big surprise. It is Saturday after all. So this is how you amuse yourself? Sad… fourth of july weekend and everyyything! So how exactly did this post show I’m a stupid fool? Mmmm let me know!!
Aw, I’m sad too! We could have had so much fun with each other!! I always love making people SMILE!! xoxo
Every time I think you have exhibited the ultimate in your stupidity, you surprise me by demonstrating, “No, I can be a lot more stupid than you thought.”
This is Brazil, you sad moron. July 4th is not a holiday here.
Everything you do demonstrates your lack of intelligence, like not being able to figure out that July 4th is not a universal holiday.
I would be the only one smiling. You might not be quite so happy, then or ever again.
But you’re not brazilian yourself sir. Seeing as you were a resident of Arizona and Florida, I assume you have some sense of national pride even if you are elsewhere in the world. So no, I’m not a moron. I never said it was a universal holiday now did I?? Nope! Thanks though for letting me know! Gee, and I was wondering why people in Zimbabwe don’t have Monday off!!!!
Why wouldn’t I be happy!!! Why would I never smile again??????? Awwww, that’d be a bummer, but please give me a detailed explanation as to why I would never smile again!
Again, you reveal your ignorance. How do you know I am not a Brazilian? Because I have lived in other places. I have also lived in Quebec and Holland. Does that make me Canadian or Dutch?
No, you did not say it was a universal holiday but your words “on fourth of July weekend” give the impression that you thought it was a holiday here, too. Maybe if you chose your words more carefully, you wouldn’t appear as a semi-literate moron.
You would never smile again because you would not have anything to smile about. After being shown irrefutable proof of your failings as a human being, is might be hard to be happy about yourself. When you’re not happy about yourself, how can you be happy about anything else? That’s why I smile so much. I am happy with myself, my life, and where I am. So sorry about everything for you.
What kind of Brazilian name is James Smith? Since you’re the one all about making assumptions, it’d be safe to ASSUME you are not Brazilian. I could believe the Canadian one though, maybe you are. Either way, I don’t particularly care 🙂
Sorry you’re bitter about life and nobody likes you :/ You could never come up with irrefutable proof that I’m a failure of a person because there is none. I’m not a failure as a human being- nobody who has written on this page is sir. Not even you, however, I never said anything like that about you. You should be nicer! It’s great you smile, your mom probably will smile once you move out of her house. 🙂
On another note- I want to see more of these little kids’ notes!! Put up more please!!!
Oh and PS—- you did make a little speech telling everyone how you were leaving instead of simply not responding anymore, so it appears as though you were looking for a reaction!!!
I think this webhost should start a new posting with little kids’ letters to JAMES! How cute would they be!!!!
Well, it is so much fun winding you up, that I can’t resist. So it’s all your fault.
Ah, that explains it! Oh I’m not wound up, don’t worry! Like I said before, nothing really phases me 🙂 You did ignore my last request though to please please dooo tell me why I would never ever smile again after a visit with you! Would it be that deportation process that would bum me out? :/ All talk sir! I don’t appreciate you completely ignoring my retort to you calling me a moron due to your assumption on my fourth of july comment 🙁
So sad about what you pick and choose to respond to!!!! ciaoooo bebe!
This is directed at the James fellow.
The pictures were meant to be funny. Laugh at the ridiculousness and move the hell on. It’s not about religion it’s about kids and the silly things they jot down. Have yourself a good giggle and move the hell on. You’re making yourself look like an ass.
P.S. arguing over the internet is like being in the special olympics, even if you win you’re still a retard.
that just made my day. 🙂 lol
Does it make you feel good to make fun of people that are mentally challenged? That says a lot more about you than you might want people to know.
Dear James,
Your surety and dedication to making sure no one can critise you makes atheists look bad. You do not represent me as an atheist, nor do you represent me as a critical thinker.
Reasonable people can disagree. Your need to follow the comments on this page have proven there is no rational disagreement with you.
In conclusion (watch out, here comes the ad hominem!!), you are a dick.
Exactly when have I said that I represent you or anyone else?
Yes, rational people can disagree. When theists start being rational, there will be no theists.
Perhaps you should try harder to comprehend what is actually being said instead of reading into things what you prefer to have been said. That’s a theist problem. As a professed atheist, I would expect better from you.
Coming form a fuzzy thinker as you have shown yourself to be, if I am a dick, I accept that as a compliment.
Wow! You are *still* replying to this a week later!!
How you get that I am a fuzzy thinker from the few lines I posted is a little beyond me. I claimed that your dedication to knocking back every criticism makes atheists look bad, and I stand by that. I claimed that you don’t represent me as an atheist, and I stand by that. (Note that I didn’t say that you claimed to represent me, I just said that you didn’t — there’s a subtle but important difference there.)
I mentioned my opinion that your compulsive need to follow comments demonstrates an inability to be disagreed with, and I stand by that.
OK, I finished with a tongue-in-cheek ad hominem, but I was kind enough to admit it at the time.
Which was the fuzzy part?
As for your little hint that I have “a theist problem” — I can’t imagine anything more “theist” than compulsively watching an internet comment thread to ensure that no one says the wrong thing…..
Don’t take being a dick as a compliment. Take it as a childish insult with a morsel of truth hidden inside it. Grow as a person. Shut down your computer, go outside, and live.
(PS: I gave the wrong email address in this comment, so your replies won’t get to me. Unless you make the effort to reply to my original comment. Are you that pissed off that you’ll do that?)
What is compulsive about have a little entertainment helping people like you look even more moronic than they do naturally?
Are you against people enjoying themselves?
I am immensely amused by people like you that post ever-increasing mounds if ignorance. Then, when it is pointed out how stupid you are behaving, you whine, moan, and bitch that you are being insulted. If you don’t like the facts, change your behavior.
I stand corrected on the fuzzy thinking. That’s giving you way too much credit. ROFLMAO!
You gave the wrong email address, did you? Well, that adds another dimension to hiding behind your keyboard to say things that you would never say to my face. Why am I not surprised that you would behave like that? COuld it be your own words coming back on you?
James,
I am a catholic who is struggling with my belief. I believe that everyone is entitled to their opinion, as well as you. But you will never see me tell a muslim that it’s despicable when their children pray to Allah, or tell Jews that there is Jesus and they are stupid. To be honest, no one will ever know until we die, and to sit here and argue it is pointless and a waste of time. I am not telling you that you are wrong. But I will also tell you that you are not right. Sometimes the best thing to do is to stick with what we believe and ignore what we dont. If there is a God, it is very cute what those children wrote, and you cant deny that. So look at it that way. What is so wrong with allowing people to have hopes and dreams that they will see their loved ones later in life? That there is always someone to listen to you, even if you cant see them? If you are right and they are wrong, then when they pass on, they will not die, the world will simply cease to exist. They wont know.. they’ll be dead. Some people dont want to live their lives fearing that.. so let people have a religion and dont think little of them. Its how we are and how humans cope with the idea of death and what lies after because that is where science ends.
hey um James Smith, I understand you have your own views and that is perfectly cool. I only say that if you are going to be hateful towards other random people in the internet you do not know and call them idiots, morons, what have you, you might want to not capitalize the first two letters of you. I see your need for emphasis but, it doesn’t particularly strengthen your argument. Besides the fact it is quite annoying.
James please tell me one specific problem you have with my religion of Buddhism and I will step one step closer to your side of this argument.
First, thank you for your reasonable and rational post.
I have no real problem with Buddhism. Frankly, I don’t know enough about it to engage in any specific criticism of it.
I have heard some say that Buddhism isn’t a religion as no specific supernatural belief is involved. If that is true, I would think it is more like a philosophy. But, I have not made a study of it. Even though I have been involved with eastern culture, mostly Korean, for decades. My focus has been on the martial arts, customs, language, and food.
james thank you for your reply. now stop insulting all religions and making broad blanket statements about things that you do not understand. if you have specific complaints im sure the leaders of the places of worship where you live would be more then willing to listen and talk to you about it. please stop this foolishness.
Religions have earned and deserve contempt and to be resisted whenever possible. It is not insults when it is the truth. Please keep in mind that no one has proved that anything I have said is not true. People have whined, complained, and bitched but have not offered any verifiable proof.
Yes, plenty have said they don’t like it and many have said to “Just shut up” but proof? Not one, not ever.
I apparently understand religion better than you do. Maybe I have more experience with it. Maybe I have been exposed to more than the gentle non-theist philosophy of Buddhism?
Keep in mind that to fight evil anywhere is to fight it everywhere.
No, the religions leaders all over the world are not willing to listen and talk about it. If you really understood religion, you would know that.
It is not foolishness to point out the lies and hypocrisy of religion.
Finally, who are you to tell me, or anyone what to do? Do really want to be another of the “just shut up!” brigade? Is suppressing free speech something that is taught in Buddhism?
James, you are absolutely right, religion is responsible for a lot of evil in this world; one only has to look at the Crusades and see there is no argument to the contrary. That is why many Christians, myself included, would tell you that we hate religion, but we love Christ. Christianity at its core is about the love of God overcoming my imperfections, numerous as they are. God would never condone the Crusades, just like he would not condone gay-bashers and men who sit on corners preaching fire and brimstone. Your error is using Christians as the example of Christ, which is really our error as Christians. As Ghandi said, “I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” He hit the nail on the head. But true Christianity lived out would be a very different picture than the one you have painted (though largely warranted). With an open mind, I would encourage you to do some research on religion beyond just its problems and failings, and seek the core message… you may be surprised. As a compromise, I would promise to read any atheist articles or websites you send me. I hope you know that whether you believe in him or not, God loves you so much more than you can fathom.
JUSTICE
James, You said that no one was giving you scientific evidence to prove you wrong?
You have also given no proof of the subject that you are defending I’m not here to make a comment such as “god bless” or something to make you mad I am simply on stumble and found an interesting conversation.
You are probably going to reply to this bashing me for making a simply statement to contribute to this conversation. Do you know what the word troll means on the internet?
You say you spend your days mulling around on the internet have you nothing better to do? Before you made the comment of people “trying to shove religion down your throat” no one here was “shoving” religion down your throat.
Human nature is to act defensively once attacked. Do onto others as you would have done to you.(Yes I realize that this is an overused now meaningless cliche) Atheiests will always not like religion because they do not understand. You may take this as comment saying atheiests are “stupid” that is not what I am saying at all I am saying that our minds work differnet.
You say that you had trouble with your parents at home as a child. That is unfortunate. Just think about this if you had different outside influnces there would be no discussion on this topic at all. I myself am a young christian.
I have met many atheiests that say the bible says for christians to hate atheists and everytime I ask them “find me the bible verse that says christians must hate atheists” If you can do this for me I will be suprised.
I came into this conversation open-minded and have made these views contemplating on this discussion. James, my fellow human are a troll. That is not a bash it is a realization. Embrace it. Good day.
The burden of proof is on the person asserting a claim, not the person rejecting it.
James, you need to lay off the steroids or whatever you are taking that is making you so angry. I would not be surprised if you wind up with high blood pressure and health problems because you are clearly so full of hate.
I agree with your opinions however you are coming off as a pretentious a**. I know how you feel and how frustrating it is to deal with people who are so clearly not behaving rationally and worse try to enforce laws based on their beliefs. However, these posts your making are not doing a damn about anything. Why don’t you get a life?! Get out there and make a change in the real world. Stop b*tching and moaning here because your too scared to go out there and take a risk. Or maybe your not scared, maybe you just have way to much time for a grown man and prefer to spend all of your time ranting on random websites.
Oh, and your responses are really getting old. I can practically quote what your going to say to me in response to this right now.
“Your such a moron hiding behind your computer you coward. Why don’t you come over here and tell that to my face? Stop forcing your opinions on me. I can do and say what I want! Whaaaah”
Seriously, it’s getting old. If your going to respond to this, come up with something new or I will be forced to leave out of sheer boredom from your predictable cut and paste responses
Tell me exactly who is forcing you to read anything? Who is forcing you to reply?
Here’s a hint? Look in the mirror and tell that person to stop it right now. Then if they don’t stop, slap them hard across the face a couple of times.
So violent!!
That was a little joke you stupid POS. Now was it directed at you. You are the one that assumes everything here is about you. Remember what you said about “assume”. But your memory is as defective as your intelligence.
I never said anything in that post that would imply I thought it was directed towards me. Nice try though! Merely commenting that you sounded so violent!! So that statement is pretty void! 😀 But thanks for paying attention to my other posts, you’re too sweet!
What you communicated was your total lack of understanding of the post.
That part you thought was “violent” was the joke. I was suggesting that she slap herself for forcing herself to read and reply when it upset her so much. But I understand and forgive you. I knew in advance it would be far too complex for a mental defective like you to comprehend.
It has become clear to me that you have a streak of mental masochism (look it up, I know it’s too esoteric a word for you) that causes you to enjoy seeing yourself being abused in print and revealed to be such a worthless excuse for a human being. Come on down, I can do even better in person. 😀
No, I understood it was a joke. Terribly mean though sir, I would never want someone to slap his or herself repeatedly in the face!! DIdn’t you previously berate someone else for passing out unwarranted forgiveness? I don’t need itttt sir!
PS, for the myriad of vocab words you are spewing out, please get a synonym for ‘defective’ that one in particular is losing it’s harshness 🙁
I do, I love being beaten down on the internet from someone else who spends their time doing so!!! It reminds me about being back in fifth grade with the other little girls yelling across the internet!! 😉
Oh baby, I bet you can do a lot better in person. So sad I’m not coming to brazil. XOXOXO
You had no idea it was a joke until I told you. In addition to your other failings, you are also a liar.
If you love “being beaten down on the internet” accept my offer. Then you will be so pleased with the results, you’ll never leave.
James,
I will be honest. I found our post and the resulting debate/name-calling contest quite interesting. I don’t want to insult your beliefs, but I have a few thoughts after reading the first 1/4 of the posts (there is WAY too much for me to read it all).
Firstly, good for you for sticking up for your beliefs. I don’t believe in the same things as you, but I do respect people who know what they believe. That is why when people ask me my opinion or beliefs, I tell them. I am a Catholic, I am proud of it, and I firmly believe in God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit and so much more that you do not believe in.
You claim that Catholic children are brainwashed. I have been in Catholic school all my life, until I went to college. This may sound like I am supporting your argument, but in both junior high and high school. I learned not only about Christianity, but about Judaism, Buddism, Hinduism, and pagan religions. I don’t claim to be an expert in these fields, but my schools (which were run by nuns and other Christians) taught me about religions that I don’t agree with. They didn’t teach me why these beliefs are wrong, they simply taught us what others believe. My schools would love me to spread the word of God throughout my life, but they would be ashamed of me if I forced it upon anyone, or if I ridiculed anyones beliefs. I don’t see how schools run by “arrogant” Christians would be capable of such open-mindedness and understanding.
You also claim that children raised in a certain religion have never had an original thought. However, my whole like the people around me (religious and non-religious) have encouraged me to question my faith and be my own person. No one I know would be (or ever has been) upset when I question one of God’s teachings.
James, I could go on forever about my thoughts on your posts. I am pretty sure I will not change your mind, and I am sure you won’t change mine, but I would like to understand you and your reasoning. I would appreciate it if you would answer these questions.
Why did you post on this website? What did you hope to achieve by writing your thoughts?
Do you expect us to applaud your (in my opinion) rude and insulting posts about peoples’ beliefs?
I don’t understand you, maybe I never will, but I would like to. I don’t believe in cramming beliefs down other peoples’ throats. At the same time, I feel you may have crossed a line by starting a religious debate on a website that is supposed to cherish the innocence and way of thinking that children possess.
I am sorry you’ve had bad experiences with Christians and i hope that in time, you will find meet Christians who can change your opinion of us. Please believe me when I say, we are not all bad.
Why hasn’t James answered this 🙁 so sad.
I don’t have time to answer all of your post. Just let me say that, until you understand the difference between “beliefs” and facts, you will never understand a thing I have to say. Beliefs are putting faith in something with no supporting evidence. That is a nutshell description of religion.
Until you are able to comprehend that, there is nothing to discuss with you.
As I have quoted here before, “You cannot reason a person away from a position they did not reach through reason.” You have dismissed facts, logic, and rational thinking to maintain your beliefs. I have embraced the same to understand the realities of the world. That is the difference between me and every theist in the world.
1. Where did all the water come from? There is not enough water on earth for this to be possible.
2. Was the earth flooded with sea or fresh water? Based on the answer to this question, you could make predictions about which underwater species would have survived a global flood. Presumably, it would’ve been fresh water, meaning most (if not all, given the amount of water needed) of the salt water species would have died out.
3. Why can’t we find any geological evidence which points to a global flood. Flood’s leave visible impact in sediment levels, where are they? If this was really global, the evidence would literally be everywhere.
4. If Jesus was what stopped the flood, why was he born at least 2000 years after the fact? Doesn’t sound like they were related at all…..
5. Most atheist wouldn’t claim (honest ones, anyway) to know that God doesn’t exist, as how can anyone KNOW something doesn’t exist. Most atheists would rate God’s possibility of existing as roughly equal to that of Thor, leprechauns, unicorns, and Dora the Explorer.
6. “who is the creation to question the creator?”
This is my main problem with religion. I do not find that that is a valid way of thinking about anything. It’s an excuse to stop thinking.
@ Ugh
I don’t pretend to be an expert in Christianity. I am not a perfect Christian, but I can give you answers to your questions. Not all Christians will agree with me, because there are many types of Christianity and each has slightly different beliefs. But this is what I was told when I asked similar questions.
When you talk about the flood, I assume you are talking about the story of Noah and the ark. First what you should know is that many of the stories in the Bible, especially the Old Testament, are make to help people understand a concept, but are not necessarily what really happened. For example, most Christians do not believe God created the world in seven days. The point of that story is to tell people that God did create and that it took time. However, the people from Biblical times, had no idea how long it really took and would have had trouble grasping the concept of millions of years.
Similarly, the story of Noah is not believed to be true. Christians believe God has the power to flood the entire earth, but the point o the story of the Ark is to warn people of the wrath of God, but it also shows God’s forgiving nature and His love for us because he would not wipeout the human race entirely. It is believed that this story is actually adopted from the story of Gilgamesh, which came from an earlier civilization.
As the question 6, once again I can not speak for all Christians, but I have always been taught to question and challenge my faith. All my life, I have asked questions like yours, and many more. I believe that by doing so, I am able to truly understand and defend what I believe. The Church does not want its members blindly following because they were told to do so. The Church wants people to understand and truly know what each individual believes. There is nothing wrong with exploring, thinking and questioning one’s faith.
I hope this has been helpful.
Oh no, James left. Guess It’s back to T.V. for me. Damn it..
I totally had the same thought just now…it was much more interesting then daytime tv.
“Not all Christians will agree with me, because there are many types of Christianity and each has slightly different beliefs.”
The fact that Christians can’t seem to agree on a lot of things doesn’t lend to the credibility of the Bible. In fact, to me it would seem to detract from its credibility. This is the same standard I would use for any information I was considering.
“When you talk about the flood, I assume you are talking about the story of Noah and the ark. First what you should know is that many of the stories in the Bible, especially the Old Testament, are make to help people understand a concept, but are not necessarily what really happened. For example, most Christians do not believe God created the world in seven days. The point of that story is to tell people that God did create and that it took time. ”
So why is this story figurative when the story of Jesus is considered literal? The writers didn’t seem to denote which parts were allegorical or figurative, so where are you getting this information? If the Bible itself does not say so, who are you, the creation, to question the creator in its meaning?
“Similarly, the story of Noah is not believed to be true.”
By you, no. By others, yes.
“Christians believe God has the power to flood the entire earth”
So why don’t you believe in the flood? You say that you believe God can do those things, but how could you believe this without believing it had occurred at some point?
“but the point o the story of the Ark is to warn people of the wrath of God”
The all-loving wrath of God? Wrath is not synonymous with benevolence nor love. Does it not sound paradoxical to say that people need to be WARNED about this all-loving God? So they, in essence, can protect themselves from him.
“but it also shows God’s forgiving nature and His love for us because he would not wipeout the human race entirely.”
What crimes had the people of earth committed that they DESERVED TO DIE by drowning? What crimes had the newborn’s committed when the flood’s tore down their homes and washed them away? So it’s FORGIVENESS he’s showing when he chooses not to drown EVERY person? A man who in a group of 20 people who murders all but one, is not forgiving for having saved the one. He is still a murderer.
“It is believed that this story is actually adopted from the story of Gilgamesh”
Why isn’t it believed that the story of Jesus is similarly adopted from another culture’s mythic tale, given this obvious evidence? Why single out the creation story and the Ark story and deny evidence that your claim may similarly apply to God and Jesus themselves?
As for faith, plenty of people have it such as Muslim’s in Allah, and Zoroastrian’s in the Creator Ahura Mazda. Do you think Muslim’s also question their faith and, if so, why is it that so many continue to be Muslim. You must admit, that because of your exploration and questioning, you have found that Christianity is the truth and you understand it better as a result. However, the exact same thing is occurring in the Muslim’s, they explore, question and find Islam to be truth and obtain a better understanding as a result.
To you, their exploration and questioning is continuously leading them falsely. Thus, exploration and questioning do not necessarily imply that your belief is truth, or that your inner thoughts help to crystallize truth. Rather, it seems to imply that it is a mechanism of rationalization, as even false beliefs are affirmed by questioning/exploration.
Didn’t intend for this to be so lengthy, thanks for your reply!
Please excuse my poor use of apostrophes.
This just shows that it only takes one asshole to turn something as innocent as that into some huge debate.. Can’t we just follow rule 32 of ZombieLand and just enjoy they little things?
you are a sad, hipocritical, cynical, and all around thoroughly myopic little man. you claim that responses to your opinions are trivial, not actually referring to the topic at hand, while you yourself respond to them in such a manner as well. intolerance is far from necessary to express your beliefs, just as you, yourself, suggest. you look down upon those who argue via the internet, all the while your views have been the sole ignition of this intense and idle debate. if you believe that Julia’s beliefs are so contradictory to other atheists’ opinions, then explain to me where the other dozens of people on this comment thread came from. i won’t sugarcoat my opinions: you are a pathetic and despicable person, and i take pity upon you. i believe that people like you (NOT other people with your beliefs, origin, or ethnicity, but merely others with your MINDSET) are sole reason for counter-productivity in our society.
You accuse me of making insults when you have done nothing else in your entire post. So who’s the pathetic little loser now?
I will make you the offer of a free trip to Brazil. Then we’ll see how you talk in person.
The ball is in your court, you silly little internet coward.
why would someone risk their lives to come see you in person? this is a ridiculous request.
It isn’t a request. It is an offer.
How would they be risking their lives? No one has been threatened with death. Well, I have but, like the other hate mail I have received from theists over the years, it’s just bluster.
Perhaps if you tried reading what is actually written instead of what you prefer to think was posted, you wouldn’t make ridiculous replies.
actually you previously threatened ME, this little random internet person here, previously. It was really sweet and endearing and I felt all warm and fuzzy inside that you gave me that kind of attention <3
oh, to clarify before you do, you didn’t technically threaten me with “death”. but you got HEATED!
No, I didn’t threaten you with death. Instead of “heated”, all I did was give you a factual account of what was likely to happen. That account was based upon prior experience.
As always, your comprehension of what you read is only what you want to believe. That’s a common problem with the reality and mentally impaired. I am not surprised you have it.
MM, I don’t know, as I said in anotherrrr post you made assumptions based off a “previous visit” you apparently had. Because I’m sure there is one person out there nuts enough to visit Jurassic Park!! That’s pretty ignorant, you know, when you ASSUME you make an ass out of U and ME. Geez, sir. HYPOOOOCRITE! AHHHH!
So really, the factual account of Brazilian deportation wasn’t necessary. 😉 Thanks though for letting me know!!!!!
Your ignorance is further exposed by your “Jurassic Park” statement.
Those really were not assumptions. As I stated, they were based on experience with a previous experience.
I have a great idea. Why don’t you accept my offer and come on down? Then you can determine for yourself if I am a liar. If nothing else, you will prove I was wrong when I said you were coward intellectually, ethically, and physically. How could anyone as certain they were so right about everything resist that?
After all, I could be wrong, couldn’t I?
I asked him the same thing!! He’s so fahhhny
You are so stuuuupiiiiddd. You are so stupid you don’t even understand that you are mentally deficient.
omg i know. so so stupid, like the worst. 🙁
I don’t understand all of the anger being passed here. Trying to get a reaction out of another person is just making things worse and everyone keeps ignoring little things they say themselves just to try to make a point. If everyone here really wants people to actually listen well then I would suggest quit with the horrible attacks on people personally it isn’t going to make them listen any better. It will just shoot up wall around all logic and is not conducive to a logical debate.
… You catch more flies with honey.
YOu actually catch more flies with vinegar or apple juice. That’s been demonstrated, too. It was I believe on Mythbusters. It’s just another old wives’ tale like 98% of all religion.
More religious shite.
So there are two possible reasons for this “James” character and his actions:
Number 1: Trolls be trollin’. In that case, he’s just trying to stir shit up for the lulz. Don’t feed the trolls and they’ll go away ladies and gents!
Number 2: He really IS posting his thoughts and beliefs on this thread and putting a DAMN LOT of effort into his attempts to refute and belittle anyone who challenges him.
And I really, really, REALLY hope that it’s number 2. You know why? BECAUSE THAT IS HILARIOUS.
James, dude, are you SERIOUSLY getting this pissy over a COMMENT THREAD? Because if you are taking this much time to return to this page over and over again and leave these essay-length responses to anyone who dares to disagree with you, it means you are sad. You are a very, very sad little man. Clearly, your life is empty and filled with a whole lot of anger and stubbornness. And the fact that you are putting this much time and effort into replying to everyone and insisting that everyone else is ignorant, brainwashed, and whatever other fabulous adjectives you threw in there, it just means that you have nothing else better to do.
Yeah, I took the time to write a comment, which means I have nothing else better to do (duh, I found this on Stumble). But OH look at that: I’m gonna leave now, and not give a fuck as to what your response will be.
I genuinely enjoyed this post and chuckled. way to go random stumbler, way to go.
You guys realize that these are 4-6 year old little kids writing these right? That they aren’t supposed to be taken so seriously? These little kids were told to write a letter to God at Sunday School or something. Obviously whoever told the kids to do this was not “forcing religion down these little kids throats or else you would have seen letters that were extremely more proper and much more robotic.
I don’t think that writing a letter to God when they are 5 is going to seriously scar them for the rest of their lives. Like any other person they will grow up and make a decision on their own on what and what not to believe.
I want to say all of those who were hurt by religion that as a believer I am sorry. Throughout history there has been atrocious crimes against humanity all in the name of “religion.” But let me assure you that even if there was no religion in this world whatsoever, these radicals would find another reason to harm human life and probably commit the exact same crimes. It is for the most part a scapegoat for nutcases who want to have extreme amounts of power to control others to do what they want them to do.
If you even read a bit of Jesus’ teachings in the Bible, he roamed around with people that society had outcasted or turned away from. (i.e. lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes, ect.) He said THE most important rule was to love your brother and treat him how you would like to be treated, NO EXCEPTIONS! He said to love your enemy and pray for those who mean to do you harm. This is the man I try to emulate in my life and who most Christians try to also.
I’m sorry if you have had bad experience with Christians or any religion for that matter. Do not let the choices of a few mask the good that millions of regular religious people do everyday. Life is too short to hate.
You guys realize that these are 4-6 year old little kids writing these right? That they aren’t supposed to be taken so seriously? These little kids were told to write a letter to God at Sunday School or something. Obviously whoever told the kids to do this was not “forcing religion down these little kids throats or else you would have seen letters that were extremely more proper and much more robotic.
I don’t think that writing a letter to God when they are 5 is going to seriously scar them for the rest of their lives. Like any other person they will grow up and make a decision on their own on what and what not to believe.
I want to say all of those who were hurt by religion that as a believer I am sorry. Throughout history there has been atrocious crimes against humanity all in the name of “religion.” But let me assure you that even if there was no religion in this world whatsoever, these radicals would find another reason to harm human life and probably commit the exact same crimes. It is for the most part a scapegoat for nutcases who want to have extreme amounts of power to control others to do what they want them to do.
If you even read a bit of Jesus’ teachings in the Bible, he roamed around with people that society had outcasted or turned away from. (i.e. lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes, ect.) He said THE most important rule was to love your brother and treat him how you would like to be treated, NO EXCEPTIONS! He said to love your enemy and pray for those who mean to do you harm. This is the man I try to emulate in my life and who most Christians try to also.
I’m sorry if you have had bad experience with Christians or any religion for that matter. Do not let the choices of a few mask the good that millions of regular religious people do everyday. Life is too short to hate.
Oh shut up everyone. This wasn’t meant to start a religious debate. This is adorable, funny and it goes to show how innocent kids still can be. I think this is so sweet. It’s really sad that some people can’t take a break and just laugh at the litte things. I wish people didn’t feel the need to argue literally, everything.
I think this is a great post. It’s funny, it’s cute and it makes me realize that the little things in life matter most. Thank you.
Troll + Food = Happy Troll
Troll – Food = Happy everyone else
Yes, just shut up! When you see something you don’t like, tell them to just shut up. Free speech isn’t for everyone, is it? Especially for those horrible godless atheists.
Here’s a news item for you. We are all godless because there is no god. Some of us just happen to know that and can live with it without pretending it isn’t true. Theists deny the obvious and waste their lives and resources in denial.
My point was, these kids are so young, they don’t know better whether to believe in God or not. I believe in God and I practice my religion. I’m only 19 and I’m disgusted by the ignorance of some of the grown adults that are arguing over whether God exists. That wasn’t the point of this post.
Sorry James, but you’re very ignorant. So someone believes in God, get over it. Just because you don’t and you can’t put your ignorance aside, is really sad. You can’t convince someone who believes in God, to not believe in God so there isn’t a point in you trying. Not to mention the fact that they’re not going to listen to some random guy who’s being an asshole to everyone over the internet. You’re just being an instigator. The same goes for everyone else who’s trying to.
The point of this post was to be cute and funny – not to start a whole argument. CLEARLY these kids don’t know any better whether to believe in God. And my point is, if someone believes in God, let them. They probably don’t agree with people not believe in God but who frickin cares! No one is going to convince someone out of their beliefs via this post.
YOu cal me ignorant. I am not the one believing in an imaginary god without on iota of proof of it.
If you were not willfully ignoring anything that doesn’t say what you want to believe, you would have noted that I have repeatedly said I do not care what anyone believes. I do care when they use those beliefs to enact their “faith” into laws that force others to follow the same delusions.
I have also said many times on here that I do not expect to convince any believers. To quote. “you cannot reason a person away from a position the did not reach through reason.”
If I am being an asshole what do you think your arrogant post is? You are demanding that I surrender my right of free speech to accommodate your beliefs.
No one is forcing you to read anything. But you want to force others to stop posting. In your mind, that is OK.
You ignore the facts to maintain your religion. You also ignore the fact that no one on here has ever proven that so much as one word I have posted is not true. Like you, they whine, moan, and complain, but it changes nothing. If you don’t like what I say, demonstrate with verifiable evidence that I am wrong. Or, you could just stop reading and answering. I have told others that, but you ignore that, too. Is it any surprise that “ignore” and “ignorant”have the same root?
You literally just proved my point. Thanks bro.
I proved your point only if it was that you are a willfully ignorant person that believes you are the head web Nazi that is supposed to tell everyone else what to do and say.
Show that anything I have said is not true. But you ignore that like you ignore everything else that is a little difficult for you to understand.
If any point has been proven, it is mine that you are determined to be arrogant about your ignorance and will never respond intelligently to anything. You may think of that as an insult, but it is what you have demonstrated about yourself. If you don’t like it, perhaps you should simply slink away like so many others.
Facts, proof, rational replies, all of the things that are dangerous to any religion. That’s what I am asking for from you and everyone.
PS- you’re not horrible for being an atheist, you’re horrible being a troll.
And you are horrible for being a semi-illiterate that cannot think of anything other than “troll”. I am not a troll for stating nothing but the truth. You are so arrogant in your ignorance that you refuse to acknowledge or even recognize that no one has proven that anything I have said is not the truth.
How am I a semi-illeterate exactly? Please PLEASE let me know, I’m so offended!! For the MILLLLLIONTH time GEEZ, I am not attacking your atheist views, I really don’t give a shit if you’re a buddhist, catholic, jewish american princess or worship the devil sir. I never said you were a liar have I? No, so please don’t use those same words on me that you do other people that don’t like atheism on here. I have very good friends who are atheists! And they’re great. Good for them for believing what they want, they’re not wrong, I don’t assume I’m right in my religion either, which you still don’t know what I am either. I’m pretty passive actually when it comes to religion, I think it’s great everyone has something they believe in, whether it’s god or nothing. I don’t take the bible literally or worship anyone or preach to anyone. Do your own thing and let other people do theirs is the way I see it!!
Nothing really bothers me on here, it’s just fun to get these angry wild reactions out of you literally over NOTHING!!! Keep them coming sir!
YOu are semi-literate because you cannot think of anything but “troll”. Even that is not original with you, but something you read that looked good to you so you use it because it’s easier than thinking.
When did I say you were attacking my atheism? Again, you are so poor in thinking ability that you can only see things that you hope are there.
I said you were a liar because it’s what you are. It’s not an insult if it’s the truth. You haven’t said I’m a liar for the same reason no one else has proven anything I’ve posted isn’t true.
I doubt you have good friends that are atheists. I doubt that you have any friends at all.
I could not care less about your religion, as I have said here many times. What a person chooses to believe isn’t important to me. I only care when those beliefs affect my life and freedom. Every religion wants to absorb more members. That’s not wrong, either. If they can do it with facts, and the power of logic, good for them. When they do it by forbidding questions, enacting their beliefs into law, and demanding freedom from criticism, and the liberty to brainwash others into compliance, especially using public funds, then there is a problem.
That’s been my entire message here. It’s too bad that you are so determinedly stupid that you refuse to see that or accept it as being a rational, fair attitude.
Is it any wonder I regard you with the contempt you deserve as a liar and intellectual, ethical, and physical coward?
She actually didn’t aim that ‘shut up’ straight at you, it was to ALL of us.
GOSH not everything is about YOU sir!
I never said it was. But this is hardly the first person here to tell me to “shut up”. So I have good reason to assume it is directed at me, while you have little to assume it is not.
“Yes, just shut up! When you see something you don’t like, tell them to just shut up. Free speech isn’t for everyone, is it? Especially for those horrible godless atheists.”
Yes, you were implying it was aimed towards you!! Bahaha hooray. So no, when she says “shut up everyone”, that is not a good reason to assume it was aimed towards you just because others directed it at you. Gotta give everyone a chance!!!!
So much hate :'(
omg, christians are such fools.
so, regardless, ALL christians belive in something that is purely, logical not true. it’s obivous to anyone who spends even a few miniutes honestly thinking about it.
and to those of you who say “well, they’re not hurting anyone” or “those people who … are not real christians” are both idiots and denying the very truth of the matter.
chrisianty has been, and continues to be, a plague on society. christ and your make-belive god has been the reason for everything from the crusades to the salem witch burnings to bombing abortion clinics. and it doesn’t stop there. Sure that my not represent ALL christians, but the fact that this dangerous religion can be used to legitimize any of these atrocities clearly shows that this religion can be interpreted in such a way to make these terrible things okay, and even encouraged.
let’s say there was a club… we’ll call it the C+J club, and we’ll say this club encouraged people to help sick people get better. sounds good on the surface, right? now let’s say they call being gay, sick… now it doesn’t sound so good right? ask anyone in the C+J club and they tell you “we help the sick,” and when confronted with “what about how you treat gay people?” they would have to answer 1 of 2 ways. 1) “i don’t belive they’re sick, and those who do, do not represent ALL C+J Club members” or 2) “gay people are sick and we should fix them” put that way, nobody would want to be a member of this club, unless you’re a biggot and hate gay people, because either you’re a person trying to defend a club’s belief structure to those who can see that they’re doing wrong, or you’re one of those doing wrong. so either you’re defending those wo do wrong (by defending your club) or doing wrong yourself.
simple.
God is a lie, you’d be foolish to belive it.
read up, and free yourself.
You know people that post comments, like these here, are said to have the lowest IQ. Shit, now I’m one of those idiots.
Come on people…while yes, this was all very interesting to read, I just realized I could have been watching porn and learned more than I did from this discussion.
Now, I’m off to redtube. See ya guys later!
Wow calm down dude.
You are right about those guys. They are all crazy and give Christians a bad name.
Praying for your child rather than use medical facilities is dumb. I don’t really care about religions not paying taxes but I can’t recall ever being exempt from then simply because I’m a Christian.
Personally I don’t agree with homo sexuality but it’s not like I hate them. One of my good friends is a bisexual.
Man I wish I had your faith. It’s pretty awesome
You do get a tax deduction for any contributions to a religious organization. If you didn’t know that, you need to brush up on your tax codes. The religious organization doesn’t pay taxes on those contributions, either. so that money is never taxed and other people have to make up for what you d not pay.
I have said many times here but you choose not to understand. Atheism isn’t “faith”. It is living by truth and rational thinking. Beliefs and faith is rejecting those things in favor of myths, lies, and fairy tails.
Believing in any religion in the face of truth and reason is more than awesome, it is admission of willful ignorance.
James. Fighting online is like racing in the special olympics. Even if you win, you’re still retarded.
Grow up.
You are an idiot. At least your fake ID is accurate. You ARE an idiot. Your comment is neither original or kind. DO you always denigrate and make fun of those less fortunate than you? That sounds very immature to me.
How ironic you should use the insulting phrase, “grow up”when you are clearly a childish fool without originality or the intelligence to even select something less over-used.
Pff this “Youre an idiot” guy just got owned. how dare he make fun of the mentally disabled. Obviously they are the only people that James here accepts because they have a similar I.Q. to him. This guy will obviously know better before he decides to regurgitate something he saw on the internet.
then “your an idoit” has the gall to offer the advice to grow up! What a complete dingus! If you can tell by James is a 70 something year old smiling hat wearing gentleman. To say this man needs to be older is basically telling him to die.
Did you see that James? This guy just sent you a death threat…
Just to let you know you sadistic basterd, James is not going to let you get away with this. If you cant tell by his picture he is an avid hunter or tour guide at A wild animal park it could be either or with that amazing hat. Either way though he is skilled tracker and will hunt your ass down like a lame wildebeast.
Run and hide man, run and hide.
If you are going to indulge yourself in sarcasm, please take some advice from an expert.
First be sure you have your facts correct. I am neither “70 something” nor a tour guide at a wild animal park.
If you wish to denigrate someone, pick on something substantial instead of non-essentials like my hat. All that does is show you can’t think of anything rational to pick on, so have to choose something that really doesn’t matter. Whether you like the hat or not, you must admit, I am not one of those idiots that wear a cap backwards because it’s “kewl”. A cap on backwards looks cute until you are about 5, then it just looks as though you are too stupid to know which way it goes on.
Speaking of getting “owned” look in the mirror.
Well played my good sir, well played.
Yeah if I ever choose to be sacastic i will definitely find an expert to help me out on such a delicate subject.
I apologize about my insane accusation that would infer you were as young as “70 something” Next time i will definitely fact check my statements. As far as you being a tour guide that was my second guess behind avid hunter… Would you happen to be an avid hunter and/or go on safari’s on a daily basis? Because that is the only reason i would see such a need for a preposterous looking hat.
But as far as putting your hat backwards I do not think it would make you super kewl or anything because its a round hat… I think i would look the same backwards as it would forward. But thats just me talking I dont know anything about how you hipsters from the 1930’s like to be kewl.
I don’t know if you were refering to me getting “owned” or not but I can’t really look in a mirror because I also choose to wear the same exact rose colored old lady glasses that you have on. They not only help with my cataracts but they also give me an excuse to give the police when I plow through a redlight and hit some school kids crossing the street.
Thank you for letting me know the error of my ways. Obviously you know what your talking about when it comes to fashion. I will always from now on pay attention to the direction on my face my hat is facing since it is no longer kewl to walk around with my sombrero backwards.
you look like your from Jurassic Park
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Y5TwdoOLPTI/S0-GOWX-oVI/AAAAAAAALgg/mY9h5F3ihko/s400/jurassicpark4.jpg
ROFLMAO!…right?
Ohh, another moron that avoids any substantive issue by picking on a hat or typos. I am soooooo impressed. NOT!
WHOOOOAAAA you totally look like my buddy who played him!!!!!
Did you do that on purpose or do you just always walk around with a big dumb hat like that?
Either way you should look into becoming a look a like!
Why do you keep passionately debating everyone who is against you on this website?
Jeff: Yes, you are another moron that cannot think of anything intelligent to say. So you pick on something totally irrelevant and reveal your stupidity to all. Kiss my ass.
Connor: Why do you care and what business is it of yours? I have answered that question here several times. If you are desperate to know, read until you find it.
I was just curious why you continue to argue the same points continuously with different people even though very few provide somewhat different information to provide a basis for their own beliefs?
This has gotten way out of hand….Its childrens letters to God,So WHAT?!!If it was letters to Santa would there have been a debate at all??Instead ye lot turned something that showed there was some little bit of good left in the world into an example of how messed up and hateful we have become…bad example for the future generation!!!
I wonder what it’s like to be driven by so much hate? To constantly go through your days, plotting and planning cold and troll-like responses. It must be exhausting. How could you be happy, when all you exert is hatred and stubbornness?
Now I know you’re going to have some witty, acidic response to fire back at me, and all that hate you fire off at me will get you off tonight, but I just want you to realize that I pity you. & I know you “won’t care” but I think you should know. These people here responding, atheist or religious, live happy fulfilling lives, but it seems you do not. They have something other than hate to get them up in the morning.
Why are you such a troll? Why are you even responding? If you had actually read the things I wrote and my replies to people you wouldn’t write something so clearly uninformed as “hate”. But it seems that theists are obsessed bit hate. Are you a theist?
Theists are also obsesses with telling everyone “what I want you to realize” and that “I pity you”. SO for you, I want you to know your attitude is arrogant, condescending, and I really don’t care what you allegedly think.
Furthermore, you cannot possibly know that the people on here “live happy, fulfilling lives” or that I do not.
Think about this, your post is filled with unwarranted assumptions and attempts to assign motivations that directly contradict what I have said. Several times I have directly stated that it is amusing to me to observe how many ignorant, ridiculous statements people will make on here. Even after they have been told this, people continue to make me smile or even laugh by posting even more preposterous things. Thank you for starting my day with a smile. You, too have demonstrated the unrelenting arrogance and stupidity of theists.
A couple posts above you were just calling someone stupid for using the word troll and you just used it to “insult” someone else. Maybe you should go look through your old posts to remember what you said and stop being a hypocrite.
It isn’t an insult if it’s true. So many have a hard time understanding that. As for being a hypocrite, I have stood behind every word I have ever said. There are so many, even on here that could give graduate-level courses about hypocrisy. To pick on me is hypocritical, too.
This James guy is a Genius! He gets all of you guys riled up by posting complete nonsense on a random website to argue with people he will never meet!
Its free entertainment. He could be arguing that the sky is brown for all it matters to him. He just wants people to get pissy and argue something ove the internet.
Someone just keep insulting him and his intelligence so I can keep reading this threat.
Everyone follow me:
Jose if you weren’t such an asshole then everyone here could enjoy these little kids writing to God. But instead you had to just shit all over it. Congradulations you ignorant bastard I think you gave a puppy cancer with all of your retarded illogical rants you were trying to pass off as an arguement. I will not only forgive you that you said God doesnt exist but I also will forgive you for being a complete loser that, in between your hardcore masturbation sessions and watching farm animal porn, you choose to spend your meaningless life on a random thread on the internet trying to tell everyone about your “overwhelming” facts. You should spend less time on this website and more time clubing baby seals or telling kids with cancer that their parents don’t really love them and they will die soon, since you have such a way with words. Fall down some stairs into something hard and sharp. Thanks.
What gives you the right to forgive anyone? Similarly, why does YOUR forgiveness matter (to say it does rings of arrogance)?
Examples of good Christian dialogue (courtesy of James is a genius):
“I also will forgive you for:
being a complete loser
your hardcore masturbation sessions
watching farm animal porn
your meaningless life
clubing baby seals
telling kids with cancer that their parents don’t really love them and they will die soon”
You then tell him to:
“Fall down some stairs into something hard and sharp. Thanks.”
Sounds like he’s not the only one who’s going to need some forgiveness.
Glass houses, throwing stones etc..
Ok “ugh” I dont know what this whole glass house and throwing stones thing is but it sounds like a threat and one thing I dont appreciate is threats pal. James needed forgiveness and he recieved it from me. He is welcome. As for you asking for forgivness along with him, I will allow this one time as a one time “double forgiveness extravaganza weekend.” Your welcome because usually i wouldnt forgive such a pathetic cousin ****ing inbred such as yourself. But i am feeling “God” like this very day. Something you wouldnt know about you godless heathen.
Next time you think about tossing rocks or putting people in glass shanties you should remember that that kind of thing isnt very polite and usually is met with hostility. I have seen people killed and/or horribly disfigured (most often with a extrremely sharp pencil or prison shank) for saying much less.
However if you were to toss marshmallows and adopt kids and put them in a nice fancy glass orphanage then that is a different story altogether.
Just remember to always remember what Jesus would say to someone like me who is trying to spread the good word to people across the internet.
Once again your welcome.
I’m so sending all of this to Oprah.
To Jamses I am a Christian (just thought I should state that first off) and I was just wondering if you like intellectual conversations why did you never answer Kaitlyn back? and yes I did read the ENTIRE conversation on this site so yes I do know this. but also I would like to say that through out this whole conversation you have been calling theists morons and so on. you have also been ridiculing the people on this site (note I did not mention the ones outside this site because I don’t know that information[and given they did start it,most of them]) for bashing your lack of belief and your wanting tolerance but you give none in return. I loved reading you thoughts please share them but please do not call all Christians morons becase that hurt very much and you have not met all the Christians in the world. I do not wish to anger you because I was taught to respect my elders. And I also wish to apologise for the people on here for being rude and hateful to you.
Dear James;
May God have mercy on your sad, sad soul.
I just wanted to say that i go to catholic school was raised half jewish half Christian and to accept the power and holiness of nature. I believe in the power of fate and morality. But i don’t think that anyone should be viewed as stupid or ignorant because the choose to follow or not follow religion. By forcing others to believe what you do causes you to look like a fool. although debate is a productive tool for reasoning, for it to work correctly “simply stating fact” which comes across as rude and hurtful is not helpful on either side. I am saying that neither side of the argument is in the gold here because both have resorted to word violence, immediately disgracing themselves. There are points in the bible or torra or Koran or any other religious scripture where I feel that reasonably we can guess that the exact thing didn’t happen. however when we look at any tale this happens, dragons may not exist, but they tough me that i can overcome the most dangerous and scary monster, in that alone i find them valuable. One of the most scientifically reasonable girls I know is also the most religious, she understands that when the bible was written it was being used to explain phenomenon that are now explained by science. I am stating all this to say that maybe I don’t agree with you, I will not pretend that i read everything that was written because lets be serious… but I think that although religion can be blamed for some for the evil in the world it can also be granted with some of the peace, for very clearly it is stated that tho shale not kill.
ps i purposely left a large amount of grammatical errors because I think that we should look past the flaws of quick fingers and look more at the words one is trying to speak also im dyslexic so i have a hard time spotting them 😛
hmmm….. You can probably tell how i feel about this based on my name.
Yes, I can. You can probably tell how I feel about whatever you allegedly think by my previous posts. I only respect people with rational mental processes who have the courage of their convictions and are willing to engage in honest discussions. You do not qualify on anything in your post.
I don’t think according to you anyone matches up to your intellect. That’s called arrogance. Sorry to break it to you but I doubt you are smarter than EVERYONE on this website and you would be delusional to believe that.
Tel me, Bree. Exactly when have I said that? I do think it is obvious that I have made better use of my intellect than many on here.
Perhaps you should go back and read my posts a little more objectively. You are so determined that I am a horrible person and am wrong about everything that you cannot be “fair and balanced” in your evaluation of what I post. It seems you start out with a conclusion then interpret everything you read so it supports that conclusion.
I may have to change my atheism position. Over the weekend I personally saw solid proof of the power of prayer!
Here, the national sport is futebol. (soccer in America) I saw and heard with my own eyes and ears, no second-hand reports, several people praying for their team to win. This team, although not the favorites, did win!
The laws of probability and physics were suspended in their favor. Even though, around the world, 27,000 children were dying of starvation and malnutrition at the same time the game was being played. You can’t explain that!
If you don’t believe me, I can show you the very stadium where the game was played!
Dude, you’re a total dick.
Another well-thought-out, totally brainless comment from some one whose very words show that they are a jerk.
I am a “total dick” because I inject some humor and always tell the truth? What does that make you?
I can tell you. You’re another internet coward, hiding behind a fake ID to say things you would never dare say to my face.
You are a disgusting example of a human being. Even so, you have an opportunity to do two wonderful things for everyone.
You can raise the average IQ of the human race and improve the manners and civility of mankind by one simple act.
Jump of a cliff. Or accpet my offer of a free trip here.
I am confident that a yellow-bellied mental case like you would never have the courage or decency to do either.
I applaud you and your efforts of sitting on this website for hours at a time waiting for someone else to get upset over something you said. That takes dedication and commitment. In the words of the ever blessed Richard Dawkins: “Fuck bitches, get money”.
You expose your own ignorance. No surprise at that on this site. I don’t have to sit on this site, you moron, I have notification set.
I couldn’t care less if people get upset. If you didn’t have the comprehension deficit of the year, you would have noticed that it is low-level entertainment for me to point out the ignorance and stupidity of people like you.
You are also a liar. Richard Dawkins never said that. But you are far too stupid to understand that no one would fall for such a blatant lie.
Here’s my quote for you. “Just when you think someone can’t get any more ignorant, they come back and show you that they can be a lot more ignorant than you thought.”
Thank you for confirming that for me. 🙂
Hmmm I never knew God said the world would be perfect. Where in the Bible or anywhere it says that everyone in the world would be free of suffering. Even God’s own son Jesus was crucified.
How does that prove any point whatsoever? I prayed that I would come home and my wife had made me dinner! WHOA the power of prayer!
It doesnt work like that and your arguement is extremely flawed.
But are you handing out trips to Brazil? Because I would be totally interested in that.
I think you missed the point. That was satire. But missing the point and failing to recognize facts is how you theists continue to believe in the impossible, improbable, and ridiculous.
Sure, come on down. Then we’ll see if you want to talk to me to my face as you do on here. Your risk, my fun.
Let’s not kid anyone. You have no intention of confronting me personally. You only hope you can get me to send you the money or a refundable ticket because what passed for ethics with you permits lying and cheating a “godless atheist”. I am not stupid enough to do that. The ticket would be electronic and only refundable to me when you didn’t show up. How is your interest now?
I think that was exactly your point. You said the power of prayer helped people’s football teams win but could not help starving children in Africa right?
How is it as crazy to think that we were all devinely put here then it is to think we were all somehow put here by a giant mistake?
It seems as though the world is so logically put together and explainable according to anyone that is able to understand science. But how is it so perfect? It is hard to believe that we are just a mistake that is a result of billions of years of evolution and a cosmic blast that just so happened to land us at an exact point in an infinite space.
That just takes just as much “faith” to believe that as to believe a diety put together all of that to create us.
Please do not create another ad hominem debate, just debate the issue.
P.S. Why do want someone to fly down to visit Brazil to debate an issue on the existence of God? Do you not have enough people in Brazil to debate that issue with? Im being honest with you in saying it sounds a little creepy.
HAHAHAHA I loved that. Thank you for making my day James. And I completely agree with everything you believe in.
and in response to “a free trip to brazil?”…the world is NOT perfect, we are NOT made perfectly. for example, we have a number of vestigial structures in the human body that serve no prupose, yet we were created to be perfect? If you knew anything about science, you would understand that.
The problem is that ‘creationists’ think backwards…ponder this, you see a puddle on the side of the road. If thinking from a creationist point of view, you would say to yourself, wow..that puddle fits flawlessly that hole. that water must have been made perfectly to fit in that hole! In reality, the water conformed and changed to fit that hole…
Thanks for the reply. Although I disagree about “beliefs” That is what theists have, beliefs because they have no foundation in verifiable facts.
The world is not perfect? What does that have to do with inviting people to speak to me to my face the way they do on here?
You are correct about the vestigial organs, such as the appendix, tail, and others. Those alone seem to be proof of evolution, although creationists would deny it as they do any other fact that does not match their delusions.
“If I knew anything about science”? What makes you think that I do not? I have been a technical writer for IBM, Hughes Aircraft, and many companies in computer-related and aerospace fields. How could I not know anything about science? Most of my life has been involved with science.
Yes, I have heard that puddle in the hole story many times. It is a goof illustration of the fallacy that the world was created for humans. It ignored the obvious fact that most of it is uninhabitable for humans without high-technology protection. That’s one more fact ignored by creationists, no?
Get a job, your like what the pope would spit if he had gave nietzche a blow job
BTW, it’s “you’re” not “your”. And your comment is the typical juvenile retort I have come to expect from immature, brain-damaged jerks.
I have had more and better jobs that a nut-case like you will ever have. FYI, I am an IBM retiree, owned martial arts and Nautilus fitness canters, have been a technical writer for computer industry and aerospace firms, and a consultant to police forces in the USA< Mexico and Brazil.
Do you feel stupid enough yet? I have plenty more for you if you need your masochistic impulses fed.
James, I have to giggle a little bit. I read up top you said something to the effect of “Juvenal avoidance of the issue at hand” because someone pointed out your typing errors.
I don’t mind them, I think they’re cute. I do them too.
But why it’s so funny is you’ve completely got out of hand yourself. This original post was a funny little thing about kids being dissapointed in the god that their parents gave to them. Now you’ve just painted yourself as a faux-intellectual with a false sense of superiority because your opinions are “right.”
Also, please note, these are all your opinions. And I find it silly that you’re fighting with a bunch of atheists. They have the same idea of your opinion too. Didn’t you ever have a gym class when you were a kid? Remember when your teammates would get pissed because you wouldn’t pass the ball to them? They’re all on your side.
For Giminey’s sake, come back down to earth. That goes for all of you. Remember rule of the internet #19, “the more you hate it, the stronger it gets.”
So, James Smith Joao Pessoa of Brazil. Get over yourself. The internet hates you. That makes you strong. I await your retort.
My, aren’t you the arrogant little twit? YOu know everything and are entitled to tell everyone what to do. If that’s what you can do, then you must grant me the same privilege.
Opinions? I deal in facts. Tell me one word I have posted that was not correct. I have said this before and no one has even responded. So you wonder why that is?
The internet cannot hate me. The internet is a vast network of computers, links and lines. It is not self-aware or intelligent. Very much like you. LMAO!
Well, we could even simply just look at this reply to my post, as a start. Then after that, I’ll bring your very first post down here, just so we can look at the root of the problem.
“arrogant little twit”= opinion. You cannot prove I’m an arrogant little twit. Others may think differently.
“You know everything and are entitled to tell everyone what to do.” = opinion. While I appreciate the thought, I really don’t know everything. And that’s my opinion, feel free to feel differently (or not, I can’t tell you what to do after all)
“The internet… is not self-aware or intelligent. Very much like you.” Again, opinion. The reasons why should be self evident.
Now, all of these remarks were simply defense against your silly little attacks, so I’m going to bring your very first post down here that started it all and show you how much of what you say is complete and total poppy-kosh.
“more examples of children being brainwashed”
“religion based on lies”
“So many of them learn to lie so well”
“Crimes against humanity created by religion”
First of all, religion can not commit a crime, it is a non-physical idea and is not self-aware or intelligent.
Also, until I see the data that children become brainwashed by religion, I really can’t take that one as a fact. I was born and raised in a Christian home, but I left the religion because of how annoying the activists are. However, just because they choose to raise their children in the way that they believe is correct, does not mean they are trying to brainwash the child.
For example, say a child is born to a family of psychologists. They all firmly believe that Nature has a stronger role in the personality of a human and are making a living by researching for proof. However, as the child grows older, he decides for himself, even though his parents don’t believe it, that Nurture probably has more to do with it. So he starts researching it himself. He was never brainwashed, he was just raised on one idea. It’s possible to change. Therefore, that statement is an opinion.
Number two, religion based on lies.
I once watched an interview with Ayn Rand and some big important religious leader person. She said something very unintelligent, which upset me, but it gives me a good quote to use here. This is paraphrased of course, I can’t exactly remember what she said, “I should not be asked to disprove something. If it cannot be seen, touched, tasted, smelled, or heard, then it does not exist.”
Well, if you want to go by this, then you, James, do not exist. And this can be scientifically proven according to one of the greatest atheists in the world. But it simply doesn’t work like that, does it? Of course you exist, you here typing back to me, aren’t you?
So even if the burden of truth does lie on the religious, that doesn’t mean we can absolutely say that they’re wrong or that they’re lying; we simply choose to believe that there is no god. Let’s live and let live.
Number three, learning to lie.
Again, no empirical evidence. No physical tests to be done, no data to be taken. And hell, if you really want to get into it, a person that does the religion right shouldn’t lie at all. So, because I have the ability to say that you’re wrong and have just as hard of a time proving it, due to the fact that it’s also an opinion, makes your opinion an opinion as well.
So James, you’re right. The internet may not hate you. But perhaps a lot of it’s users do. I know I don’t though. But it really is a shame to see an older gentlemen who did so many great things with his life get on the internet to do something like your doing. Your time on this earth is limited, and if the religious people are wrong, then let them be. They’re going to the same place as you. And if you can’t stand what they do against humanity, then teach them how to follow the religion in the way that it was meant to be followed according to the new testament. If you could do that, you could both have your cake and eat it too.
Lets find a way to make everyone happy, James. Weed out the lies placed in the religious community. Learn the new testament. Use their weapon against them to try to bend them to be better people. If they are still religious, but living to better the world and not impose their ideas, then what does it matter?
Can you tell me one offence to humanity these children who wrote these letters committed? I see no harm in a letter to god.
As I expected, you made a long, rambling reply without proving a thing. What you say is my opinion are statements of observed fact. For example, that you are a brainless twit. Your own post demonstrate that.
I asked you to prove that one word I have written is not true. Also as I expected, you ignored that and inserted more pointless rambling of your own.
Skipping all of your nonsense, let’s get to the brainwashing. If you knew how it worked, you wouldn’t say the indoctrination of children is not brainwashing. Yes, other beliefs can be brainwashed into them too. Here is how brainwashing works.
The desired beliefs are repeated frequently.
The beliefs are not permitted to be questioned.
The recipient is required to repeat the beliefs by rote.
Pressure from superiors and peers is applied to ensure compliance.
That is exactly how religion is taught to children.
You can find a way to make me happy. either start being rational or STFU.
I have never said the letters were an offense to humanity. That is simply a lie from you. Nor is there arm in a letter to god. I never said that, either. It is you that is a deluded liar.
And I quote, “More examples of children being brainwashed into a religion built on lies. Is it any surprise that so many of them learn to lie so well. Never mind the ones that are delusional for the rest of their lives. Those are just more crimes against humanity committed by religion.”
You did say it, buddy. It was actually the first thing you said.
And you’re right about the brainwashing, kudos to you. But in that case, you could say I learned history in the same way, is history a lie too?
Regardless, the burden of proof doesn’t lie on me, sir. It’s up to you to prove what you say. You’re the one saying it. So I would like some links, some studies, anything to show that every single religious person is a liar.
If you knew how opinions worked, you probably wouldn’t be saying half the things your saying
Opinions can’t be proven
Opinions differ from person to person
Opinions can easily be fought over for centuries.
Also, I’m trying to hold a decent conversation with you. I just want us to come to an agreeable stalemate, so if you could please discontinue the insults. It’s upsetting and does not provide to your argument. All it does is empower me. If you want me to believe you, then prove that you can respect another human being… otherwise you’re just proving that you really have nothing to say, you’re only saying it in a way that will get people to listen to you.
One more little thing. Isn’t it interesting how it’s always the religious people that mention hate? For something that is supposed to be about peace and love, theists seem to be obsessed with hate. The bring it into the conversation frequently and practice it in their daily lives. But then, hypocrisy and religion are semantically equal, as I have said before.
Note by blog listed below. In it, I recommend that we not worry about whether jesus existed and instead concentrate on the messages of tolerance, (“let he who is without sin, cast the first stone”) love and peace. But that isn’t good enough for most christians. Everyone has to conform to their interpretation of the bible. And yes, I have read it several times, both old and new testaments and find it is nothing more than a badly-translated, politically edited, collection of myths and lies.
Again, you spout total nonsense. What you choose to believe are insults are statements of the facts I have observed.
You have an opinion that you have yet to back up with facts.
Until you do, you are not holding a conversation, you are attempting to lecture.
Until you bother to produce fact instead of ranting about how you don’t like my facts, don’t bother replying.
You have earned every “insult” by your own statements. You assume I, or anyone cares about what passes for thinking with you.
I know most here do not care what I say, that doesn’t bother my. It amuses me when people like you respond with increasingly ignorant remarks and evade direct questions and challenges.
I have said that here many times but it seems a few have a hard time comprehending that. Well, that’s not a surprise. When they are unable to comprehend anything else that doesn’t agree with their brainwashing, how could anyone expect them to understand that?
Firstly, thank you for not insulting me, I appreciate it.
Secondly, yes, the bible is poorly translated and politically edited. But if you really think about the story of Jesus, would you reprimand him for anything he did? Honestly, I think he was an okay guy. If people were more like him, then people would be happier and better people.
And unfortunately, what you said about religious people hating more often then not is somewhat true. But again, that doesn’t mean they are all like that. Just the ones who have no idea what they’re doing.
Again, I’m standing beside my opinion that if religion were done right, living your life like Jesus from the New Testament, then the religious people would not be such a bother. So again, I implore you, teach them what it means to be a good person, if you have to manipulate their own brainwashing, so be it. Teach them how Jesus really lived, ignore everything else in the bible, just teach them the best way to live.
People are more apt to listen to you if they think you’re agreeing with them, so let them think that. Calling them mindless twits isn’t going to help them. No one likes feeling stupid. So let them feel smart, then you can use your own intellectual superiority to steer them in the right direction.
James, I’ve decided that you’re an okay guy, you’re just going about things wrong… So just try out my theory for a while. See how it goes for you. If you want to preach against hate, start by loving.
Oh, nevermind, I though you went a whole response without insulting me.
I can’t prove my opinions, and if you want to call what you say facts, then so be it. But you still can’t prove it. You sit here rambling how wrong people are. How they can’t prove anything they say. How it’s complete nonsense. Yet suprizingly, it’s all you keep saying. I honestly don’t think you have anything to back you up, you’re doing exactly what you’re accusing others of doing. Evading.
Give me proof, or there is none.
You haven’t shown me a single thing you said to be true. You just insult and hide behind your endless loop of perceived ignorance. Everything that comes from your mind to this page is complete garbage because nothing is anything but attacks and insults.
So, it’s already established that I’m a mindless moron, now prove to me that you aren’t.
And just so you know, insulting me in this next post just proves my point. Telling me my opinions are wrong proves my point. Saying everything you’ve spoken is truth without evidence proves my point. Why you may ask? Because it just goes to show that you can’t really defend yourself. It just goes to show that everything you say is mindless angry rambling. It just goes to show that you’re afraid of loosing to a 19 year old.
To me, sir, you’re just as bad as the religious… Militant egotism is the worst disease a person can have.
Doing things like Jesus? “I come n in in peace but with a sword”?
You can live like the jesus myth said only if you pick and choose your verses. That’s what most theists do anyway.
Again, I never said ALL christians are obsessed with hate. What I said was, when it is brought up, why is it always by a christian? Why is it that the religious people of any stripe are flying planes into buildings, murdering gays and “heretics”, demonstrating their intolerance, bombing family planning clinics, shooting doctors, and assaulting those that do not fit their idea of what should be?
Everything I say is mindless angry rambling? Again, prove one thing I have posted is not true. You can ignore that forever and all it proves it that you know I am right but are afraid to admit it.
Militant egoism? What a crock you are. Come on, either prove something right or wrong or just slink away and pretend you “won”.
When have I said that your opinions are wrong? I have only said to prove them correct or to prove anything I have written is not true. You have done neither, so my statements stand.
Give me a verse where Jesus gets upset with a person that claims no religion. If you do, you win that argument.
And you keep saying my opinions are mindless rambling, so yes, you imply that their wrong. What sort of mindless rambling is right?
And I already told you, I’m not interested in proving you wrong. I’m interested in you proving you right. You haven’t done that either. And you can’t.
I can’t prove you wrong because everything you say is an opinion. You can’t prove them right for the same reason.
So please, prove yourself right, or you’re only providing evidence to my opinion that you’re a militant egotist. Therefore proving one of my opinions right, therefore proving that I’m probably more credible than you are.
Also, I’d like for that verse to come from Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John. That’s the only time where Jesus walked the earth in a physical body. So if they come from there, it’s more powerful. The other books are just people talking about what they think their god would say.
“If no one can change your mind, what makes you think you can change anyone else’s?”
No one is going to win.
I’m still having fun though ;3
When did I say jesus gets upset with a person that claims no religion? Again, you are making up something to try to prove you are right. I said that everything attributed to jesus was not peace and light.
I don’t have to prove anything. I am not the one making absurd claims. If what I am saying is opinion, you should have no problem proving it is wrong. If it is fact, keep avoiding as you have been is evidence that I am right.
Jesus never walked the earth. As I have said before in here and elsewhere. There is not one contemporary account of any jesus. The first mention is in Mark, written from 40 to 100 years after the alleged facts, depending upon which biblical scholar you believe.
The Romans, who otherwise kept excellent records make no mention of someone who was supposed to have such great social, political, and religious influence. No mention of feeding multitudes, walking on water, raising the dead, nor of any trial and execution.
You still avoid every point. That proves my point. Case closed. I won’t waste my time with such a simple-minded intellectual coward again.
I keep fucking telling you that I can’t prove you wrong or right because they’re OPINIONS. It’s so sad that such an old man doesn’t even understand the difference between that and a fact.
You said “Come n in in peace but with a sword” when I mentioned living like Jesus. So yes, you suggested that he is a violent person. He gets upset with those who claim his own religion.
And I’m sorry for my misspeak, he probably didn’t walk the earth. But theoretically, lets say the character did. Jesus the character was still a good guy.
And by the way, if you’re going to insult me, do it properly. I can’t be simple-minded and intellectual at the same time.
And for Christ’s sake, shrink that head of yours, we don’t need a second Jupiter sized object floating around in our solar system. Then again, it may be nice to have the sun suck you in.
Get fucked.
http://www.blueq.com/shop/item/114-productId.125837696_114-catId..html
hey! I think James is a witch; lets burn him at the stake!
Yep, violence, even in jest, from a theist. It seems that religion often has to invoke violence in place of facts and reason.
He does have a wart. Let’s compare his weight with that of a duck!
…
ehem.
so.
cute letters, eh guys? they made me chuckle. i’m going to move on with my life now.
🙂
holy shit this james smith tool is a RIOT! I scrolled all the way down to the bottom to see how long he’s been at this.
we get it. you’re right and everyone else is a big dumb theist or something.
what’s funny to me is that someone who knows there is no afterlife would spend so much of their precious time on earth arguing with teenagers on the internet. im pretty sure even richard dawkins would find that, after some extensive emperical scientific research, you are a HUGE DOUCHE BAG.
Lol, small world James. I seem to be running into you everywhere, though it’s usually after the fact. You may remember me as that fellow debater on GodlessBlogger.com.
Anyway, my comment for these pictures is that the funny thing is that those are essentially the same prayers that many adult Americans give. While most Americans are Christian, only a very small few actually know anything about their religion.
IMHO James problem is not that he’s for or against religion. It’s cultural. He is a typical Brazilian. I have experienced many like him. They are pushy, self centered egotistical boors. I have my own opinion on these things and will now take them in my own direction. Bye.
First, you are a liar. You have never met a Brazilian in your life.
Second, I have lived here for over eight years and can safely say that Brazilians and generally more relaxed. polite people than for example, you.
Finally, I am an American who has lived many places including seven US states, Quebec, and Holland before Brazil. So I suspect I know a bit more about cultural differences than you will.
Speaking of egotistical bores (not boors) You seem to fit that very well. Perhaps you are projecting your own faults on others? That seems to be a common failing of the mentally deficient.
Can’t prove he hasn’t met a Brazilian.
You’re a liar, you’ve never lived in America, you were born on mars, and you’ve only been in Brazil for two months, duh. This statement is obviously true because I said it.
Also, I know more about cultural differences than you because I’ve been to Haiti, Quebec, Ontario, Mexico, Illinois, Colorado, New Mexico, Pennsylvania, North Dakota, New York, Main, Virginia, Michigan, Ohio, Kansas, and Nebraska. I’ve also visited towns by the name of Panic, Desire, and Paradise. So I’m obviously smarter than you when it comes to shit like that.
And no, he meant boor, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/boor. Although you do seem to have a bore in you brain (–noun 9. a hole made or enlarged by boring.) And you are a bore (–noun 2. a dull, tiresome, or uncongenial person.) But who’s keeping score huh?
Also, I forgot to mention Minnesota. And I’m also friends with a Chinese foreign exchange student. And I have met many Japanese people through the internet.
FINALLYY!!!! I was gonna say this when i got to the end, James got pwnd.
James,
You really should check the dictionary before claiming that it’s bore instead of boor. A bore is a hole. Boor is correct for what I meant. I have met Brazilians, while working at DisneyWorld, boatloads of them would visit the park on tours. They would cut in line, verbally assault waitpeople, openly throw trash. Generally unpleasant people overall. I do suppose you would be right to say I shouldn’t generalize a whole culture so I will stand corrected. It is you who is a boor.
To bore someone is to be like you, a liar and an idiot.
YOu have never met the first Brazilian. You forget, in your eagerness it be an lying SoS, that I have lived here , know many Brazilians, and have even accompanied them on trips to Disney World. The do not behave as you claim.
I could say that Americans are arrogant, fat, and liars by what I know of you.
No, to bore someone is to be so dreadfully dull or annoying that no one wants to listen to you anymore, much like yourself James.
And an SoS is a type of steel wool with soap in it to clean dishes. Insult better you retarded sack of shit.
And you’re a liar, like I said before, you’ve only been in Brazil for two months, no way did you go to Disney with them. You don’t even know what Disney world is.
And martians are ugly. Stop being so ugly.
You are the lying sack of shit.
I can prove every word I said. Why don’t you accept my offer? I’ll prove some other things, too. But you are nothing more than a lying punk coward. You lack the intellectual. ethical, and physical courage of a tomato.
Join me in a more personal conversation if you dare. I will enjoy it so much, you stinking little worm.
Of all the people that have replied to me on here, you are the one I would most like to confront in person. So either put up or admit everything I have said about your character is true. You are a coward, a liar, and a disgusting example of a human being.
Come on and be amusing in person. No? Did you shit yourself just thinking about it? Well, more fecal matter around you won’t make much difference with what is already there.
Haha, dude, I’ve taken you up on that offer ages ago. I seriously want you to prove yourself right. I’ve been saying that over and over again. I just got tired of your endless loop of ignorance so I decided to play with you. So if I finally have your attention, yes please, I’d like to see the proof.
Also buddy, I gave you a dictionary.com reference, if you feel it’s wrong, look it up for yourself.
Also also, you claim to be from America. So who’s the fat and arrogant liar now?
Also also also, have you met every Brazilian ever?
Also also also also, what is their names?
Also also also also also, proof of you having friends (not on internet) or it’s not true.
Come one dude, stop picking and choosing which of my stuff to respond to.
Kaemon: YOu are such a lousy liar. YOu have never taken me up on any offer.
If you were a something other than an intellectual, ethical, and physical coward, you would have either accepted my offer of a trip here or made me a similar offer to come to you. All you have done is spout lies, evade direct questions, and deny everything I have said without proof. YOu will not come directly on line with me at slrman420 on Yahoo Messenger, you have not called my phone but lied about trying it.
You have also brought my deceased mother into this. If anyone needed proof of what a miserable little snot rag you are, that should do it.
The only thing I don’t understand is why your own family has not made you vanish. They surely must be shamed and embarrassed to have you around.
Yes, I am from America. As always, you cannot understand the difference between a hypothetical statement and reality. What I said (and I’ll type slowly so maybe even you can understand) “I could claim that Americans are fat and arrogant but that would not make it true.” But to you, if you say something, no matter how blatantly false or ridiculous, it automatically becomes fact.
Come on with me on Yahoo Messenger as I have repeatedly asked. I’ll furnish you with my Brazilian ID that shows the date of entry. I’ll prove very word I have said. You won’t do it, of course, because you know it will prove you are a liar and a stinking little coward.
Picking and choosing your stuff. I do admit I concentrate on the most outrageous lies and the more obnoxious statements. But I have other things to do. I know this is hard for you to accept, but the world does not revolve around you and your ostentatious prevarications.
”An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind” – Mahatma Gandhi
Wait….I have a really good idea. Let’s all smoke a blunt. It will make EVERYTHING better. PS- I want to go to Brazil…SO MUCH.
Then come on down. I can even get you a blunt.
Here’s someone that puts it so much better than I can.
http://nogodz.wordpress.com/2011/07/05/i-the-atheist/#comments
WARNING: It might cause the religiously inclined to doubt their concept of what is atheism. Your beliefs will be exposed to facts and rational discourse. That’s very hazardous to any religion.
“If you could reason with theists, there wouldn’t be any theists.” – Dr House
It’s nice to see you actually admit that you don’t know shit.
When did I do that? Again, you only understand what you want to. That’s evidence that you are a moronic asshole.
What I said, was that this person expressed it better than I do. But you are too stupid to comprehend that, aren’t you? That was a rhetorical question so don’t bother answering. All you’ll do is reveal yourself to be even worse than you have so far.
You’re the moronic asshole, moronic asshole. And of course he knows how to express it better than you, I could have someone explain it to me in Finnish better than you can explain it. Seriously, stop speaking in Martian. It’s really annoying that I have to keep going back and forth from Google Interstellar Translate all the time.
And the proof is because you have to have someone else speak in your place.
You really do only see things they way you want them to be. I was not having him speak in my place. I was giving that as an example of someone saying what I have been saying but doing it better than I do.
What you’re claiming is like saying a better singer recording a song you have recorded is having them “sing in your place.”
Why are you so determined to demonstrate increasing levels of ignorance?
I’m not the ignorant one here, James. I’m speaking the truth, and the babble that keeps coming out of your mouth is just so silly. And I never said someone had to speak in your place, I was only saying that he was saying the same thing as you, stop being so redundant, you mentally challenged boor.
You did say the reference I gave was speaking in my place.
“Kaemon Rose says:
July 6, 2011 at 9:23 pm
And the proof is because you have to have someone else speak in your place.”
You can’t even keep your own posts straight even when it is right there. You lie so much you even lie about what you said. It’s obvious that you would never tell the truth is you can think of a lie.
You are the mentally challenged asshole. I want to see you face-to-face so badly! It will be one of the happiest days of my life. You do like to make people happy don’t you?
Quit lying, I never said that, you can’t prove it. You made all that stuff up. I only tell the truth buddy.
Also, what the fuck sort of sentence is “It’s obvious that you would never tell the truth is you can think of a lie.”? At least I can form proper sentences, you bloated git.
Wait, James!I see you posted a cell phone number! You’re ok with people calling you? Thanks for responding to me btw =)
Sure I am. If you want to spend the money, speak politely, and don’t behave like so many “good christians” have on here, I’ll talk to you.
Be aware that my phone does record every number that calls it. There is no blocking of numbers here.
Quit lying, you don’t have a phone. Everyone know’s that’s the Rick Roll hotline. Why are you being such an ignorant ass to everyone?
Also, quit saying you can talk. You’re mute. You lost your voice after drinking all that lye your mum gave you for your birthday. I called her and she told me, that’s how I know.
Starting with the country code: 55 83 8721-2630
YOu ugly bastard. My mother has passed away and you are a total asshat for bringing her into a private fight. If you ever decide to be a man and face me personally, I’ll make you pay heavily for that, you shithead. I put my money and my skin where my mouth is, you only hide and shiver in fear.
You are walking a very thin line between obnoxious and being brain dead.
Wow, someone’s got a big mouth. All that workin out make you feel like a big kid now? And if I were brain dead and you beat the shit out of me, wouldn’t that be the same thing as beating the shit out of a mentally retarded person? Which you have already called me multiple times. So in all reality, you’re the asshole.
Also, I called your number. Rick Astley. Seriously dude, quit lying.
Also, we were never fighting. I’m just trying to tell the truth. So if you want to call this a fight, go ahead. I won’t stop you. I just want you to know that when you’re ready to grow up, I’ll be here to talk to you like a real person. But until your gray matter learns how to reproduce itself, I think it’s best you leave the thinking to the big boys. No run along and play with your toy weights.
If I beat the shit out of you, it would take a caravan of semi trucks to carry it all away.
You did not call my number My phone is right next to me. But perhaps you are far too stupid to know how to make an international call? That sounds likely. Almost as likely as you are lying about that the way you do about everything else.
Nor are you trying to tell the truth. I am the only one that has done that. I have challenged you many times to prove that anything I have said is not true. You have ignored that every time because you know you cannot.
Just as you lied about I have only been in Brazil two months. Show me some proof of that. I’ll show you that you are a liar. I have proof. You have bullshit.
Run and hide some more. I know you will never even try to prove anything you have said is not a lie. Your inability to do that is evidence that you are not truthful. If you had proof, you’d furnish it. I have posted where to fins my videos and evidence that I am who and what I say I am. What have you done? Lied some more is all. Put up or shut the fuck up, you little asshole.
You can’t prove that dude has never met a Brazilian.
And I keep fucking telling you, I CAN’T DISPROVE SHIT YOU SAY BECAUSE EVERY GOD DAMN THIS IS AN OPINION!
Seriously dude, try to read what I’m actually saying. If you want me to take it as fact, you have to prove it to me. I can’t be asked to disprove something. That’s silly.
Also, I find it hilarious that you keep saying how violent the religious are, yet you’re the only one here threatening to beat the shit out of anyone. Did you finally lose your temper, old man? It just goes to show that people are people. You can’t pin religion to a person, it’s all what they decide to do with how they were raised and who they decided to be.
Theists can suck. Adding “a” to the beginning to the word makes you just as much asshole potential.
Pardon my error, last line should read “gives” not “makes”.
Also, two posts up should be “thing” not “this”.
Guess what James, I made mistakes x3. But at least I’ll fess up.
Yo, anyone who thinks this James character is a douche, say I… “I”.
What a douche, an amusing douche but still a douche.
… Oh man, I can’t wait to see what this guy James is going to say about me!!!!
Come on buddy, let me have it!! Tear me a new a-hole! This WILL be fun (for me).
“I”m with you Danny.
Sorry, bud. I think I have him covered haha. This guy doesn’t listen to shit. I started playing fire with fire and now he has nothing left.
You still have yet to prove that everything you have said is not a lie.
Danny boy: What would be fun for me will not be a bit of fun for a little shitfaced moron like you. Come on down and I’ll show you. You have no idea who you’re talking to. But you plan on hiding behind the internet forever so you aren’t worried. You are just another yellow-belly semi-literate jerk.
No idea who we’re talking to? On the internet? Dude, no one’s anyone on the internet. Get over yourself. You own a gym or two. You give advice on what the military should do. So what? Doesn’t that just make you a bigger hypocrite? You claim religious are violent, yet you advise violence. You say theists are bullies, yet you train people to be able to kill easier.
But at the same time, military and body building can be used for defense. It’s all who you are. Not what you do with what you were given. You can’t blame the religious for everything that goes wrong in the world. Because no matter what, they’re just people too. They have their own ideas and agendas.
The difference between us is that I am backing up what I say with my money and my skin. You only lie and hide.
When did I say I advised the military? That never happened. It’s either another lie from you (no surprise) or just the meanderings of your diseased mind.
I train people to kill more easily? Take a look at my video at http://www.vimeo.com/16815804 you’ll note that I also taught handicapped people to be less defenseless. But that is probably beyond your comprehension that anyone would go to any effort to help someone less fortunate.
I also never blamed the religious for everything that goes wrong in the world. I said that most of the problems in the world have always been caused by religion. They center around the intolerance, prejudice, and hate taught by many religions.
Evil people will do evil things (like you). Good people will do good things. For good people to do evil things requires religion.
Your agenda seems to be telling lies and hiding from responsibility for your actions. That’s another difference between us. I don’t hide and I take responsibility for what I do and say. When are you going to try that?
So what you’re saying is you’re right because you can beat me up and pay me off? Dude, I’m tired of this little kid’s game. I have yahoo now. Let’s talk. LIKE ADULTS. And if you can behave by the rules of society, I will too. No matter how much you hate me, let’s be civilized. Alright?
Also, you have yet to prove that anything /I/ have said is a lie. You have also yet to prove anything I have said is the truth. So, which is it then? Disprove me, or prove yourself. Either way, I’m calling you out.
If you were not such a coward, you’d come on with me on Yahoo Messenger. I have invited you many times and I can send you all the proof you want on there as you can send proof to me. But you are terrified of even getting that close to me. I can’t reach out through Yahoo and hurt you, other than mentally by demonstrating what a liar you are. So do it or just admit your an ignorant, cowardly, little boy.
I have called you out many times and you ignore that. Do it or shut the fuck up, asshole.
I did prove it only yesterday and with your own quote. You conveniently ignored that, too.
It must be very pleasant to live in a fantasy world where the truth is whatever you want it to be and you never take responsibility for any of your own lies or statements. It is so easy when you can delude yourself into thinking something was never asked, shown to you, or proven to be fact.
Far easier than honesty, thinking and personal responsibility, isn’t it?
Yahoo Messenger? Fine, let me get an account.
There, I’m working on downloading it right now. My username is rosekaemon@yahoo.com.
Also, if you want to go by little thing such as quotes, then I proved you wrong a whole bunch of times.
First of all, your defining of boor and bore was a pile of offal.
(look the word up before you get all indignant)
And secondly, you kept saying the person had never met a Brazilian? What the heck? Do you know the guy personally or something?
hahahahahaha, very nice jimmy, “another yellow-belly semi-literate jerk”, is that all you got? come on buddy boy, looks like your getting soft. i think someone needs to get laid, you have too much anger boy. hey you can tell, i wont tell anyone, your a bottom right? judging by you dumb ass pic, you look like a bottom. oh and by the way, if you pay for my ticket, i will be there. And rose, i like you! your sound like your cool people. and jimbo, JESUS #1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAH AND HA. and your still a douche.
Danny: Your sexual-themed insults are exactly the kind of silly, sophomoric, unoriginal stupidities I expected from you. At least you didn’t disappoint me there.
Done deal I will pay for your ticket. I’ll need the following:
Your real name, address, and phone number.
Your passport number and Brazilian Visa number
Your city of departure
I’ll book an electronic ticket. It will not be refundable by you, but only by me when you don’t show up. You can forget cashing in the ticket and stealing the money. I’m not as stupid as you are.
You can contact me on Yahoo Messenger at slrman420 to provide the information. So what’s your excuse now, you little squirmy worm?
Come on down and try saying that shit to my face.
hahahahahaha, Ohhh looks like jimmy is mad, hahhaha,you wanna know what i like about you? you read one or two paragraphs (about anyone who wrote here) and you assume you know everything about us. that takes a special person my man, guess they got the right person for the job… come on man, we both know that your “offer” is only because i have no intentions of going there. but hey, you claim to be a traveler, if your ever in Chicago, look me up; i have a weird address but im in the corner of go and fuck-your-self, since you “travel” so much, im sure you’ve heard of it plenty. quite frankly i wouldn’t be surprised if you’ve “been there, done that”. as far as the “sexual themed insults”, well you have your angles and believes and i have mine; i really believe you need to get laid, it does a body good, really good! doesn’t look like you get out much so my advice to you is to go out, get yourself a girl (or guy, or goat, or chicken, or even a melon) and just go to town on that poor (souless[hahaha])sucker. then let us know how that turns out…on second thought, maybe just keep it to your self. hahahahaha. hey by the way, i did a bit of research (yes, i know, it turns out this “unoriginal stupid sophomore” can do research) and as an act of irony, it turns out that the name ‘james” is in fact a biblical name. go figure. after finding that, i looked up the history for “james” and it turns out that it comes from some Greek word that means douche bag. wow jimbo, maybe its time for a name change. by the way, for future references, where the hell(wait, theres no hell right?[hahahaha]) do i get and Brazilian visa? well my biblical friend, i gotz to be goin now, i have things to do, people to see, and places to be. don’t think ill be coming back here so good luck in your quest to being the worlds biggest douche (you have my vote) and remember that laughter is for the soul…wait, souls aren’t real either right? what about angels? cuz man, are they hot!!! imagine a girl with wings!!! oh my god!!! oh crap, there’s no god either right? damn i keep doing it!!! Jesus Christ! (hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha) later days, asshole!!
JESUS #1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHAHAHA
@Danny Wow, you are not only delusional, you are totally insane. Are you an escapee from a mental asylum?
I can understand cowards and liars, the world abounds with them. You are completely on a different planet.
You make up the most outrageous things, then believe them yourself. You make Nick look like a rational, reasonable person conducting a sober intellectual discourse.
Does your family know that you’ve escaped from the “home” and are running loose making wild comments then fleeing like a skunk in the night?
You seem to be seriously disturbed. I a compassionate human being, I urge you to turn yourself in and get back on your medications. Thorazine is your friend.
Look, James. If you really want to talk, then let’s talk. One on one, you and me. No insults, no logic loops. If you want to prove your point, lets prove it. Give me a nice way that we can get in contact with each other in private and we’ll have a nice conversation. I’m getting tired of this back and forth and I feel like it’s time to end this. So we’ll talk and see what each other has to say and settle this in an adult fashion. Sound good?
Oh look, another internet intellectual wasting his potential arguing with strangers in the comments section of a comedy blog post.
Look man, just let it go and live your life. You’re not going to convert anyone anymore than they’re going to convert you. Live and let live.
Stop using religion as a scapegoat for humanity’s crimes against each other.
Not entirely sure if this is directed at me or James x_x.
Well, Anonymouth. I stand behind everything I said about religion. To anyone else, it would be significant that no one has tried to prove it isn’t true.
Or perhaps you are saying the Crusades, the Inquisition, Religious wars, Dark Ages, Witch trials, 9/11, family planning clinic bombings, and all those other atrocities didn’t happen?
You can believe whatever you want. It will not change the facts one bit. Damn pesky facts! They just won’t go away. But I am. I’m tired of dealing with those in “on the river” (De Nial) about so much.
Ok, this just really pissed me off.
first though, I legitimately enjoyed your “anonymouth” thing… I found that very amusing, and if you don’t mind, I may use that in the future. Because it was hilarious.
But secondly, the thing that’s going on here is that you’re so dead set on your… facts… that you can’t acknowledge what anyone else says to you. I know that you “know” that your facts are right, but the people you’re arguing with “know” that THEIR facts are right too. Except they’re able to acknowledge that your intentions behind the things that you say is to disprove what they are saying. You keep saying that no one has even tried to disprove you, yet people have. over and over and over. You just refuse to see that that’s what’s going on. I’m not saying that you have to say that people HAVE disproven you, but people have tried to speak reasonably with you. but you think that it’s just evasions. which honestly, is very silly and ridiculous. At least acknowledge that people have tried to have a conversation with you.
And a while ago, I spoke to you about the crusades, the inquisition and such… I also brought up many things that were brought on by other ideologies that are significantly more awful in number of deaths. I’m not justifying the things done by religion, but I’m saying that you have to admit that other ideologies can be just as bad if not worse.
This is just my question. How did you raise your children? I’m not trying to pick a fight here, I’m just trying to understand. Because theists believe that what they “know” is fact. So when they have kids, they teach them their facts. You did the same thing with your facts. How is what you did any different than what theists do? I know you’re going to say because theists are wrong and you are right, but to theists, YOU’RE wrong and THEY’RE right. So explain that. How did you raise your children without indoctrinating them?
First, thanks for the “anonymouth” comment. Being humorous in writing is very difficult. I have been on a site with writing advice where several of us bemoaned that it was. So when even a little thing succeeds, it is nice feeling.
I stand behind what I said about no one has proven anything I has posted is wrong. Yes, many have disagreed. Some, like you, have spoken reasonably. But disagreeing and doing so reasonably is not proof. Yes, people have had conversations with me. You and Kaemon, for example. Having a reasonable conversation is not proof that anything either person has said was correct or incorrect. One of the things I find most disturbing about theists is that very oven, saying something or hearing something that they like, makes it true.
BTW, when I use the term “theist”, I am referring to anyone with a belief in any god, not just christians. Christians, like many other theists, too often assume everything said that is negative to religion is directed at them personally. To have a rational dialog, that assumption must be discarded.
You are correct about other ideologies, including other religions. I have never said otherwise. Certainly the National Socialists (Nazis) did terrible things in the name of their ideology. That Hitler used parts of his religion to justify it does not automatically condemn all Catholics even though the RCC has much to answer for itself. That does include their support of Hitler and Fascism. I also have photographic and historical proof of that.
How did I raise my children? In two words, “mistrust authority”. That included myself. I played enough deliberate tricks on them that they learned that everything I said was not necessarily true. For example, I taught them to sing “Samuel the red-nosed reindeer”. They did this until the entered kindergarten and learned that Dad was wrong about that. When they confronted me with it, I admitted that “Maybe Dad was wrong. Good thing you checked that out for yourself.” As they grew up I injected more sophisticated lessons in that same fashion. When they wanted a pony, I said, “Sure”. But when they asked “When?” I told them whenever they liked. Just as soon as they could pay for it, had a place to keep it, could feed it, and take care of it. They learned that when someone was agreeable, it didn’t mean they would get what they wanted.
So they grew up knowing that while someone may not deliberately lie to them, that didn’t mean that person was right. “Sincerity does not equal truth.”
I do not recall ever mentioning my atheism to them as such. They were exposed to my own parents Presbyterian church, their mother’s parent’s Catholicism, and the various faiths of different friends. Both are now in their 40s with children of their own and are at least very agnostic. What I indoctrinated my children with was a healthy suspicion of authority. I know that for most theists, everything must be indoctrination unless it is their own brand of brainwashing. That is not the reality. To be a theist. one must accept the impossible, reject facts, and submit without questioning. I am aware that you, nor any other theist will like that statement, but it is the facts. If you read my blog about Universal truths, you would have seen the one that says, “Beliefs no matter how sincerely held, do not alter facts.”
Yes, you can raise children without “indoctrinating them”, unless you call encouraging them to think for themselves and to search for provable evidence “indoctrinating them.” Come to think of it, most theists might think that.
Oh, and it also seems you’re an internet tough-guy. Find a hobby, quit getting mad on the internet.
At least I am tough enough not to hide behind a fake ID. ROFLMA
After talking privatley, James and I have found eachother to be rather agreeable people. We have decided to agree to disagree on the issue at hand and will be leaving this board.
KR is correct. Yes, I agree. We have communicated privately and I hope we continue to do so. We have had a nice chat.
He is an OK guy and I regret my remarks to him.
A message from Nick. This person has tried to post a couple of messages on my blog. I have declined them as a favor to him because I doubted if he really wants the world at large to see what kind of person he is. But, he does keep trying to do it, so maybe he doesn’t mind. Here is his latest, unedited and without comment. His words tell us what kind of person he is better than I can.
“oh, me, oh my….I’m a total jerk? My feelings are so fucking hurt. And I can see you’re trying to do the calm, collected, no-swear-worded reply and making yourself feel good and better than me. Maybe you can put 2 and 2 together and see that I am the same person that also commented on that post and said the same thing to you–that you hide behind your little keyboard and just type things into the comments on some bullshit post which I think is actually pretty cute. Yes, I’m a dude, and yes, I can say cute.
And in my comment on there, did I say anything about your worthlessness to humanity? Ex-FUCKING-‘scuse me, YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE. If you can’t see that your statement is more nazi than mine, then you are TOTALLY FUCKING INSANE….AND BY THE FUCKING WAY, you and your little war against religion, YOU MOTHERFUKER, YOU TELL ME WHO’S THE NAZI IN THIS SITUATION. I’m not. It’s you.
And I would say this to your face and beat your ass while I’m at it. Just come up from Brazil, you shit.
Still reading? Or have you just deleted it already? I don’t even care.”
As I noted to him in a email reply, excessive use of cursing is a sign of a weak mind attempting to express itself forcefully. For that matter so is using all caps for emphasis. What is amusing to me is how he even misspells his cursing. LOL
Lolz at Nick. At least when I try to insult you, I do it properly, right? Haha xD. Just messin with ya.
Yes, you are far more articulate than this Nick character. I am sure he is much older than you but clearly not as intelligent or as well educated. Why do I suspect that, when he talks to people, he spits on them a lot. His outrage must cause a lot of sputtering and splattering. ROFLMAO!
BTW< have you looked at any of the books I sent yet? I think you'll enjoy the Jonathan Kellerman ones. I'm reading other now. If you like them, I'll send some more.
Alright, I’ll check them out. My girlfriend and I went to read in the park yesterday and we found a yardsale. $.25 a book haha. I bought 4 new ones. So I’ll have plenty of reading material xD.
More trash from Nick. This time, I’m including my email reply. I am indenting my reply and enclosing them in [ ] because there’s not much formatting available here. Although I doubt many would have a problem identifying Nick’s ranting.
I am not including his email address. Even though he deserves to be totally outed I will give him that much of a break – so far, anyway.
Nick said:
Okay, dude, I’m so done with this. You are not worth this time. And no, this is not a concession; I am literally done trying to reason with you. So don’t go skipping off to your little friends and start with that “oh, yeah I told him, he’s a pussy” bullshit. I’d love a Brazilian vacation on someone else’s dime, but unfortunately, I’m done with you and your faggot blog comment war (that you started). Yes you did. You did.
[I also knew you would continue with your juvenile insults. “Faggot” is the worst thing you can think of. When did you ever try to reason with anyone. You start off being nasty and have never written one word of truth. I say you are a coward and a liar. Your own words show that you are. You can deny it, but facts are hard to kill.
You’d love a Brazilian vacation, but not if it cost you getting your illusions about being a tough guy broken into bloody rags.
I never denied I started the comment war. Where did you think I said I did not? Unlike you, I take responsibility for my actions and do not run and hide from them.]
I’m never coming back here, so say whatever your heart desires. You will be the only one that will know, and the only one that will care. I am DONE with this and with you. Have a nice life, dick.
A lot of people will know how you are. I’m posting your nasty, comments to the same site. I am sure everyone will enjoy reading your comments. This time, I’m including my reply. Kaemon, not yet even 20, has more integrity and courage than you will ever have. He had the moral courage to contact me directly and we found much mutual ground. You continue to run and hide. Are you ashamed of your conduct? You must be, you are scurrying away like a rat in a sewer.
Go fuck yourself you arrogant chimp-fucking little bastard.
[Ohhh, more original, sophomoric insults. Again, ones you are terrified to make to my face. No one will be surprised at that. Your character, or lack of it is obvious.]
James, I really dont even understand how you can stereotype theists like you do. You say some very stupid comments and say that we are just trying to avoid questions but you are just saying the same things over and over and over and over so I think, THINK, that I speak for the majority of people here and say please, just stop. I am NOT trying to order you around but I just am asking. You most likely wont agree with anything I say but remember that even 15 year olds think you are an asshole (yes that one was meant to be offensive).
Exactly what comments were “stupid”? Just because you didn’t like them, doesn’t make them any less true.
Yes, even 15 year olds can be assholes. Especially when they think they speak for the majority. That’s nothing more than arrogant wishful thinking unless you have proof. I don’t see any proof.
YOu claim I stereotype theists. Then tell me what I have said about them that is not true.
BTW, it’s won’t. Devote more time to school and less to making uninformed comments on the internet. That’s not an order, it’s advice to improve your credibility.
Jesus Christ (yes, I used that intentionally just to make people upset) all this over some silly notes from little kids? Some of these kids will grow up to be theists, some will grow up to be atheists. But as of now, the’re just kids being goofy. No need to read further into this than was intended. Just laugh and move on. No need for an existential crisis. It’s the internet.
I hope i didnt miss james! I’d like to see his take…
Christianity teaches to love each other and the world around us and god above us. Sure each denom. has its own specifics, but the basic teachings of Christianity are to go about life filled with love, and to give love to others. If I don’t do those things, it doesn’t matter how loudly I yell that I am a Christian; If I do not act like a christian, i am not a christian. Its called hypocracy. The worst part is that many atheists and other no-nchristians like you seem to think that these hypocrites are actually reflective of the religion.
just cuz a bird flies around saying its a dog doesnt mean it is a dog, and doesnt give anyone the right to go yell at dogs for having wings [not a great metaphor i know]
ACTUAL DOGS [not just ones who say they are] DONT HAVE WINGS. ACTUAL CHRISTIANS ARE GOOD PEOPLE< AN ACTUAL CHRISTIAN WOULD NEVER TELL ANYONE TO GO TO HELL, OR THAT GOD HATES THEM.
It is so not fair to me to have to be called sick and twisted because i love everyone and everything and i think that there is something more to existence than just what meets the eye [even more than just molecules and atoms and energy] ALL because some assholes are walking around with my name on them. DONT blame religion because people are jerks, people are always jerks, and that has nothing to do with their faith or lack there of.
lastly jimmy boy, what is so wrong with you that you reject good will in any form? youre offended by someone saying bless you? as a christian, i would be happy to attend a service in a mosque or synagog, i would be thankful to anyone who asks whatever god or tree or star or element or ANYTHING anyone believes, to help me. Maybe people are confused about the universe when it comes to religion, but when someone is wishing you well in their own form, it is very arrogant and really just mean to refuse that, to take offense to it. With that mentality, you seem to be the kind of person who would go to thailand and call them disgusting for eating insects, or say that parents who take baths with their kids in 3rd world countries are perverts. Just because it isnt your way means its sick? It's not ok in international travel to behave that way, why would you think its ok to do that in a religious environment? people wish you good will, maybe the delivery method isnt to your liking, but the intention is still the same
You have such anger towards christianity, let me clear something up for you. Any christian you ever knew who was mean or hurtful, offensive, oppressive, obnoxious, arrogant, or shoved it down your throat, wasnt actually a christian. They just called themselves that, but they arent actually one. Just because people say they do things in the name of god, does not actually mean god endorses them. People say alot of shit, you shouldnt let them turn you away from harmless, even helpful ideas.
GOD IS LOVE and there isnt anything wrong with that. If its not love, its not god. so next time a 'christian' tells you youre going to hell, just remember, that isnt god or christianity talking, thats just some guy with identity issues.
rant back quick! ill go get some more popcorn this is getting good 😛
James and I both agreed to leave the forum. But the both of us don’t seem to be following the rules, haha.
I agree with you. You can’t stigmatize a religion because of the bad people involved in said religion.
However, myself being atheist, I view religion as a clever form of controlling a community. And the way you seem to do it is the right way to go about it.
However, religion has lost it’s magic to me. When I started viewing religion as “theology” instead of “religion”, everything became clear to me.
So I appreciate the thought. And I see your point. But the point of James and I have already been made. We have different views on the subject, but it’s time to stop roweling him up.
Your popcorn is stale.
You claim to be a “real christian” but there are plenty of others that would say you, are not because you are not murdering homosexuals, ranting about “socialism” (Christ, if he existed, would have been a flaming socialist)
I never said that every christian I ever met was obnoxious or tried to force their beliefs on me. I have friends who are christians and we get along fine. They are very good people and do practice tolerance and care for others.
What I said was, “Every time I have been cheated, abused, misused, or taken advantage of, it was by a ‘good christian’. That would make anyone a bit wary of a particular group, even if you know they are not all like that. If I substituted “Redhead” for “good christian”, you would not be offended. One must go with the percentages. If you were always cheated by redheads, even though you knew there were honest one in the world, would you be reluctant to do business with redheads?
I suggest you read my blog entry “Does It Matter If Jesus Existed?” (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/10/17/does-it-matter-if-jesus-existed/) Reading that, you will see that we actually agree on some important points. Yes, you have to be a bit selective about the Jesus sayings and choose messages of tolerance “Let him who is without sin cast the first stone” and not “I come not in peace but with a sword” to extract the value from christianity. The actual existence of jesus or god, for that matter, isn’t important. It’s the message that is.
No, I don’t hate god, how can you hate that which has never existed? I do become angry when I see children allowed to die without medical care because the parents are “going to pray for them.”
I become angry when I see family planning clinics bombed and the employees murdered. I don’t like having to pay more taxes because religions do not and their supporters get tax deductions for the donations to them.
I do not like seeing more tax money being spent in promotion of religions under the guise of “faith-based initiatives.”
What people believe is of no importance to me. What people do with those beliefs is important to us all. How would you feel if the Islamic radicals succeed in their plan to take over the world and force their sharia law on everyone? As a woman, you would be the most affected. Forget driving, education, choosing your husband, wearing what you choose, being able to go where you want and always living with the possibility of being stoned to death for any “impurity”.
That’s a result of untrammeled religion. The sad fact is, when christianity ruled most of the known world, it wasn’t much different. It was called “the Dark Ages”.
That’s why I am so adamant about holding religion to a personal level and no making it public policy. Are you aware that in seven US sates that atheists are legally barred from holding public office? Is that a good and fair thing? If the movement towards a theocracy in the USA continues, it will become national law.
You can deny any or all of this, but it doesn’t change the facts. That’s the bad thing about facts, no matter who does or does not believe them, they don’t go away. A very pesky thing those facts.
I just wonder, James, who is really shoving religion down your throat? Are people banging on your door every morning shoving bibles in your face and forcing their religious views upon you? Is your television nothing but an endless sea of bible thumpers telling you that you should believe or burn in a pit of fire? Is every book that you open devoted to making you believe in God? When you go to the grocery store, the gas station, the library are you accosted by those preaching the word of God? I hardly believe that this is such a huge issue in your life that you have to be such an incredible asshole about a few cute little messages on a humorous website. Shame on you for turning this into stump to spout your incredibly arrogant ramblings. I can go on for months and never have the subject of religion come up in my life, only what goes on within my own thoughts. You chose to begin this dialogue and then berate everyone that doesn’t agree with you. You, sir, are what is wrong with this world, not because of what you believe, but how you treat others. Most (not all), of the responses to you were from people who wanted to understand your beliefs and why you believe that. Kaitlyn, for instance, was intrigued by you and had some very good points for you to debate, and you totally turned tail and ran. You pick and chose your fights like a child, it is laughable. I would have respect for you if you had proven anything to me, but all you proved is what an incredible jerk you are. If you are an atheist, then religious “law” does not apply to you, so why is it an issue to you? You seem to be so concerned about the starving children of the world, then you should be concentrating your efforts on aide to them, as my church has done for many, many years. What have you done to help them? How much do you donate to assist them every year? Your bullshit does not fill their bellies, but the dollars my church sends does. I would guess that you are so self-absorbed that you haven’t done a damn thing but run your mouth….good for you, buddy.
First of all, learn what is a paragraph and when to use them. Then your post will not look like a rambling jumble of nonsensical words. Oh wait. it IS a rambling jumble of nonsensical words.
You clearly know nothing about the religious reich attempting to turn the USA into a totalitarian theocracy. But, from your post, you don’t seem to know much about anything.
I “turned tail and ran”? When? From what? Just because you say it, doesn’t make it true.
Again, you don’t understand the difference between beliefs and knowledge. Beliefs are unsupported by facts and often held in the face of contradictory evidence. Knowledge is supported by independently verifiable facts. Beliefs are simply another word for “faith”.
As far as supporting children, what do you know about that? FYI, I help support a creche here for poor children. I eschew christmas presents for my own family to donate the money to providing them with things like milk, clothes, toys, and food. My family understands this and also send me money to contribute. That’s from a bunch of godless, evil atheists. But you are so prejudiced that you form your opinions without knowing anything.
You are a disgusting example of a human being. I will pick a fight with you because I will enjoy breaking you intellectually and ethically.
You are a liar, a fool, and a hypocrite.
I have no respect for you and never will. What a jerk you are and you wallow in it like the sick little idiot you are.
Prove that one word you have said is true or prove that anything I have said is not.
aw i must say im a bit disappointed :[ darn you copy and paste!
but furthermore, i would be just as offended if u said redheads, or jews, or anything i’m not. even more so because im used to uninformed people bashing my religion. its not right in any circumstance to judge a group or religion or tribe or anything based on the circumstances of the people in such a group that i met. if u had met a bunch of stupid blacks, wouldn’t it be wrong for you to feel that the majority of blacks are stupid? we have to overcome our instincts to judge others. its true anyone can claim to be a good christian and then go around killing others, but aren’t you stupid for believing that they’re good Christians then? yeah there are alot of lines in the bible you can pull out that endorse bad things, i’m sure there’s a line about killing gays, but as anyone should objectively read a text, they should also take into account the time period. For example devout baptists never dance or touch a deck of cards. when the denomination was being formed in america, the only cards you played were to gamble, and you only danced in saloons. do you honestly think a god who’s texts [read the lines in red basically] would iono damn a child for playing go fish? of course not! true, religion has been a way to control the masses, not always for the worse. but you know what? doesn’t government do the same thing? i don’t see you bitching about that and that is WAY worse. it was just the smarter person to use an all-powerful being to control people. I consider myself a good christian because i open my heart to god and to others, and i put love for ALL kinds of people first. I don’t go to church, i took a class on the bible [literature class not religion] but really didn’t read the whole thing. there is no way that the social institution of religion is controlling me. my parents are very different kinds of christian, we tried going to church but found alot of the people at the specific churches around us to be bigots and hypocrites, so we don’t go, but it didn’t stop me from being christian, blaming the entire institution of the religion just because 4 churches i’ve spent a year each at were filled with jerks. you seem to assume that every [or many if this will be your hangup] christian supports the things being done in the name of Christianity. no i don’t think its right that atheists should be banned from public office, tho any of them like you should be, but any religious zealot [of any religion mine included] should be kept from it too. and i know that’s not the way things are but yes politics should be separate from religion in a country that spouts its freedoms. but just as an american i don’t support a TON of things this country does in the name of freedom, i know its not actually for freedom… think iraq
you’re a good target to talk to, because you are inappropriate and overly angry. you’re tired of people shoving their religion down your throat but you came here and commented just to receive that. the psychologist in me thinks your so angry because you’re denying what you feel to be true on some level but you’re rejecting it so hard! moot point because you might be incapable of change, but you know what you were getting yourself into when you wrote your first comment. its a fool who throws himself into a pit of hungry lions and is angered when they eat him. you make the comments you make when they are not called for, to incite a reaction of people, piss some of them off, and then use their heated arguments as ammunition and support for you ideas. ahh.. the internet. that being said, i don’t care what happens with your religious views, but as a person maybe you need to do some internal reflecting. as it stands, im tired of people shoving their ideas [even atheism] down my throat as well. im tired of people leaving me pamphlets on how im going to hell in a tip jar at work. im tired of going to comic conventions and having people at the christian convention next door trying to save me. but im smart enough to know that that is that individual, and yes maybe that individual may be leading a church, but he or she is NOT leading the religion. i only ask that you be strong enough in your nonfaith to look at the amazing world around you, from the tiny and complex blade of grass to the function of ecosystems, and think that maybe, just maybe, something could have started this. do you ever think about what came before the big bang? or why it would have banged in the first place? because i spent alot of time thinking that what we see is all there is. i am happy to come to the realization that there is more, because honestly? this world sucks and if this is all there is ill just kill myself now and save the trouble. im sure you’d like to help :]
also i didnt say you said every christian, i said ANY christian you met who did do those things.
lastly… yes u can use history to point out a lot of bad things done when Christians ruled the world. don’t assume Christianity the faith has that goal, just because some churches and individuals do. you keep finding examples of people being stupid and then saying the religion wants people to be stupid. and you aren’t being a bit wary, you’re being a full on bigot. you also seem to be basing alot of your arguments on american christianity.
anyways… i gota go eat breakfast. haters gona hate. i hope you stop trolling websites, but hey you got to feel important for a few weeks. look at how many people talked to you! i mean wow! its almost like people cared enough about you to hate you :] good for you man! keep on keepin on <3
You read things, but only see what you want to believe. That’s so sad, but so common. I give you the same challenge everyone else had avoided. Prove one word I have written is not true.
Also, I am far from uniformed about christianity, but it makes you feel justified in your opinion to say I am not.
All you have done is to demonstrate that you are as intolerant, prejudiced, and ignorant and so many others on here. How do you expect me to treat you respectfully when all you do is bash me, my statements, and everything I stand for without one shred of roof? What you are doing is nothing more than earning yourself contempt and derision. Enjoy it, that’s all you’re going to get until you do something intelligent.
What makes me feel important is not trashing morons like you, but helping others like the creche for disadvantage infants I mentioned elsewhere. I always feel at my best when I am doing something for others. Dialog with people like you makes me feel sick that there are so many ignorant assholes in the world.
I’ll be one of the few ones to actually comment on the letters to god from these adorable children. ADORABLE. Ya morons should really take your theological and philosophical discussions to the appropriate place, and this is NOT it.
Wow this has gone on for along time.
“I don’t need a job, I am successfully retired form several careers. I have more friends that you will ever have”
lolololllllllllllllllllooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooollololloloololloolloloolololololllllllllllllllllllllolololololollolol
What is this? Another insightful, intelligent, well-substantiated comment? Al that is missing is the usual, “fuck you” I get from the typical mentally disturbed individual like you.
Everything I said is true. Everything you said is incredibly stupid.
Ha ha, this has made me laught a lot!
Five bucks says that James is just a borde person with nothing to occupy his time so he pulls up a slightly religious artical and starts insulting people for kicks.
Sad way to spend your time…but hey, each to his own!
Have fun with your life!
*Clicks the Stumble button*
First, it’s “bored”.
Next, I stated nothing but the truth and not one person has ever been able to demonstrate otherwise.
No, I am not “borde”. If you bothered to learn anything about me, you would know better. But, like so many here, you like to have an opinion even when you know nothing about the subject.
Perhaps before you spout of again and make yourself appear even more ignorant, you learn a little first. I’ve posted on here different places where you can learn more about me and even contact me directly.
Only one person here has had the ethical stones to do so. Sadly, he is one of the youngest on here and has made the rest of you look like very sad excuses for intelligent people.
Speaking of a sad way to use your time, making yourself look like an uneducated. semi-literate person that can’t even use a spell checker is pretty depressing.
james is just trollin’ it up. The only way to deal with a troll is to ignore him or her.
I just love when people get in giant online fights about absolute bullshit. Especially when it’s right beneath a bunch of pics of kids being cute. Keep it up guys.
aww cmon now, it was way to entertaining not to take part in! and tman youre def right 😛
Honestly, this debate has become even more amusing than the actual letters.
I just, really, really, have to say:
LOL @ this guy James for being a big enough douche and single handedly keeping this thread going for so long.
and also
LOL @ the people that actually replied, trying to shove their views down his throat and using so many unnecessary methapors my old lit. text might just throw up and
LOL @ people that replied in pretty much, essays, trying to prove their intellectual superiority? less is more, your 10 page papers don’t make you any better than him. and he only needed a few sentences to trigger this.
and also LOL @ the opposite side, that sicced a “psychiatrist” on him. he may or may not be an actual psych, and if so props cus its hard to major in that, but if not, then LMAO, you think watching a few episodes of Dr. Phil entitles you to post ridiculous psychobabble like that?
This is a fun conversation, and as i am filled to the brim with ignorance and bigoted ideas, I want in too.
on a side note : These letters are adorable!!!! kids can be so unpredictably cute sometimes.
Yal’ll…. cant we all just stop arguing on religion and disrespect other people’s beliefs. they can believe in whatever the heck they want to.I bet James is some lonely jerk who has nothing better to argue about the stupidest things.This is just an abdorable little collection of kids letters to god. No one cares if youre reading it and thinks its stupid. It was written by kids!! who the heck cares if they wanted a puppy over a brother! Its just shown to make you smile about little cute kids.No one has to make a big deal about this.
YOu want me to respect something that has not earned any respect? When respect is demanded instead of earned, it’s an admission that while, desired, nothing has been done to earn respect.
You know nothing about me but that doesn’t keep you from spouting an uniformed, totally ignorant opinion, does it? But ignorant and uninformed is what you have repeatedly demonstrated yourself to be. No, I have no respect for you, either.
James I’m wondering how anyone actually captured you smiling for your lovelllly picture.
I’m going to offer you some free advice here. I think you’re at the age where life has got you down. Go buy a boat. Get yourself a fishing rod. Venture out to sea and sort out all your little problems inside.
You never know, you may see some of the many wonders of God’s Earth… Like sunshine, it can really light up your life.
As for the main purpose of this stumble, those stories did make me chuckle. Nearly as much as James did.
First, your assumptions are as wrong as your religion.
Life has not “got me down”. I am in terrific health thanks to a reasonable exercise program and rational eating habits. I live in the best climate in the world. I feel this way because I have lived in eight states in the USA, some of them more than once, Quebec, Holland, and now Brazil. It also helps that I do not have the stress of any fake religion in my life and have not since I was 13.
There’s something truly liberating about thinking for yourself and not accepting fairy tales and outright lies foisted upon you by those with no interest other than controlling what you think, do, and say while relieving you of cash and resources of time and energy.
FYI, my handle and email address is Slrman as in “Sailorman”. I have owned many boats and lived on them. In addition, I have sailed all over the world for pleasure and doing deliveries of sailboats.
There is no god and you bible-thumpers delight in offending those of us who are rational enough to recognize this.
I have seen many wonders of nature but not one bit of evidence there is any god of any kind. It requires a special type of obstinate ignorance to accept that belief.
I have lots of pictures of me smiling and, unlike you, I have a real life that is very pleasant and give me many reasons to smile.
For one thing, I do not live my life in fear of offending some imaginary deity and condemning myself to an eternity of torment.
Yes, you do live in fear. One of the most common statements in Christendom is “Fear God”. Why do you have to fear a “loving god”?
Even better, I do not depend on a system of rewards and punishments to do the right thing. I do the right thing because it is the right thing to do and, in my experience, will benefit others as well as myself. I have written about this in my blog, (http://slrman.wordpress.com/2010/08/02/ethics/) which none of you theists like to read because it demonstrates that a person can be good without god and many are.
BTW, remember the old saying about “Free advice is worth what you pay for it.” Thank you for demonstrating that it is true.
I agree with you James. Religion is crap and should never be considered a good thing.
Is it really so bad to have hope for something other than just this life? That there is someone who is watching over us all? James, I don’t claim to stand for all of those with religion…and I certainly wont insult you for your beliefs…but I’d like to ask that you stop insulting others for theirs? Just…agreeing to disagree? Sound good?
Oh my. After reading maybe halfway through this comments section, then heading down to the bottom and seeing that James, you are still commenting, I can only admire your persistence.
Yet, you continuously bring up the ‘fact’ that nobody on this site has yet to prove you wrong.
I’m sorry to inform you, but they have. Actually you did. The minute you commented on the site itself proved yourself wrong.
I’m sure you’re dying to know why, and I wont keep you in suspense any longer. Earlier you said the following:
“I have said many times, what others believe is not important to me. It’s when they try to pass those belief into law and restrict my freedom of speech thought, and action that it matters. Unfortunately that’s exactly what religion, all religions do. It’s what I see here and everywhere.”
What you see EVERYWHERE? Are you claiming to be omnipotent? I can bet on my life that you have not seen every single religion in practice, in every single place in the world. So there’s an awfully exaggerated statement to match yours. That’s just a technicality though, the reason that that quoation is even up there is becuase you say that what others believe is not important to you, until they try and restrict your freedom. What about this website is trying to restrict YOUR freedom? Nothing. You are FREE to leave it whenever you choose. You are free to ignore it to your fullest. Yo are even FREE to come onto this site and post atrocious accusations against anyone that thinks differently from you in the comments section of a cute post. SO it is evident to me that your statement that “what others believe is not important to me” is so blatently false, that you have to come back on here to argue with others about what they BELIEVE.
Oh, and the person who imitated you and ‘apologized’ on your behalf was genius. Actually made my day.
Additionally, I know you will refute this. I’m sure in an impeccable manner, coming out on top again, maybe you’ll start citing some of those authors you mentioned earlier. Honestly, that doesn’t even matter to me, what does matter is how childishly you acted on this site. I hope you realized that you bickered with 14 YEAR OLD kids. They haven’t even had a chance to form their opionions fully yet-and you attacked them. It’s great that you try and help kids and donate and whatnot, but who you are on the internet is an important reflection of who you truly are. And I’d really like to think that a retired (presumably older) man could do better than to argue with children, seeing as you wouldn’t do that in real life. Or maybe you do. Who knows, you obviously seem to have too much time on your hands. That is apparent to anyone who bothers to glance at the comments here.
Anyways, I know you’re probably happy I rose to your bait, because straight and simple, you are a s**t disturber. You enjoy getting people riled up. In reality, writing this out for everyone to see has made me feel 1000 times better though, and unlike you, I will never return to this site, so your oh-so-clever retort will fall on deaf ears:)
After that, I’m sure someone else will prove you wrong too.
Enjoy, and have a great, wonderful, sunny day everyone!
James, James, James…
Shut the fuck up, prick.
Also, typos are innocent. But you’re consistently making the same one.
Proofreading is great you know.
Small children are adorable.
I came across this on stumbleupon so there’s a good chance I won’t ever come back to this but I thought I’d leave a reply anyway.
I find it odd that for almost a month people have been arguing back and forth on here over a post that was meant to be cute by showing the way children think sometimes. What was supposed to be used for a good laugh has resulted in feelings of hatred towards others.
Now, I am a Christian but I never consider my faith a religion and I never will. As a matter of fact, I dislike the way religion is portrayed in today’s society. I consider myself a follower of Christ as any Christian should. I’ll agree with James on one point and that’s that religion does cause a lot of problems in the world today and there has been a lot of religious based fighting. But I think that it is important to realize that these issues aren’t caused by Christians or Muslims or any other faith as a whole. The problems caused by religious groups are many times caused by extremists or people who are just ignorant. As a Christian it’s sad to see groups such as the Wesboro Church picket funerals and bash homosexuals. Acts like this don’t represent other churches well and it gives a bad name to Christians, just like terrorists give a bad reputation to a lot of Muslims. I have quite a few Muslim friends I went to college with and if you take the time to really talk about what their beliefs are like it’s the polar opposite of how terrorists act.
I get that everyone has their own opinion and stance on different topics, but just arguing and bashing others doesn’t prove anybody’s point and when others start reading posts like all of these on here everything comes across as being ignorant. The problem with discussions like these is that no matter how intelligent or well-supported someone’s argument is it doesn’t come across that way, which is why this post is just a general statement instead of trying to point out someone else’s faults. To call someone an idiot for what they believe is just ignorant because all it’s based on is the fact that that person doesn’t agree with you. So what if people have opinions. Why waste time arguing about something that won’t change? Everyone’s thoughts deserve to be respected as long as it’s not aimed at another person in malice.
Well, that’s all. Hope anyone who reads this will enjoy.
ONLY on the internet could a heated debate start over something that was posted initially to be funny.
I am replying to myself. Because I’m not done talking. This has legitimately made my day. I LOVE it when people on the internet argue. It’s so awesome. I mean, I was having a pretty good day already, but reading through a bunch of these comments and responding to a few has been great fun. Nothing can compare to; after a hard day of school or work; sitting in front of a computer and reading people get all worked up over everything in the world. Ok, a lot of other things are easily better than this, but you know what I mean, this is pretty damn hilarious.
I of course mean no offense to anyone, as clearly I am here commenting just like the rest of you.
Cheers,
Amused
James, you seem to be a bit misunderstood by a lot of people on here and I’m sorry for that. But I think that I understand what you’re saying.. You are an atheist-which is completely fine-who doesn’t care what peoples beliefs are just so long as they don’t force them unto you. And I agree with you completely on that. I happen to believe in God..but I understand where your coming from. So often I see people who just won’t stop trying to make people see and think what they see and think. I agree with you again on how laws souldn’t be based on religion..like the whole gay marriage thing. (I’m all for it in fact.)I too get angry that terrible things happen in this world. And I think that most people would have no problem with you being an atheist, it’s just that I think people just didn’t like how you phrased your views. But James I really love that you stuck to what you believe, what you think, despite not even your parents supporting you. I admire you in fact. Not so many people would be able to do that, and I hope you continue encouraging people who have just recently expressed themselves to be atheists like you mention before. Not letting people get to us in something we all have to learn but few of us have..including me. So have a great rest of the summer! Bye!
P.S- to everyone else out there..maybe just take a minute to understand his thinking before you shoot him down. And really no need for profanities. 🙂
I don’t think it’s that they enjoy shooting him down for his beliefs, I think it’s more that his first comment for such a cute website was something so violent and kind of unnecessary. These kids weren’t trying to shove christianity down his throat.
Funny thing is.. the “kids” writing those notes were actually 47 years old. Silly Christians, lolololol.
these are cute and funny. i think its really immature that adults who stumble onto this site are arguing about religion and their views. this is not the place for it
Christians, all,… please take a minute to question yourself when you say things like “Entitled to your own opinion/beliefs.” Why is this phrase even mentioned in debates? What does it even mean to you? It is a phrase that is in direct contradiction to Truth. Sure it seems to calm things down in a debate and makes it seem like you are on one another’s side, but it excuses the fact that absolute truth exists. I say enough with using subjective phrases to counter arguments. Instead, counter with truth, spoken in love and kindness. And if you don’t know the truth in order to counter arguments intelligently…..GO FIGURE IT OUT!!! Stop making a philosophical fool of Christianity (which is exactly what some are instigating here).
THIS FIGHT IS STUPID! for as long as religion has been, there have been stupid fights, where they yell at each other because “Atheists are arrogant and dismissive of others”, and then the Atheists reply back with the SAME EXACT THING, “Theists are arrogant and dismissive of others”.
Why does your religion have to say what your personality must be?
In what way is this site shoving ANYTHING down your throat?
I don’t believe in god, but these letters are still so cute!
Believe what you want, but being an Atheist is NOT the cause of arrogance.
And neither is being a theist.
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?”
Epicurus – Greek philosopher, BCE 341-270
Stumbled onto this, and i actually enjoyed watching all you argue 😀 it was fun
James… at the beginning, people were being cordial to you and you responded with only hate and bigotry. In the middle, people were being cordial and reasonable to you about your beliefs, and advised you to calm down a little in order to avoid much more hate. You responded with prejudice, assumptions, and trying to shove your believes down their throats. In the end, people were getting tired of your blatant hypocrisy as you accused theists of doing precisely the things you were doing: Forcing other people to accept your beliefs, not listening to other people, correcting typos instead of responding, being offensive and arrogant, and most of all hating. You are a hate-filled individual and you express that hate by accusing others of hate.
For all our sakes, think about life a bit. Try to be more accepting. Stumble on ‘quotes’ a bit.
And most of all, don’t accuse me of being a hater and a theist and telling you what to do. It’s perfectly acceptable to be an atheist and to hate on people: I’m just trying to be helpful. I know how it feels to have hate and only hate inside of myself. I know how much it brings down your mood, and I’m trying to help you by giving you tips, cordially, so as to help you become a happy person again. I’m being polite and cordial, merely stating the facts, as you say that you yourself do, and expect a polite and cordial response in return. Can you please just think back on your hypocrisy? You don’t have to rethink your beliefs or renounce atheism or anything stupid like that. Just pause for a moment, read your responses over, and realize how angry and hate-filled and prejudiced you sounded while you were accusing christians of being angry and hate-filled and prejudiced.
Children are always honest.
Everyone, shut up and get laid. .-.
lol is all I have to say over pretty much this whole argument…
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